Disco 2 Clutch and Main seal leak

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J

john snoo

Well-Known Member
Posts
613
Location
uk
G'day all.

Well my lovely minter of a disco 2 (manual) has a problem. Took it to ATS to get tracking done and the guy said I had a leak from the gearbox. Took it to a friend of mine (mechanic with ramps) and looked underneath today. He said it's main crank seal which is fairly common, not the gearbox. Looks like my first time to dig deep into a pocket on this disco!

Since buying it I have hated the clutch. It's horrible, very noisy, very heavy and stiff to use, and doesnt seem to work too brilliantly as the gears are very hard to get into gear. Even the ATS guy commented on it. I am thinking of taking this forced opportunity (gearbox off to repair leak) to fit a new clutch. I want a decent quality one, am I right in thinking LUK would be best pick for this?
Also, are there any other things I ought to get done while it's on ramps and stripped down underneath?
 
Hiya John, nice to hear from you again!
No idea about the clutch, but while you are under there, if you have not already done so, I'd have a bloody good look at the rear part of the chassis checking for the inevitable rust bug.
Others will be along to add their fourpennorth.:)
 
Wotcha, thanks!
Yes I am going to use the opportunity to have a good look with him, but it does look pretty damn good (hence why I bought it after turning down a long list of sh1tters).
I was giving it 6-9 months to make absolutely sure this vehicle is as good as I think it is, then I intend to get up to before 'n' after for a full quality underseal
 
john snoo said:
Wotcha, thanks!
Yes I am going to use the opportunity to have a good look with him, but it does look pretty damn good (hence why I bought it after turning down a long list of sh1tters).
I was giving it 6-9 months to make absolutely sure this vehicle is as good as I think it is, then I intend to get up to before 'n' after for a full quality underseal
Click to expand...

I suggest you read some reviews of before and laughter before venturing up there!
 
+1^^^
thought that was too obvious to say , but then maybe it ain't and shouldn't he also look well at the clutch release fork and replace the thrust bearing?
Just saying!
 
Quite often the rear of the rocker cover seal leaks down the back of block and into the bell housing, it looks like main crank seal failed when it's not. Worth checking if there's oil in that area just around the corner from the FPR. Stock D2 clutch shouldn't be that heavy, I wonder if it's had an uprated clutch/cover fitted at some point? If you're going to do the clutch I'd suggest renewing the slave & master cylinders too.

Oh and if it is the rocker cover gasket that's leaking, replace it and most importantly, the metal/rubber grommets that are used to clamp the cover to the head, it's those getting old that cause most leaks - also worth replacing the PCV valve because they fail quite often and over pressurise the case making any leaks at the back worse.
 
lynall said:
If removing clutch for any reason, std pracrice will be to replace it, do not forget the dmf as well.
Click to expand...
Thanks. What's a dmf?

lynall said:
I suggest you read some reviews of before and laughter before venturing up there!
Click to expand...
Oh, really? I did read a lot many moons ago (MANY!) and though it looked very highly regarded. I better refresh my research in that case! My local guy will do an underseal with waxoyl for a fraction of the price and I would rather not take the trip to Rugby if such a huge journey isn't warranted! I have heard people say it's best to leave it bare and keep it clean etc, and it does make some sense. However, most people don't live where I do and my friend and every other mechanic round here (including landy specialists) all religiously underseal (not necessarily with any old stuff, although some go for used engine oil) because I can not describe how bad stuff rusts here. I get the sea wind over my vehicles 24 hours a day, I can often wipe salt off the windscreen with my finger after a strong wind in the night, sea spray etc.

I bought my wife a transit (I know they rust for fun). It rotted out in 2 years here, and I mean feet through floor type of rotted out! ALl my tools in shed are rusted, constantly oiling and greasing stuff but rust gets bloody everywhere. All in all I think a coat of something, even if only used engine oil (which runs off and needs redoing but allows inspection of underneath it better) would be wise where I am.
 
Bennehboy said:
Quite often the rear of the rocker cover seal leaks down the back of block and into the bell housing, it looks like main crank seal failed when it's not. Worth checking if there's oil in that area just around the corner from the FPR. Stock D2 clutch shouldn't be that heavy, I wonder if it's had an uprated clutch/cover fitted at some point? If you're going to do the clutch I'd suggest renewing the slave & master cylinders too.

Oh and if it is the rocker cover gasket that's leaking, replace it and most importantly, the metal/rubber grommets that are used to clamp the cover to the head, it's those getting old that cause most leaks - also worth replacing the PCV valve because they fail quite often and over pressurise the case making any leaks at the back worse.
Click to expand...

Blimey what have I let myself in for? :D - Seriously though, thanks very much. I did wonder if it needed to be properly confirmed before we go pulling gearboxes off. Slave and master - hmm, not sure I can go that far as much as I would love to. Do you have any ball park ideas of what those two would cost? I do want to keep this truck for a good 5-10 years and intend to lavish it with love (in place of money wherever possible :D) so I am not against the idea, just very tight for cash lately but if it will save in long run then I will definitely consider it.
PCV valve, FPR.... i have some googling to do! No idea what any of these things are! thanks again
 
Pattern parts about 90 quid the pair, decent AP/Lockheed parts more like 150. I only mention these because your clutch is so heavy.

DMF is Dual Mass Flywheel, it's got a big sprung bit in it that stops driveline shock as you engage disengage the clutch.

PCV - presure control valve - it sits on the end of the breather pipe that's connected to the rocker cover - basically it's a 1 way valve but they break, often.

FPR - Fuel Pressure Regulator - keeps the fuel supply to the head at ~ 4bar.
 
john snoo said:
Thanks. What's a dmf?


Oh, really? I did read a lot many moons ago (MANY!) and though it looked very highly regarded. I better refresh my research in that case! My local guy will do an underseal with waxoyl for a fraction of the price and I would rather not take the trip to Rugby if such a huge journey isn't warranted! I have heard people say it's best to leave it bare and keep it clean etc, and it does make some sense. However, most people don't live where I do and my friend and every other mechanic round here (including landy specialists) all religiously underseal (not necessarily with any old stuff, although some go for used engine oil) because I can not describe how bad stuff rusts here. I get the sea wind over my vehicles 24 hours a day, I can often wipe salt off the windscreen with my finger after a strong wind in the night, sea spray etc.

I bought my wife a transit (I know they rust for fun). It rotted out in 2 years here, and I mean feet through floor type of rotted out! ALl my tools in shed are rusted, constantly oiling and greasing stuff but rust gets bloody everywhere. All in all I think a coat of something, even if only used engine oil (which runs off and needs redoing but allows inspection of underneath it better) would be wise where I am.
Click to expand...


DMF is dual mass flywheel, basically a two part flywheel with a built in damper.

As for rust, any of the cheap chassis waxes mixed with 10 to 20 percent engine oil applied with a compressor as and when needed might keep the rust at bay, so yes use your local guy and save a lot of money.
No matter what people tell you, chassis wax needs redoing annually at a minimum, waxoyl is poor at best.

Sadly all land rovers over 15/20 yrs old rust for fun, and thats in normal weather conditions.
 
Bennehboy said:
Pattern parts about 90 quid the pair, decent AP/Lockheed parts more like 150. I only mention these because your clutch is so heavy.

DMF is Dual Mass Flywheel, it's got a big sprung bit in it that stops driveline shock as you engage disengage the clutch.

PCV - presure control valve - it sits on the end of the breather pipe that's connected to the rocker cover - basically it's a 1 way valve but they break, often.

FPR - Fuel Pressure Regulator - keeps the fuel supply to the head at ~ 4bar.
Click to expand...

Wow, as Stanley said, brilliant stuff thanks!
OK...

DMF - I remember years ago hearing that these are much nicer in use, smoother and less stiff or at least smoother when engaging. My friend wasn't sure if Disco2 had a DMF or not, I said I wanted that if it was possible. Glad to hear it sounds like it is. LUK DMF decent enough you think?

PCV and FPR - sod it, lets bung those in!!

I intend to try and source all the parts myself. My mate doesn't mark prices up anyway so it saves him the job, and I can spend time getting best deals which he won't do, he will just ring one of his few parts contacts and pay whatever they ask. If anyone can recommend a good place for lowest price best quality parts, please drop me a link. I won't go for pattern, at least not on the slave/master - ideally not on anything. This truck is so original it's really almost a show piece, and I intend to invest a lot of time and money into her over the long haul, so i would prefer OEM parts wherever I can afford em. Thanks again, great info here and glad I asked.
 
lynall said:
DMF is dual mass flywheel, basically a two part flywheel with a built in damper.

As for rust, any of the cheap chassis waxes mixed with 10 to 20 percent engine oil applied with a compressor as and when needed might keep the rust at bay, so yes use your local guy and save a lot of money.
No matter what people tell you, chassis wax needs redoing annually at a minimum, waxoyl is poor at best
Click to expand...

Yes but I had the impression the before and after treatment was a proper coating, hard not soft or runny and as such was the only underseal approach which didn't need constant replacement/re-application. Plenty of used engine oil around here so I can definitely save a fortune going that route!
 
john snoo said:
PCV and FPR - sod it, lets bung those in!!
Click to expand...

I don't think you've got a problem with your FPR, I was pointing out that the place that oil leak downs from the rocker cover is just 'round the corner' from the FPR (which is at the rear left side of the head as you look at it from the front, it's a bit hidden by the acoustic cover and the inlet manifold. The FPR _can_ leak but it tends to wash all the mucky oil off as it spits out diesel - and you'd smell it for sure.
 
john snoo said:
Yes but I had the impression the before and after treatment was a proper coating, hard not soft or runny and as such was the only underseal approach which didn't need constant replacement/re-application. Plenty of used engine oil around here so I can definitely save a fortune going that route!
Click to expand...


I think you will find the b+a teflon treatment is only on new or nearly new chassis?
 
No, it's not. But if it's useless or no better than a good spray of Bilthamber then it's academic really!
 
lynall said:
If removing clutch for any reason, std pracrice will be to replace it, do not forget the dmf as well.
Click to expand...

Well this may start a debate......

I just got off phone to a close friend of mine, landy man for many years and a mechanic too. He said something (strongly too!) which seems opposite to what I thought, and what some here seem to think too. He said the DMF is not a better clutch. It may feel more modern and "soft" or spongy on the engagement, but it's weaker and won't last as long, and is way worse for towing heavy loads etc. He prefers standard solid steel clutch without DMF, but a good one like Sachs rather than LUK. Hey, I am just the messenger! But I would read with interest any comments on that from folks in here :)
 
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