At Last The Big TD5 job

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Well just a note on progress.

ran it a few times and noticed that it is a different engine when cold, sounds harsh and a bit Smokey, when hot it sounds better than I have ever heard it.

Plugged in the Nanocom and noticed that MAF saw a max of 380 Kg I unplugged it and it ran much smoother, so I ordered a new one from Island, at the same time i read of someone who replaced the manifold pressure/temp sensor and found the engine was not so jumpy on the throttle, so in for a penny (actually £25)


Put on the new MAF and manifold sensor and I'm not sure it certainly smoked much worse when cold, I’m puzzled. New one reads about 430 max so I upped the boost a bit now hits about 200kpa, anyone have any known good MAF readings to compare?

today gave it a 150 ml run down the A1 and it seemed to appreciate it, done about 350 miles since the re build and MOT is due next week.

Watch this space.
 
Hi if this helps (2005 td5) my maf reads 55 at idle, give or take a bit, and my max boost is 1.27 bar
 
Discodevon said:
Hi if this helps (2005 td5) my maf reads 55 at idle, give or take a bit, and my max boost is 1.27 bar
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The MAF reading seems similar to mine at idle but I get peaks of 200 kpa or 2 bar measured at the manifold, I assume this is absolute pressure so actually 1 bar boost.
My boost gauge is tapped into the actuator pipe and reads about 18 psi before you see it fall back as the gate opens.
 
raywin said:
The MAF reading seems similar to mine at idle but I get peaks of 200 kpa or 2 bar measured at the manifold, I assume this is absolute pressure so actually 1 bar boost.
My boost gauge is tapped into the actuator pipe and reads about 18 psi before you see it fall back as the gate opens.
Click to expand...
Ah fair enough! I read mine from the nanocom, I think it sounds about right though from what you’re saying , how’s she running now after the rebuild?
 
Discodevon said:
Ah fair enough! I read mine from the nanocom, I think it sounds about right though from what you’re saying , how’s she running now after the rebuild?
Click to expand...
When it's hot it is very smooth, much better than I have ever heard it before, when it's cold it is not so smooth, when I ease back on the accelerator then it seems to slow down with a jolt, but all in all I am getting a much better feeling about it.
MOT on Tuesday so I will give it another run out on Monday hope that a few miles down the A1 at about 65mph will blow out some cobwebs.
 
Eibbor said:
Loved this thread thanks for taking the time to document what you did. Arming me with knowledge for when I eventually have my own landy
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Thank you, I did hope that it might save some people time and money by avoiding my mistakes, I was surprised to find what a solid engine the TD5 is, as I said before designed by engineers not accounts.
Now done about 1500 miles and it seems better than ever (hope I dont jinx it).
I worked a long time in engineering but only ever done cars as a hobby or through financial necessity.
 
Best thread ever in this forum. It has given me a lot more understanding on my own TD5 (200 k on clock) without restoration and it goes fine still. But I have noticed similar marks on camshaft like you showed pictures on your old. Its obvious it is bad lubrication going on now and then....? I have used 5w 40 but but since a couple years decided to follow recommendations strictly thus 5w-30 even if I can’t say why. I think it has stabilized, not certain yet has to lift cover and check it further when doing annual service now in this month.
Finally what puzzles me is (have I missed something?) during all this process you never mentioned or did anything with timing chain, guides and tensioner seems to me obvious to do in an overhaul like this?
 
mats said:
Best thread ever in this forum. It has given me a lot more understanding on my own TD5 (200 k on clock) without restoration and it goes fine still. But I have noticed similar marks on camshaft like you showed pictures on your old. Its obvious it is bad lubrication going on now and then....? I have used 5w 40 but but since a couple years decided to follow recommendations strictly thus 5w-30 even if I can’t say why. I think it has stabilized, not certain yet has to lift cover and check it further when doing annual service now in this month.
Finally what puzzles me is (have I missed something?) during all this process you never mentioned or did anything with timing chain, guides and tensioner seems to me obvious to do in an overhaul like this?
Click to expand...
Thank you for your kind comments, I did hope that my efforts might benefit someone and save them from making the mistakes I made, I was surprised and delighted to see how tough the TD5 engine is, I could not believe the low levels of wear I found on it.
It was all started because of the cam wear which had to be addressed, but nice to do the bottom end shells and get it back in spec. Timing chain and guides were in decent nick I used an old way to check the chain, just turn it sideways and hold it out at arm's length, if it droops then the pins have too much play in them, nylon guides showed little damage so I put them back.
I have used halfords 5w 40 fully synthetic oil for a while and I find it ok I may go back to 5w 30 now.
 
There was some discussion on here somewhere about how oil manufacturers had changed the properties of the oil they sold since the TD5 was designed so you tend to get a bit of fretting on the cams nowadays. A design that was perfectly alright in testing has turned out to have some vulnerabilities as a result of changes the engineers hadn't anticipated. I wonder if the composition of the metal used to make the camshaft is a factor too, and whether someone will start making a camshaft that's more robust. A bit like giving classic engines hardened valve seats to cope with the lack of lead in petrol these days.
 
Brown said:
There was some discussion on here somewhere about how oil manufacturers had changed the properties of the oil they sold since the TD5 was designed so you tend to get a bit of fretting on the cams nowadays. A design that was perfectly alright in testing has turned out to have some vulnerabilities as a result of changes the engineers hadn't anticipated. I wonder if the composition of the metal used to make the camshaft is a factor too, and whether someone will start making a camshaft that's more robust. A bit like giving classic engines hardened valve seats to cope with the lack of lead in petrol these days.
Click to expand...
I worried about the amount of oil reaching the cam lobes when I first ran the engine, I did suspect the none return valve in the head.
Modern oils which accommodate catalytic converters dont have zinc as a wear addative, so I added some special break in addative with zinc.
Do you remember the cortina engines in the 1980s they had cam shafts that failed, you could get an aftermarket kit which had a bigger oil feed pipe and slopped more oil onto the lobes.
 
raywin said:
I worried about the amount of oil reaching the cam lobes when I first ran the engine, I did suspect the none return valve in the head.
Modern oils which accommodate catalytic converters dont have zinc as a wear addative, so I added some special break in addative with zinc.
Do you remember the cortina engines in the 1980s they had cam shafts that failed, you could get an aftermarket kit which had a bigger oil feed pipe and slopped more oil onto the lobes.
Click to expand...
No, I missed out on that period. I had a lot of experience with 1960s and 70s engines such as the BMC B series, the 1200 or 1300 ones used in Triumphs and Bonds, the Vauxhall Viva engines and the Land Rover Series 2, but by the time 1980s engines were getting cheap enough for me, I was busy with working life and living in cities so I didn't have cars for many years. The Ford engines I came into contact with were mostly from the pre-crossflow era, twenty years earlier. The very idea of an overhead cam seemed somehow exotic and redolent of an engine so highly strung and temperamental as to be useless amidst the mud and drizzle in which I lived. Having come back to motoring in middle age it's extraordinary how things have changed. We've still got a 19th century design that owes a lot to the configuration of steam engines, but progressive refinements have enabled longer running lives and less maintenance. I can hardly believe I haven't had to have my engine to pieces yet!
 
Brown said:
No, I missed out on that period. I had a lot of experience with 1960s and 70s engines such as the BMC B series, the 1200 or 1300 ones used in Triumphs and Bonds, the Vauxhall Viva engines and the Land Rover Series 2, but by the time 1980s engines were getting cheap enough for me, I was busy with working life and living in cities so I didn't have cars for many years. The Ford engines I came into contact with were mostly from the pre-crossflow era, twenty years earlier. The very idea of an overhead cam seemed somehow exotic and redolent of an engine so highly strung and temperamental as to be useless amidst the mud and drizzle in which I lived. Having come back to motoring in middle age it's extraordinary how things have changed. We've still got a 19th century design that owes a lot to the configuration of steam engines, but progressive refinements have enabled longer running lives and less maintenance. I can hardly believe I haven't had to have my engine to pieces yet!
Click to expand...

I remember the days when my kids were small, and wife not working, I could only run older cars and spent almost every weekend patching them up. I became so sick of it that I swore I would never touch another car if I could afford to have it fixed by someone else.

Combination of retirement, and total distrust of many garages has brought me to the thread above, going to get into the bodywork this year if things are OK.

Go on get your engine out you know you want to
 
Before I bought that piece of land I was thinking of getting a secondhand TD5 engine and going through it, replacing bearing shells and seals so it was ready to install when my existing one gave up the ghost. As a youngster I got tired of tinkering with cars that nobody else wanted with zero budget and poor parts availability. Until I was about 30 I didn't realise you could buy cars new, I thought they came as a load of rusty bits on a trailer. So this time around I bought a Land Rover which was a mere six years old, and thanks to being better paid these days and having the internet I can actually get the correct parts.
 
Thanks for clarification and answers , I like the chain check metodology...”If it ain’t broken don’t try to fix it” -ish. My TD5 has to run over summer , not that worried, when fall comes time will be right to move into the garage and take it out. It will be my 65 yr present.
 
Just been looking at ways to measure piston protrusion.
manual says use DTi with magnetic base? Seems i could use the end of digital calipers to measure... Anyone tried this method?
Also are the published head gaskett thicknesses the thickness before torquing down head bolts or after? As the gaskett will be thinner once torqued down....

Having nightmares of finishing rebuild only for a piston to make contact with head/valves and it tearing itself apart in first few mins of running...
As TD5 has pistons protrude above block and head has no recess above cylinders...doesnt leave much room for F%$#ing this measurement up!
 
Alistair Davidson said:
Just been looking at ways to measure piston protrusion.
manual says use DTi with magnetic base? Seems i could use the end of digital calipers to measure... Anyone tried this method?
Also are the published head gaskett thicknesses the thickness before torquing down head bolts or after? As the gaskett will be thinner once torqued down....

Having nightmares of finishing rebuild only for a piston to make contact with head/valves and it tearing itself apart in first few mins of running...
As TD5 has pistons protrude above block and head has no recess above cylinders...doesnt leave much room for F%$#ing this measurement up!
Click to expand...

I suppose you could use a caliper but I dont think you could get the same accuracy as the DTI gives, if I were to do this I would put a block of machined metal on the top of the block clear of the bore, and extend the depth gauge from the caliper down to the piston top, then carefully turn the crank. When it peaks you will have a reading, subtract this from the thickness of the machined block and you should have the protrusion.
You can see the way I did it in the pictures, I think this is the best way as it is less prone to error.
I wanted to be accurate to be sure all 5 measurements were within tolerance, this tells you that the con rods and crank are in good shape.
The process is to measure the protrusion and then check the manual, it will tell you which gasket you need to use, the system allows for compression of the gasket by the head bolts (when correctly tightened).
 
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