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Series 3 Adjusting brakes

Discussion in 'Series Land Rovers' started by Webley1991, Jan 15, 2019.

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  1. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    I have a Series 3 SWB with 10" single cylinder drums on all wheels. I have recently had to replace all four wheel cylinders as they had all started to leak.

    It was a few years since I last did the brake adjustment. Do I remember correctly that you are supposed to adjust the snail cam until the wheel locks up, then back off one click? I seem to remember that I had to back off two clicks on the rear wheels as the drums got hot with the brakes only backed off one click.

    I also recently replaced both the front free-wheeling hubs with standard drive flanges. I now have trouble turning the front wheels with both off the ground. There is enough resistance that it tries to turn the propshaft through the differential. Even with the brake adjustment slackened off, there seems to be too much resistance to turn the wheels properly.

    Any suggestions?
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2019
  2. wireman

    wireman Well-Known Member

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    You're right on how to adjust brakes.
    As for your front wheels they should turn fairly freely, if your front brakes aren't binding try you transmission brake if not that disconnect the front prop to try and isolate the issue. Possibly front bearings?
     
  3. tottot

    tottot Well-Known Member

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    It is as many clicks back as needed so the brake's do not drag.
    " there is enough resistance that it trys to turn the propshaft through the differential" you say.
    Well it would,you now have a solid drive with standard flanges and either the prop will turn or the other wheel will rotate in the opposit direction.
    Do not know what you mean by "seems to be too much adustment to turn wheels properly.
     
  4. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    I meant resistance instead of adjustment, I have edited the first post to correct it.

    The rear wheels can be rotated freely with the axle raised, with the opposite wheel rotating in the opposite direction as you say. It is the front ones which seem very stiff to turn.
     
  5. tottot

    tottot Well-Known Member

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    Since yours had freewheel hubs fitted it could be that the front axle has turned little in the past and is a bit stiff,if all fluids are good and no odd noise's take it for a good run and check again.With the UJ stub axles and bearings there are more bits to turn in the front.
     
  6. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply. The axles were rebuilt in 2014. The fluids are all at the proper levels.

    I did try to remember to lock the free wheeling hubs for a few miles whenever I had it on the road.

    Dosconnecting the front propshaft while adjusting the brakes may be the way to do it.

    I assume it should be possible to get a pedal that cannot be pushed to the floor with all of the snail cams at their lowest setting?
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
  7. Citizen Kane

    Citizen Kane Active Member

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    With the transmission in 2wd, front wheels in the straight ahead position and neither brake dragging there should be similar resistance in the front and rear axle. Sounds like you have a mechanical issue you need to resolve. My first port of call would be wheel bearings, if the excess friction was in the diff you wouldn't expect to see the prop turn. In a well maintained system its not unusual to see the prop turn rather than the opposite wheel, it will find the path of least resistance but if your turning a 16" wheel and tyre and noticing an increase in torque compared the rear then thats not right.
     
  8. jamesmartin

    jamesmartin Well-Known Member

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    either brakes are binding are theres an internal axle issue
     
  9. Blackburn

    Blackburn Well-Known Member

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    If you took the new drive flanges off again you could prove issue was brakes or axle.
    Try just jacking 1 wheel and turn it propshaft should rotate if not then its possible you are in 4wd.
     
  10. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the replies.

    Unfortunately I won't be able to get over to where I store it until next weekend.
     
  11. Land Raver

    Land Raver Well-Known Member

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    When I last adjusted my brakes I nipped the adjuster up until the wheels couldn't be turned. I backed off 1 click initially but although the wheels could then be turned by hand ok, they seemed to get probably a little too warm when driving. Backed off a further click on the fronts. My shoes were quite new so we're bedding in.
     
  12. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    I had another look yesterday. I was able to freely rotate one front wheel at a time while also turning the prop shaft.

    I adjusted the front brakes and the pedal feels a stiffer but still goes to the footwell floor on the first press.
     
  13. Land Raver

    Land Raver Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like air in the system or a master cylinder issue
     
  14. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply. The master cylinder worked fine before I found the leaks.

    I have read in the past that pressing some master cylinder pistons in too far when bleeding can damage the seals. Is there any truth to that?
     
  15. rob1miles

    rob1miles Well-Known Member

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    The seals should bottom ok, but you can get wear ridges in the bore if its very old and these can cause a problem. Did you back all the adusters off fully and knock the hubs to settle all the pistons in fully so there's no trapped volume before you blead? Makes a big difference.
     
  16. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply. The master cylinder was fitted new in 2015 and worked fine when I found the wheel cylinder leak.

    I did back the adjusters off fully (I assume that means wind the snail cam to its lowest setting)?

    I hadn't heard of knocking the hubs.
     
  17. rob1miles

    rob1miles Well-Known Member

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    I use a hide mallet to whack the hubs to settle the shoes as I'm adjusting. On the road the vibration does it but on a jack you can think the shoes are rubbing on the drum but actually they are not centred.
     
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  18. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    I think I finally managed to sort it over the weekend. I got some air bubbles out of the front driver's side wheel cylinder. Now the pedal can not be pressed to the footwell floor.

    Hopefully I can get an MOT sorted this weekend.
     
  19. samc88

    samc88 Drivels spiritual representative

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    For adjustment Ive never used the 2 clicks method. Lock up the adjusters so the wheel is solid and then back off until you can rotate the wheel and just hear the shoes lightly dragging on the drum
     
  20. Webley1991

    Webley1991 Well-Known Member

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    The brakes are still not right, so the MOT did not happen in the end.

    The system worked fine before the wheel cylinder leak. I would think that would rule out the master cylinder. It passed MOTs as it was in 2015, 16 and 17. The leak happened and I put it into storage off the road before I got round to fitting the cylinders.

    I replaced all four wheel cylinders and both sets of front brake shoes as fluid had leaked onto them at one side.

    The pedal will not press all the way to the floor, but the brakes are still virtually non existent. I am at a loss as to what to try next.

    I bled the air out of the system working by myself with a clear plastic tube and jar half filled with fluid. Once I didn't see any more bubbles I closed off the bleed nipple. I ended up wasting nearly two litres of fluid doing this.
     
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