Diag needed help

I've got a 98 L series FL with an interesting idle. I'm yet to solve this month's old issue. Has anyone in Cornwall got a Hawkeye diagnostic or something similar and the associated knowledge I could borrow for some beer or a couple of Bob?????

I live in Helston and work in Truro but would be willing to travel.

Failing that it's gonna cost me £50 at a LR specialist

from what I gather they are no use to you your car is too early I tried one on my wife's car a 1998 freelander 1800 and nothing. and I was told the car was not compliant.

Hawkye will communicate with the L Series "computers" - but I'm not sure what info you'll get from it, the L Series ECU is very basic.

I'm in Cornwall but only have an I930. I'm not sure it'll read L series ECUs or will show any codes. As GG said, the L series ECU isn't very advanced.
What's the engine doing?

Just read your other posts. It could be something to do with fuel pump feedback to the ECU.

i930 will talk to the L Series Bosch EDU as well. Don't know if it can check all the things the Hawkeye can.

GrumpyGel said:

i930 will talk to the L Series Bosch EDU as well. Don't know if it can check all the things the Hawkeye can.

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Good to know that it talks to the ECU. I've no idea what parameters it'll show however.

Have already go a thread going on the issue with some really good advice but no solution as of yet but I will some it up

Erratic idle. Like to sit at approx 1100 rpm
Sometimes rises randomly to 2000 rpm
Reluctance to drop revs when clutch disengaged. Happens regularly

CEL illumination when under v light throttle (cruising) with complete loss of power. If throttle positing maintained then CEL continues with loss off power. If throttle increased then CEL goes out with power being re gained. Can sometimes give a ' kangaroo' effect

GrumpyGel said:

i930 will talk to the L Series Bosch EDU as well. Don't know if it can check all the things the Hawkeye can.

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Hi GG
I emailed iCarsoft re the 930 a while back about it's functionality when used with the L series and basically they said they do no recommend it for the L series .... they coudn't or wouldn't supply any details at all apart from the 'it is not recommended' statement. (what it CAN actually read and display I have no idea. It would be interesting to actually try one on an L series as they seem ok for later vehicles.)
The hawkeye, if it can read as much as the Lynx, will be able to read every parameter that you need. It is all there in the DCU on the L series.
The ecu can give data about every sensor input and every actuator output. The Lynx can certainly read and display them all - I have no reason to think the hawkeye unit cannot interpret the same data. It is nice to be able to use laptop though - a much larger work area and up to 8 live data streams at a time.
Joe

Joe_H said:

Hi GG
I emailed iCarsoft re the 930 a while back about it's functionality when used with the L series and basically they said they do no recommend it for the L series .... they coudn't or wouldn't supply any details at all apart from the 'it is not recommended' statement. (what it CAN actually read and display I have no idea. It would be interesting to actually try one on an L series as they seem ok for later vehicles.)
The hawkeye, if it can read as much as the Lynx, will be able to read every parameter that you need. It is all there in the DCU on the L series.
The ecu can give data about every sensor input and every actuator output. The Lynx can certainly read and display them all - I have no reason to think the hawkeye unit cannot interpret the same data. It is nice to be able to use laptop though - a much larger work area and up to 8 live data streams at a time.
Joe

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Just shows you what a mine field diag stuff is. I've seen i930 'sales' videos where they happily promote connectivity to L Series Freelander, then you get that feedback from them!

I'm sure people on here have used i930 on the L Series - but they're probably happy checking and clearing ABS lights and not necessarily digging to far into the EMS data.

@Nodge68
If possible can you give me a ring/txt this afternoon so we can arrange for me to pop up your way. Try your diag. Got a few beers in it for you
Cheers
Luke

@Bluey89 Remove your phone number mate and send @Nodge68 a Pm.
You never know who'll get hold of it
Mike

Bluey89 said:

@Nodge68
If possible can you give me a ring/txt this afternoon so we can arrange for me to pop up your way. Try your diag. Got a few beers in it for you
Cheers
Luke

Click to expand...

I'll call you later

Ok. I had the opportunity to look at this misbehaving (sorry Joe ) L series. For the record, the Icarsoft I930 doesn't, repeat doesn't connect to the EDC.

The fault is a strange one. Idles at the correct speed most of the time. However the engine speed suddenly increases to ~2000Rpm for a couple of minutes, before returning to normal idle speed.
Luke (the owner) also reported that the revs hang high between gear changes. This makes smooth changes difficult, especially in traffic. So all you L series experts. What's the likely cause of this L series problem?
It's got me stumped.
Cheers

Nodge68 said:

Ok. I had the opportunity to look at this misbehaving (sorry Joe ) L series. For the record, the Icarsoft I930 doesn't, repeat doesn't connect to the EDC.

The fault is a strange one. Idles at the correct speed most of the time. However the engine speed suddenly increases to ~2000Rpm for a couple of minutes, before returning to normal idle speed.
Luke (the owner) also reported that the revs hang high between gear changes. This makes smooth changes difficult, especially in traffic. So all you L series experts. What's the likely cause of this L series problem?
It's got me stumped.
Cheers

Click to expand...

Hi Nodge, that is in line with the reply I got from iCarsoft - that they 'do not support or recommend the i930 for the L series'

I would suspect TPS as first port of call Nodge.
quite often a 'failure' of a part will cause a money light, however, a part that gives an incorrect reading but has NOT FAILED will simply cause an incorrect reaction.
There is a switch on the TPS that is an idle sensor and also over run sensor - a back probe on that may be useful. It would fit with your symptoms. It is a digital 0 or 12 V signal. The TPS may also be 'slightly' captain cooked
Ideally one should get a lynx lol
Joe

Joe_H said:

Hi Nodge, that is in line with the reply I got from iCarsoft - that they 'do not support or recommend the i930 for the L series'

I would suspect TPS as first port of call Nodge.
quite often a 'failure' of a part will cause a money light, however, a part that gives an incorrect reading but has NOT FAILED will simply cause an incorrect reaction.
There is a switch on the TPS that is an idle sensor and also over run sensor - a back probe on that may be useful. It would fit with your symptoms. It is a digital 0 or 12 V signal. The TPS may also be 'slightly' captain cooked
Ideally one should get a lynx lol
Joe

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That's what Nodge thought at 1st but after looking my TPS has no idle switch. In the end we thought either TPS or HPFP

Joe_H said:

Hi Nodge, that is in line with the reply I got from iCarsoft - that they 'do not support or recommend the i930 for the L series'

I would suspect TPS as first port of call Nodge.
quite often a 'failure' of a part will cause a money light, however, a part that gives an incorrect reading but has NOT FAILED will simply cause an incorrect reaction.
There is a switch on the TPS that is an idle sensor and also over run sensor - a back probe on that may be useful. It would fit with your symptoms. It is a digital 0 or 12 V signal. The TPS may also be 'slightly' captain cooked
Ideally one should get a lynx lol
Joe

Click to expand...

I thought of a switch at the pedal Joe. There isn't one however. There is just throttle position sensor or Demand Sensor as I know them as. There's no other switch fitted. The DS has a 4 core cable so I'm guessing it contains two variable resistors. One increasing resistance, the other reducing resistance at the pedal is pressed.
I could be wrong on that though.
It's a strange fault.

It certainly made you look as the car was on your drive idling and both of us looking in the engine bay.....then randomly started increasing rpm

A TPS/DS/Accelerator jobbie can't be to expensive to get hold of from a breakers. Its got to be worth a try surely? Even if you think it is unlikely to be the fault, its got to be a lot cheaper/easier than what looks to be the alternative - which is something in the pump.

GrumpyGel said:

A TPS/DS/Accelerator jobbie can't be to expensive to get hold of from a breakers. Its got to be worth a try surely? Even if you think it is unlikely to be the fault, its got to be a lot cheaper/easier than what looks to be the alternative - which is something in the pump.

Click to expand...

That's where I would start. Always start at the cheapest thing I say.
Otherwise I can only think that the fuel pump is the issue.

Nodge68 said:

I thought of a switch at the pedal Joe. There isn't one however. There is just throttle position sensor or Demand Sensor as I know them as. There's no other switch fitted. The DS has a 4 core cable so I'm guessing it contains two variable resistors. One increasing resistance, the other reducing resistance at the pedal is pressed.
I could be wrong on that though.
It's a strange fault.

Click to expand...

Hi Nodge


Best to Backprobe ECU 25 (the TPS switch - digital 0 and 12v on or off)

Would also look at 37 for the variable TPS wiper signal post 9 degrees tps.

Only if those are stable would I then look at the dual fuel quantity servo output to the VP37 with a scope (12V PWM - on pins 1 and 2) and also the quantity feedback from the vp37 on pin 14 (0-5V analogue ecu input- (this is possibly AC - I have not checked)
The other ends of the quantity feedback are a 0-5v (21) analogue output from the ecu and a 5v reference. (39)

It is interesting that this design of fly by wire tps is NOT the normally seen dual opposing track design. It is a single wiper design backed up by the tps idle switch. Quite robust really. In the event of an issue the release of the throttle should stop signal the ecu to ignore the signal from the wiper. As the switch is opened as the throttle moves past 9 degrees the ecu checks for a plausible signal (it is only in the context of the values immediately after and immediately prior to switch activation though.
The pump may be the actual culprit once the tps has been ruled out - if it is the tps it will be the switch which is a two minute check with a backprope and ground.
Pump wiring can be an issue and should be checked carefully. Also check the wiring very carefully around the quantity position servo output as it may have had an evry mod in the past which taps two of the wires.(the yellow/black stripe and red) - the connectors have also occasionaly had issues. Again that circuitry inside the pump is very very robust and any issues tend to be woring related.
Hope that helps.
This is really one of those jobs where a live data stream would be invaluable and be able to pinpoint the issue extrmely quickly. Bit of a bu€€er about the i930
Joe