2002, TD4 anti roll bar bush replacement

:behindsofa:

Hi guys...amongst other jobs, I replaced the ARB links (Both sides) today and as a precaution, I ordered a pair of ARB rubber bushes at the same time. Luckily the old bushes appear o.k.
I had removed the under tray in order to change the engine & gearbox (Getrag) oils. I found that access to the ARB bush clamp bolts is pretty restricted and additionally the heads of the bolts are a bit rusty.
Is access to the bolts possible from above using long extensions and a ratchet wrench ?
Has anyone else encountered this problem and can provide a few tips ??

:beer2::confused2:

Hi i done mine last month, drop the front subframe off its not that difficult just a bit time consuming, when i tried to undo the bolts they snapped off into the subframe, so i had to drill out the snapped bolts then drill a larger hole in the bottom of the subframe to enable me to put a nut and bolt through to hold the anti-roll bar clamps. but all ok now i used stainless steel nuts & bolts this time.

Morg3171 said:

Hi i done mine last month, drop the front subframe off its not that difficult just a bit time consuming, when i tried to undo the bolts they snapped off into the subframe, so i had to drill out the snapped bolts then drill a larger hole in the bottom of the subframe to enable me to put a nut and bolt through to hold the anti-roll bar clamps. but all ok now i used stainless steel nuts & bolts this time.

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i have a picture of the subframe off with the new bolts when i work out how to get a picture up on here?

morg3171 said:

i have a picture of the subframe off with the new bolts when i work out how to get a picture up on here?

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:behindsofa:

Thanks for that info & photo.
Roughly, how long did it take you to remove the subframe ? I didn't have time to suss out that option when I had the undertray off.

Hi, can't remember? Not long though. When you take the under tray off you have I think 10 bolts to remove. Look underneath the subframe you will see 4 bolts straight up through the sub, these can be tight? Then you have the wishbone arm or suspension arm bolts. One through the front (pivot point) and two on the back of the arm under the footwell on both sides of the car, then one from the tie rod (subframe to IRD) and I think that's it. Subframe is not heavy and once you remove the drop links it is easy to pull out with the anti-roll bar on. If all the bolts come out no problem I would say about half hour, hour max to drop the sub off? Turn subframe upside down on the floor and through the holes in the bottom you can spray releasing oil on the inside to oil the thread of the anti-roll bar bracket bolts. Then undo them slowly half a turn out quarter back in and so on. They snap easy so be prepared to drill them out and replace. I drilled mine out and using a electricians hole saw drilled two holes each side (underside) of the subframe, sub is quite thin so easy to drill through, as you can see on the picture a long Allen bolt up through and a nut on top. If you are prepared for the worst it's not a bad job, if the worst (bolts snap) about 3hours in total? Remember which way the anti-roll bar fits on the sub or it will be upside down and you won't be able to fit the drop links!

In the manual it says to lower the subframe slightly and you can then get to the anti-roll bar bolts to undo them!!!! I think that would work if it was a new car and the bloody bolts wasn't rusted in!

Morg3171 said:

In the manual it says to lower the subframe slightly and you can then get to the anti-roll bar bolts to undo them!!!! I think that would work if it was a new car and the bloody bolts wasn't rusted in!

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:behindsofa:

Hi Morg...Thanks for the very useful info.....appreciated

I agree that all the Workshop Manuals are the same irregardless of whether they are Haynes or the manufacturers. They all show photo's etc of a new car and assume that rust doesn't exist, bolt heads never round off or break !! That's where the experience comes in
Next time I drop the undertray-in around 5000 miles when I do an oil change- I will have a look to see what's involved and for the sake of an extra hour or so's work, drop the subframe and renew the bolts & bushes. I am a great believer in using Stainless fasteners when I can-except where the tensile strength is critical-as they are never a problem to undo especially if they have had a smear of copper grease applied before assembly.

Irishrover said:

:behindsofa:

Hi Morg...Thanks for the very useful info.....appreciated

I agree that all the Workshop Manuals are the same irregardless of whether they are Haynes or the manufacturers. They all show photo's etc of a new car and assume that rust doesn't exist, bolt heads never round off or break !! That's where the experience comes in
Next time I drop the undertray-in around 5000 miles when I do an oil change- I will have a look to see what's involved and for the sake of an extra hour or so's work, drop the subframe and renew the bolts & bushes. I am a great believer in using Stainless fasteners when I can-except where the tensile strength is critical-as they are never a problem to undo especially if they have had a smear of copper grease applied before assembly.

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Yes i dont think tensile strength is a issue with these, they were only M6 bolts i think? and the U brackets are quite thin!
Good luck with changing them i think that even if they was not rusted i would still remove the subframe, may take a little more time but makes the job alot easier to have a subframe on the bench in front of you.

I did mine from the top (2x 600mm extensions) where access is a problem,and could reach the rest of the nuts from underneath.

Hippo said:

I did mine from the top (2x 600mm extensions) where access is a problem,and could reach the rest of the nuts from underneath.

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Thanks for that Hippo...I now have another option to consider.
I have a strong feeling that the bolt heads are rusted heavily and the socket will not get enough grip. Feels like those stupid bolts are used which have a smaller than normal hex. head and an integral "Washer" forged all in one.