Electric fuel pump or not

if I haven't used my landy for two or three weeks it takes ages to start, it seems to be fuel starvation. The problem is worse in this recent hot weather. I reckon the petrol in the float chamber is evaporating off and it then takes the mechanical pump a while to fill it. Therefore, I'm toying with the idea of fitting an electrical fuel pump. So, a few questions. If I go ahead, should the old mechanical pump be left in place or removed and blanked off? What is the best electric pump to get? And, where should I mount it? I'd like to put it somewhere accessible preferably.

Col

May be that valves worn in lift pump are allowing fuel to return to the tank.To check, pump the manual lever BEFORE attempting a start.If it goes straight away there,s your problem.
Did once fit an electric pump to a Trialer leaving the original in place,but we were feeding a V8.

tottot said:

May be that valves worn in lift pump are allowing fuel to return to the tank.To check, pump the manual lever BEFORE attempting a start.If it goes straight away there,s your problem.
Did once fit an electric pump to a Trialer leaving the original in place,but we were feeding a V8.

Click to expand...

Good suggestion Tottot, I'll try pumping it by hand.


Col

I have a facet pump on the S1 mounted on the wing with push fittings. Left the old lift pump in place To cover the hole. These are interrupter pumps so run fast until carb is full then slow down. No return needed.
Also I do on my 300tdi have a facet pump in line(for emergency) & the lift pump pulls through this no problem.

Facet do some nice small solid state pumps( little squared items)

is it the type with contact points?

iirc sometimes you just need to replace those and the pump is as good as new.

burlen do kits for theirs I think

Facet pumps are great; I have a 'Posi Flo' type on mine which pumps veg oil to my 200 Di. For a petrol engine make sure to get a low pressure delivery type: 2 or 3psi. Remember the 'Malpassi' fuel pressure regulators? They were intended to reduce delivery pressure to the carb down to a steady pressure of around 2psi. That's the sort of pressure to aim for. Also, remember that the Facet ideally needs to be as close to the fuel tank as possible. Most of them are recommended to only lift to a maximum of about 30 cm, (12"). This is impossible in a Land Rover and they do work just fine if further away, mine has to suck up about 5 feet of pipe and through a sedimenter and it manages perfectly. Once it's primed it'll work ok. Somebody I know converts diesel VW microbuses and the like to run on veg oil and he often mounts the Facet at the opposite end of the vehicle to the fuel tank and he has no problems with getting them to prime and work. Be sure to fit the filter attachment before the pump, it protects the pump from debris.

Extreedoc said:

Facet pumps are great; I have a 'Posi Flo' type on mine which pumps veg oil to my 200 Di. For a petrol engine make sure to get a low pressure delivery type: 2 or 3psi. Remember the 'Malpassi' fuel pressure regulators? They were intended to reduce delivery pressure to the carb down to a steady pressure of around 2psi. That's the sort of pressure to aim for. Also, remember that the Facet ideally needs to be as close to the fuel tank as possible. Most of them are recommended to only lift to a maximum of about 30 cm, (12"). This is impossible in a Land Rover and they do work just fine if further away, mine has to suck up about 5 feet of pipe and through a sedimenter and it manages perfectly. Once it's primed it'll work ok. Somebody I know converts diesel VW microbuses and the like to run on veg oil and he often mounts the Facet at the opposite end of the vehicle to the fuel tank and he has no problems with getting them to prime and work. Be sure to fit the filter attachment before the pump, it protects the pump from debris.

Click to expand...

Great advice, thanks. Ideally, I'd like to fit the pump in the engine bay with a filter before and after. I'll get on eBay today and track a facet pump down.

Col

Colthebrummie said:

Great advice, thanks. Ideally, I'd like to fit the pump in the engine bay with a filter before and after. I'll get on eBay today and track a facet pump down.

Col

Click to expand...

Mine is under the centre seat panel on a rubber mounting... makes it quiet.

Extreedoc said:

Mine is under the centre seat panel on a rubber mounting... makes it quiet.

Click to expand...

I have the twin fuel tanks with the tank change over switch fitted on the seat box so that might be a good area to mount the pump, easy access to the fuel pipes. Hopefully I'll connect it to the right one.

Col

If you get the can size pump there is a filter on the bottom which may need cleaning every few years

Hicap phill said:

If you get the can size pump there is a filter on the bottom which may need cleaning every few years

Click to expand...

I've ordered a solid state one with a removable filter. Very cheap and pretty small, as Extreedoc says, they recommend mounting low down below the level of fuel but we'll see how it goes. The one I ordered is rated at 4-6psi, hope that's not too much.

Col

Colthebrummie said:

...The one I ordered is rated at 4-6psi, hope that's not too much.Col

Click to expand...

If it is you can always get a Malpassi to dial the pressure down a bit... Problem is, the Malpassis used to be reasonably cheap and affordable but now they are too expensive. I think there are cheaper alternatives though...?
If the pressure is too high, fuel can get forced past the closed needle valve in the carb causing flooding or rich running.

Extreedoc said:

If it is you can always get a Malpassi to dial the pressure down a bit... Problem is, the Malpassis used to be reasonably cheap and affordable but now they are too expensive. I think there are cheaper alternatives though...?
If the pressure is too high, fuel can get forced past the closed needle valve in the carb causing flooding or rich running.

Click to expand...

You're not kidding, they are 5 or 6 times the price of the pump. I'll see how it goes, if I need one, I'll get it.

Col

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/SYTEC-PRO-...ograss-motorsport/1829433404?iid=263818165114
This is more like it...

Extreedoc said:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/SYTEC-PRO-...ograss-motorsport/1829433404?iid=263818165114
This is more like it...

Click to expand...

Yes, I spotted that one but at £27. About half the price of many others so if needed, that'll be the one I go for. My issue is that whilst my landy is very scruffy looking, it's pretty original and I'm inclined to only upgrade where necessary. At least an electric pump and regulator are easy to remove if a future owner wants to go back to the Stone Age.

Col

I'm not a fan of mechanical fuel pumps; they break down with no warning... I've only ever broken down up the road twice in any motor and both times it was a mechanical pump failure.

Colthebrummie said:

if I haven't used my landy for two or three weeks it takes ages to start, it seems to be fuel starvation. The problem is worse in this recent hot weather. I reckon the petrol in the float chamber is evaporating off and it then takes the mechanical pump a while to fill it. Therefore, I'm toying with the idea of fitting an electrical fuel pump. So, a few questions. If I go ahead, should the old mechanical pump be left in place or removed and blanked off? What is the best electric pump to get? And, where should I mount it? I'd like to put it somewhere accessible preferably.

Col

Click to expand...

I know its a bit late in the day but just thought I'd let people know it can be done!
Just in the process of fitting an electric fuel pump to my 109.
Knocked up a bracket to mount an SU ( puller type pump ) in the engine bay. same type as fitted to the old morris minor
discard the original petrol lift pump and pipe to the carb, blank off the hole but also retain a water trap in the same position.
the pipe from the tank will screw into the water trap inlet and the outlet will rise up to the fuel pump inlet positioned on the bulkhead.........The outlet of the pump then routed round to the carb and job done bar the electric wiring........the pump has an earth tag and will need a Live from the ignition either wired through the oil light switch or via an Inertia switch which in case of a crash will cut off the electrics to the pump.
This is the way I have done it not necessarily the only way or the best way, as we all know there are more than one way to skin a cat so you can do it your own way, I just thought I'd let people know that it's possible............the pictures were taken during the installation so don't ask where the fuel pipes are. lol!

Not sure I understand the question. Why worry? Buy the cheapest you can find on eBay. Only it's not like you're putting too much demand on it, is it? Electric saves the faff of the mech. lift pump. Pump is a pump is a pump. I'd have sited it nearer the tank, more so if it's a rear tank 109. You can pay £150 if you like. That SU is nice but doubt it's necessary. Mine was £20.

109SeriesIIA said:

Not sure I understand the question. Why worry? Buy the cheapest you can find on eBay. Only it's not like you're putting too much demand on it, is it? Electric saves the faff of the mech. lift pump. Pump is a pump is a pump. I'd have sited it nearer the tank, more so if it's a rear tank 109. You can pay £150 if you like. That SU is nice but doubt it's necessary. Mine was £20.

Click to expand...

The first electric pump I fitted was a cheap one, like a square Facet, but not... It leaked within a few weeks of fitting. The Facets aren't that much dearer (unless things have changed) and IMO are worth the extra.