P38A A series of faults

brianp38dse said:

The diesel should start with the lift pump working if there is more than a 1/4 tank, if a new intank pump is required the cheap one dont last long and the more expensive one the VDO one is the kiddy to go for unfortunately

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Noted, also read about split pickups letting air get in once the fuel level drops. Now debating dropping the tank to take a look as I can get things high enough...or the hole in the floor option...

Dropping the tank is the best option as you can get in to check/ sort any other problems in that area
if you drop the tank you will probably end up changing the tank to filler neck hose they are all getting a bit old and cracked by now, its 51mm id 100mm long and JLR want £30 odd for it, i went down to Think automotive and got some a lot cheaper.

Hum

Bang goes getting the blasted thing on the road in time to help me move then

Slooby said:

Hum...



It seems to have its own ideas about that

Currently stuck in this posiition having started with the front higher than the rear after lowering off the axle stands. Started the engine and it raised the rear up to wading height, I then tried to lower it using the dash switch and initially I thought it was lowering the front, but it turned out to be raising the rear to this height! Now the engine won't restart as it appears to have run out of fuel despite showing over 1/4 tank on the gauge.

Urgh

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Back goes up before the front. I would say it started and then ran out of air and is waiting for more air. Either feeding a leak or weak compressor output. Back to Wammers guide.

Slooby said:

Hum

Bang goes getting the blasted thing on the road in time to help me move then

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Tank comes out pretty easily as long as it is empty. The longest part for me was getting all the fuel out as it failed with a nearly full tank.

Grrrrrr said:

Back goes up before the front. I would say it started and then ran out of air and is waiting for more air. Either feeding a leak or weak compressor output. Back to Wammers guide.

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Ah, it didn't quite go like that

While it was on the axle stands (a pair each end on the chassis and then another pair on each axle due to changing all the air springs) the rear end was more compressed than the front.

When I was finally at the point to test the suspension, and did battle with getting air into the reservoir, I noticed that the springs had inflated as well. While the springs were inflated they hadn't lifted the chassis off the stands, but I decided to get it down on its wheels and then get it fired up and levelled.

Wheels down, started the engine and it lifted itself up to wading height, but when I went to lower it the engine died and wouldn't restart. It was at that point I noticed the front was lower than the front.

Plugging the laptop in today and I couldn't get 'good idle', put my charger on the battery and it was at 25% charge, probably as a result of trying to get it to fire yesterday. So battery currently on charge and conditioning.

Meanwhile I have been doing battle with the fuel tank; mostly swearing at the filler pipe to tank joiner, which was as you warned rock hard, and its shot clamps. The tank is now dropped, definitely has a fair bit of fuel in it, and this isn't the first time it's been dropped judging by copper slip on the two rear bolts.

Going to get the pump out shortly and see if it is or isn't dead. Then plot the next move...

Slooby said:

Ah, it didn't quite go like that

While it was on the axle stands (a pair each end on the chassis and then another pair on each axle due to changing all the air springs) the rear end was more compressed than the front.

When I was finally at the point to test the suspension, and did battle with getting air into the reservoir, I noticed that the springs had inflated as well. While the springs were inflated they hadn't lifted the chassis off the stands, but I decided to get it down on its wheels and then get it fired up and levelled.

Wheels down, started the engine and it lifted itself up to wading height, but when I went to lower it the engine died and wouldn't restart. It was at that point I noticed the front was lower than the front.

Plugging the laptop in today and I couldn't get 'good idle', put my charger on the battery and it was at 25% charge, probably as a result of trying to get it to fire yesterday. So battery currently on charge and conditioning.

Meanwhile I have been doing battle with the fuel tank; mostly swearing at the filler pipe to tank joiner, which was as you warned rock hard, and its shot clamps. The tank is now dropped, definitely has a fair bit of fuel in it, and this isn't the first time it's been dropped judging by copper slip on the two rear bolts.

Going to get the pump out shortly and see if it is or isn't dead. Then plot the next move...

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Front should drop first, so maybe it just ran out of power to finish dropping.

Datatek said:

Front should drop first, so maybe it just ran out of power to finish dropping.

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That would make sense then, I did think the front was dropping when it cut out, and changed my mind when I looked at the disparity between the heights!

Slooby said:

Ah, it didn't quite go like that

While it was on the axle stands (a pair each end on the chassis and then another pair on each axle due to changing all the air springs) the rear end was more compressed than the front.

When I was finally at the point to test the suspension, and did battle with getting air into the reservoir, I noticed that the springs had inflated as well. While the springs were inflated they hadn't lifted the chassis off the stands, but I decided to get it down on its wheels and then get it fired up and levelled.

Wheels down, started the engine and it lifted itself up to wading height, but when I went to lower it the engine died and wouldn't restart. It was at that point I noticed the front was lower than the front.

Plugging the laptop in today and I couldn't get 'good idle', put my charger on the battery and it was at 25% charge, probably as a result of trying to get it to fire yesterday. So battery currently on charge and conditioning.

Meanwhile I have been doing battle with the fuel tank; mostly swearing at the filler pipe to tank joiner, which was as you warned rock hard, and its shot clamps. The tank is now dropped, definitely has a fair bit of fuel in it, and this isn't the first time it's been dropped judging by copper slip on the two rear bolts.

Going to get the pump out shortly and see if it is or isn't dead. Then plot the next move...

Click to expand...

I just reached up and cut the rubber pipe as I knew I was going to replace it. Worry about the clips afterwards.

Cutting the joining pipe wasn't really an option as someone repalced the brake lines at somepoint and just sort of ran them generally in the direction of front to rear, with a couple of cable ties loosely locating them, looped around the hose basically leaving no real room to reach up and cut that hose. When I had the suspension air tank out I did my best to re-route the brake lines, as well as remove the remains of the rusted out old ones, and the one place I couldn't do anything was around the filler to tank join...can now though!

Got the pump out; Land Rover logo and ESR1111 marked on the top cover, BMW on the pump itself. No sign of a sealing rubber the steel supports have a fair bit of rust on them, a wire snapped on the sender float arm (I suspect during extraction) and the pick-up 'tank' is filthy.

I suspect I will waste a lot of time doing anything more with it, much as I would like to repair rather than replace, so now need to concentrate on finding a replacement locally that I can actually get the same day so I can just get on with it.

Slooby said:

Cutting the joining pipe wasn't really an option as someone repalced the brake lines at somepoint and just sort of ran them generally in the direction of front to rear, with a couple of cable ties loosely locating them, looped around the hose basically leaving no real room to reach up and cut that hose. When I had the suspension air tank out I did my best to re-route the brake lines, as well as remove the remains of the rusted out old ones, and the one place I couldn't do anything was around the filler to tank join...can now though!

Got the pump out; Land Rover logo and ESR1111 marked on the top cover, BMW on the pump itself. No sign of a sealing rubber the steel supports have a fair bit of rust on them, a wire snapped on the sender float arm (I suspect during extraction) and the pick-up 'tank' is filthy.

I suspect I will waste a lot of time doing anything more with it, much as I would like to repair rather than replace, so now need to concentrate on finding a replacement locally that I can actually get the same day so I can just get on with it.

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Bacterial growth in the tank? Someone might have had veggie oil in there. Maybe the pump was just clogged?

Slooby said:

Cutting the joining pipe wasn't really an option as someone repalced the brake lines at somepoint and just sort of ran them generally in the direction of front to rear, with a couple of cable ties loosely locating them, looped around the hose basically leaving no real room to reach up and cut that hose. When I had the suspension air tank out I did my best to re-route the brake lines, as well as remove the remains of the rusted out old ones, and the one place I couldn't do anything was around the filler to tank join...can now though!

Got the pump out; Land Rover logo and ESR1111 marked on the top cover, BMW on the pump itself. No sign of a sealing rubber the steel supports have a fair bit of rust on them, a wire snapped on the sender float arm (I suspect during extraction) and the pick-up 'tank' is filthy.

I suspect I will waste a lot of time doing anything more with it, much as I would like to repair rather than replace, so now need to concentrate on finding a replacement locally that I can actually get the same day so I can just get on with it.

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Don't buy the cheap version of the pump.... You could be back in there before you know it!!!

Getting my mits on a replacement pump today is looking decided unlikely. I think I need to clear the bench and put a tiny bit of effort into checking it more closely

If my hunch on the pump itself is correct it could be a Magnetti-Morreli unit that's about 30 quid

Soooo...distinctly unimpressed on Tonbridge here...

Apparently when your website says you have something 'In Stock' this does not mean 'In actual stock for shipping' and that in reality 'we need 3 days to process your order' ie we have to order it from someone else...that has been the response to every phone call I have made today to anyone claiming to have an ESR1111 unit 'In Stock' be it Britpart, Bearmach, All-Makes, VDO etc etc

Anyway pump and sender unit pics:





Snapped whire on the level sensor:



And the reason that the pump failed in the first place:

Grrrrrr said:

Bacterial growth in the tank? Someone might have had veggie oil in there. Maybe the pump was just clogged?

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Bacterial growth: Check, Paint from a Jerry Can: Check, Congealed Dye from Red Diesel: Check

Pump has had three goes in the UT cleaning tank and doesn't even make a spark when connected to a battery. It's dead as a dead thing.

So this weekend I shall be making no steps forward beyond emptying the old diesel from the tank to clean it out. Arse

Slooby said:

Soooo...distinctly unimpressed on Tonbridge here...

Apparently when your website says you have something 'In Stock' this does not mean 'In actual stock for shipping' and that in reality 'we need 3 days to process your order' ie we have to order it from someone else...that has been the response to every phone call I have made today to anyone claiming to have an ESR1111 unit 'In Stock' be it Britpart, Bearmach, All-Makes, VDO etc etc

Anyway pump and sender unit pics:

Snapped whire on the level sensor:

And the reason that the pump failed in the first place:

Bacterial growth: Check, Paint from a Jerry Can: Check, Congealed Dye from Red Diesel: Check

Pump has had three goes in the UT cleaning tank and doesn't even make a spark when connected to a battery. It's dead as a dead thing.

So this weekend I shall be making no steps forward beyond emptying the old diesel from the tank to clean it out. Arse

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I'd get the tank off and deep clean it if thats the result

After the 4th run through the UT tank I could manually rotate the impellor in the pump, some of the plastic vanes seem to be a bit mobile, so I suspect fod to them. I left it going for a 5th turn in the UT tank just in case though, might attempt putting some ergs through it tomorrow

Rubberknees said:

I'd get the tank off and deep clean it if thats the result

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Took the tank off to get to the pump so that's the plan

Slooby said:

Took the tank off to get to the pump so that's the plan

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Top man

Will the new E10 petrol's start to grow bacteria in the tanks?