Brake problem!!

hi all.
Thanks for reading this.
I have not long since bought my first discovery its a 50th anniversary model 1998..
I was on my way back home today from Nottingham to Cornwall , i had to stop at a service station and as i pulled in i noticed the brake pedal traveled further than normal.as i parked and pressed the brakes the pedal went to the floor i pumped it a couple of times with the engine running but it went to the floor, on both tries. i turned off the engine and applied the brakes and the peddle was hard.turned the engine back on and all seemed to be ok, got back to Cornwall with no upsets but not happy with the situation ...
Any one got any ideas ??? its too dark now to look but will look in the morning to see if the brakes work ok ..
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated..

Thanks..

check levels look for leaks then bleed the system, if that doesn't cure its slave or master cylinder. but start cheap by checkin all brake pipes calipers first this costs nothing. Then bleed the system a few quid on fluid. If this doesn't work it will be what i have said above. good luck and remember they save your life so et it sorted and not do a cowboy repair.

Hello Alerick,

First step....Try looking for leaks around the caliper area.

Hi.
Thank you both ,When this happened i looked underneath and found no leaks , i took off the top of the reservoir and it was full .
but will check again as soon as its light enough for me to see.
Thanks again

Have had another look today ...Still no leaks that i can see and my brakes seem to be working as they should ,,,peddle is firm and not at all spongy, just cannot understand it
But i dont want it to happen again,,could this be an intermittent fault with the master cylinder..???any help or advise would be greatly welcome...Thank you ..

Alerick said:

Have had another look today ...Still no leaks that i can see and my brakes seem to be working as they should ,,,peddle is firm and not at all spongy, just cannot understand it
But i dont want it to happen again,,could this be an intermittent fault with the master cylinder..???any help or advise would be greatly welcome...Thank you ..

Click to expand...

If I were you as part of a set of diagnostic tests, I would do the following:

1. Commencing the test with the engine at rest, press hard on the brake pedal, it should feel hard;

2. Now, with the brake pedal still pressed down hard, start the engine. What should happen is the brake pedal should drop a bit then remain firm.

Is this what happens with your car?


Dave

Hi Dave .
Thanks for the reply,, Yes this is exactly what happens,,put foot on brake,,start engine ,,peddle travels away then stops firm,,,Not sure what to do now as i am worried it might happen again and not sure which way to go..

Alerick said:

Hi Dave .
Thanks for the reply,, Yes this is exactly what happens,,put foot on brake,,start engine ,,peddle travels away then stops firm,,,Not sure what to do now as i am worried it might happen again and not sure which way to go..

Click to expand...

OK Mate, so what that shows is that the servo for the brakes is currently working as it should.

Now you need to start looking at all aspects of the braking system, the next place I would be looking is the ABS pump:

1. Find a suitable safe place to do a series of braking tests, where there is some soft ground or gravel that you could place the nearside wheels on.

2. Having found a suitable area, get up to about 15-20mph with the nearside wheel on the loose ground and when safe, brake HARD !! What you are trying to do is lock up the wheels. If the ABS is working correctly you should feeling a pulsing through the brake pedal as the nearside wheels lose their grip.


Report back when tested,

Dave

Hi Dave.Thanks for that will get on it in the morning.
Will get back to you as soon as i can.
Thanks again

Change the fluid, old fluid absorbs water which then boils when the brakes get hot leaving you with no brakes. Seen it a few times on old cars, had the same problem on my MR2.

Datatek said:

Change the fluid, old fluid absorbs water which then boils when the brakes get hot leaving you with no brakes. Seen it a few times on old cars, had the same problem on my MR2.

Click to expand...

Hi .
thanks for the tip, will buy new tomorrow and bleed through.. see what happens.
Thank you

A possible cause of your symptoms could be a small piece of dirt in the mastercylinder which was temporarily on 1 of the seals (causing the pedal to go the floor) & now has moved again due to the fluid going around the seal.
I used to work for Girling / TRW that made the mastercylinders & we'd often get parts back which were ok except for dirt / debris inside.
If it is dirt & you're lucky, the problem won't happen again. If it does, release & re-apply the brake again quickly & it should move the dirt out of the way / restore braking.
Then flush the sytem through with clean new fluid & a pressure bleeder

Pawl said:

A possible cause of your symptoms could be a small piece of dirt in the mastercylinder which was temporarily on 1 of the seals (causing the pedal to go the floor) & now has moved again due to the fluid going around the seal.
I used to work for Girling / TRW that made the mastercylinders & we'd often get parts back which were ok except for dirt / debris inside.
If it is dirt & you're lucky, the problem won't happen again. If it does, release & re-apply the brake again quickly & it should move the dirt out of the way / restore braking.
Then flush the sytem through with clean new fluid & a pressure bleeder

Click to expand...

Thank you for that tip, i will change the fluid as soon as possible ,then do as Dave suggested and check the ABS ,,
Will let you know how it all goes.
Thanks again for all the good advice.

'scuse me guys but before getting too carried away it would be worthwhile checking the wheel bearings for play, has been known to cause a bit of a soft pedal then seem fine. HTH

Hi Dave.
Tried the ABS today and all seemed well brakes work fine ,dont know what the problem was but will replace the fluid tomorrow and clean the system .
Hopefully the problem will be fixed.It could just be what PAWL said and was a little bit of dirt in the master cylinder..
But thank you all for the tips and good advise. Will let you know how if the fluid change helps.

Ok Found out what the problem was..one of the retaining pins had come out of the caliper,
allowing the pads to move and one had twisted enough to allow one of the pistons to move all the way out and hit the disk.this is why i had a soft peddle then it went hard again when the piston could move no further.Very lucky that they didnt fall out ...
Dont bear thinking about ...
But thank you all for the good advise and tips..