Another Non Urgent question .......

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Teamemmenracing

Teamemmenracing

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Location
West Lothian
This is about a '98 2.5 DSE ......... Auto

With a cold transmission - initial bite is sluggish, ie takes a handfull of revs to get it moving.

With a warm transmission - everything is ok .....

I've always thought this was normal, and have always let transmission oil get warm before I pushed it .......

......... but then I'm thinking (after reading a few other posts) that with 113 K Miles on it - I should be looking at swapping the torque convertor ...

anyone got any thoughts on this ....... ?

ta ....:)
 
Try changing the oil and filter first. Fit new filter, fill with new oil 5.5 litres or so, take for a short run then drain and refill.
 
Teamemmenracing said:
This is about a '98 2.5 DSE ......... Auto

With a cold transmission - initial bite is sluggish, ie takes a handfull of revs to get it moving.

With a warm transmission - everything is ok .....

I've always thought this was normal, and have always let transmission oil get warm before I pushed it .......

......... but then I'm thinking (after reading a few other posts) that with 113 K Miles on it - I should be looking at swapping the torque convertor ...

anyone got any thoughts on this ....... ?

ta ....:)
Click to expand...

From the information I have found so far chasing my gearbox problem, I'd say it's more likely one of the clutch packs on the way out. Drain some oil and look at the colour. Black = clutch problems.
Mine was like that before it really started to play up.
 
Datatek said:
From the information I have found so far chasing my gearbox problem, I'd say it's more likely one of the clutch packs on the way out. Drain some oil and look at the colour. Black = clutch problems.
Mine was like that before it really started to play up.
Click to expand...

Clutch problems are caused by lack of oil pressure to hold them in. Blocked filter lack of oil pressure. Blocked filter no oil getting to torque converter. Oil warms becomes thinner goes through partially blocked filter better, feeds torque converter. Simples.
 
Never ceases to amaze; most peeps check/change engine oil reasonably well to schedule, so few check/change atf fluid/filter, then wonder why probs occur.........never let mine go over 5k miles on engine oil, change atf/filter at 10 thou.......touch wood, crossin legs, n fingers.....no probs yet!
 
Ridesafe said:
Never ceases to amaze; most peeps check/change engine oil reasonably well to schedule, so few check/change atf fluid/filter, then wonder why probs occur.........never let mine go over 5k miles on engine oil, change atf/filter at 10 thou.......touch wood, crossin legs, n fingers.....no probs yet!
Click to expand...
Yeh but....Ashcrofts also recommend now that, if you don't know the history of the box ie whether the oil and filter have been changed on a regular basis, it's probably better to leave well alone if it's working OK and the fluid is clean. That way nothing gets disturbed. There have been posts on here where people have changed the oil and filter shortly after buying a Range Rover and then finding they start to have gearbox problems. As Ashcrofts are the known and recognised experts in Range Rover gearboxes, I think I'll go along with their recommendations. Each to their own and all that.:)
 
Derek Ward said:
Yeh but....Ashcrofts also recommend now that, if you don't know the history of the box ie whether the oil and filter have been changed on a regular basis, it's probably better to leave well alone if it's working OK and the fluid is clean. That way nothing gets disturbed. There have been posts on here where people have changed the oil and filter shortly after buying a Range Rover and then finding they start to have gearbox problems. As Ashcrofts are the known and recognised experts in Range Rover gearboxes, I think I'll go along with their recommendations. Each to their own and all that.:)
Click to expand...

The copy of the service schedule I've got calls for autobox oil changes every 30K miles.
 
wammers said:
Clutch problems are caused by lack of oil pressure to hold them in. Blocked filter lack of oil pressure. Blocked filter no oil getting to torque converter. Oil warms becomes thinner goes through partially blocked filter better, feeds torque converter. Simples.
Click to expand...

Oil presure does not affect the sprag clutches as far as I can see, but the torque of the diesel which is on the limit of the ZF4HP22 rating with a power box certainly does.
 
Datatek said:
Oil presure does not affect the sprag clutches as far as I can see, but the torque of the diesel which is on the limit of the ZF4HP22 rating with a power box certainly does.
Click to expand...

Correct it doesn't. And yes correct it does. The sprag clutches are one way bearing clutches that do slip then grip if worn. You can feel this happening. If the sprag clutches fail you have no drive at all, but failing sprag clutches won't cause blacking of the oil. I was thinking more of the problem the OP posted, either no grip from torque convertor if it is not getting filled with oil because of partially blocked filter, or lack of oil pressure causing number 1 engagement clutch to slip, again because of partially blocked filter. When oil warms and becomes thinner all is well he said. Classic blocked filter to me.
 
Derek Ward said:
Yeh but....Ashcrofts also recommend now that, if you don't know the history of the box ie whether the oil and filter have been changed on a regular basis, it's probably better to leave well alone if it's working OK and the fluid is clean. That way nothing gets disturbed. There have been posts on here where people have changed the oil and filter shortly after buying a Range Rover and then finding they start to have gearbox problems. As Ashcrofts are the known and recognised experts in Range Rover gearboxes, I think I'll go along with their recommendations. Each to their own and all that.:)
Click to expand...

If you box is working fine and the oil is clean there is no reason not to change oil and filter. To start a service cycle. If your oil is dirty and everything is working fine and you decide to change oil and filter then you may get problems. As new oil washes deposits around box and blocks governor or makes valve block sticky. If your oil is very dirty you have problems on the way anyway. That is why i say change oil and filter, run for a short period then change oil again. Repeat this until oil is totally clean. It may cost a few bob in oil but it's cheaper than a reconned box.
 
I've had Rangie's, SD1's, numerous bikes, all sorts over the years and always done oil/filter changes religiously..........never had a problem to date......look after ur bike or car and it'll look after you, especially if it's a Range!!
 
...... appreciate the input ......

Ive got a filter and oil waiting in the shed ........ but, the transmission oil is clean and up to the level and lol I've read a few posts in the past about problems appearing once you change them ......

Everything works ok, no probs apparant at all - might just do the filter tomorrow if it stays dry .......

thanks again
 
Right then ........ changed the transmission filter and oil today - easy job my arse :blabla: had to destroy the fibre glass cover to get at it - looks like its never ever been off .......

anyway - not noticable difference, so I'm guessing its one of them RR fenominuminuminums then ......... :doh:
 
errrrrrrr ........... got to make a wee retraction ........

after I changed the oil and filter, I took it out for for a 2 hour run ...... then parked it up for about 6 hours (and its 3 degrees outside).

just been out to pick up my girl from work and there is a definite difference now, not just when its cold but when its warm as well .....

Im thinking there is some truth in the clogged filter / oil starvation theory ... got an dea that some of the galleries may have been sludged up too ...... so much so Im planning on changing the oil again tomorrow.

Big question here ........ how much oil should it take.
Earlier in the thread someone said 5.5 lts and ........ 5 lts came out. Put in 5 lts and its up to the mark (cold, no engine running) but I looked in the manual and it says 9.7 lts ..............

wee bit puzzled here.
 
Teamemmenracing said:
errrrrrrr ........... got to make a wee retraction ........

after I changed the oil and filter, I took it out for for a 2 hour run ...... then parked it up for about 6 hours (and its 3 degrees outside).

just been out to pick up my girl from work and there is a definite difference now, not just when its cold but when its warm as well .....

Im thinking there is some truth in the clogged filter / oil starvation theory ... got an dea that some of the galleries may have been sludged up too ...... so much so Im planning on changing the oil again tomorrow.

Big question here ........ how much oil should it take.
Earlier in the thread someone said 5.5 lts and ........ 5 lts came out. Put in 5 lts and its up to the mark (cold, no engine running) but I looked in the manual and it says 9.7 lts ..............

wee bit puzzled here.
Click to expand...

You finish filling with the engine idling and move the gear lever through all positions. You won't get 9.7 litres in though as you can't drain the torque convertor.
 
All makes sense so far, first change has prolly cleared sludge, change again and difference should be very noticeable.
As already said, you won't get anything like a full change, too much held in galleries/sump, so changing twice is best option.
To ensure true level, start with engine cold. Start it up, move selector from P thru each position to 1, then back to P. Check level whilst still running. Top up as necessary, check again having gone P-1 and back again. DO NOT overfill!
 
Teamemmenracing said:
errrrrrrr ........... got to make a wee retraction ........

after I changed the oil and filter, I took it out for for a 2 hour run ...... then parked it up for about 6 hours (and its 3 degrees outside).

just been out to pick up my girl from work and there is a definite difference now, not just when its cold but when its warm as well .....

Im thinking there is some truth in the clogged filter / oil starvation theory ... got an dea that some of the galleries may have been sludged up too ...... so much so Im planning on changing the oil again tomorrow.

Big question here ........ how much oil should it take.
Earlier in the thread someone said 5.5 lts and ........ 5 lts came out. Put in 5 lts and its up to the mark (cold, no engine running) but I looked in the manual and it says 9.7 lts ..............

wee bit puzzled here.
Click to expand...

Said it was worth a try. Refill is usually just over 5 litres. Put five then dip to fill to level. Change oil as often as needed over next week or so to get it absolutly clean. A few bob in oil but less than a new box.
 
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