2.7 tdv6 camshaft failure

Rnicholson90 said:

In my experience if the crank had snapped it wouldn't turn the cams as the drive from the starter motor is on the gearbox end of the crank and the belt to drive the cams is on the crankshaft/front of the engine I guess I'm just hoping it's not the dreaded crank saga! I've got an s type Jag with a good engine in ready if needed but I really can't be dealing with the swap

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Hi

Been thinking about this and indeed agree, wondering if the drivers side camshaft chain has snapped , as it sits near the firewall , locked , twisting and snapping the camshaft , causing the back half of the cam to stop but as u turn the engine over the front timing belt is still turning the camshaft sprocket and front half of the snapped camshaft ???

But indeed won’t know 100% until the rocker cover comes off

Thks for listening

gstuart said:

Hi

Been thinking about this and indeed agree, wondering if the drivers side camshaft chain has snapped , as it sits near the firewall , locked , twisting and snapping the camshaft , causing the back half of the cam to stop but as u turn the engine over the front timing belt is still turning the camshaft sprocket and front half of the snapped camshaft ???

But indeed won’t know 100% until the rocker cover comes off

Thks for listening

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That's my thoughts exactly!!! I'm hoping it is that to be honest!!
Do these engines have rocker arms or are they hydraulic lifters? Thanks for the photos

Rnicholson90 said:

That's my thoughts exactly!!! I'm hoping it is that to be honest!!
Do these engines have rocker arms or are they hydraulic lifters? Thanks for the photos

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Hiya

Glad pics were useful

Found abit more details for u

The camshafts are of a hollow steel tube construction, with pressed on sintered lobes. Each camshaft is retained by aluminium alloy caps, five for the exhaust camshafts and four for the inlet camshafts. Location letters, A to I for the intake camshaft and R to Z for the exhaust camshaft, are marked on the outer faces of the caps for each cylinder head.

The LH cylinder bank exhaust camshaft is machined to accept a rear camshaft gear. The rear camshaft gear provides drive for High Pressure (HP) fuel pump, located centrally at the rear of the 'vee', via a short-toothed belt and tensioner pulley.

The RH cylinder head exhaust camshaft is machined at the rear end to provide a drive connection for the vacuum pump.

NOTE :
The camshaft drive sprockets also form the thrust faces for the camshaft endfloat. In production the endfloat is 0.065mm to 0.185mm. In service, if the endfloat is out of specification, the camshaft(s) or cylinder head(s) may have to be replaced.

Primary drive is provided by a single toothed belt from the crankshaft to the exhaust camshaft gears of each cylinder bank via two idler pulleys and a tensioner.
Timing belt adjustment is carried out by an eccentric type tensioner mounted on the RH front face of the cylinder block.


Secondary drive is provided by two short crossover chains, which transfer drive from the exhaust camshaft gears to the inlet camshaft gears. The crossover drives are located at the rear of the RH cylinder bank and the front of the LH cylinder bank. This allows for a much shorter and simpler run for the main camshaft drive belt at the front of the engine.
Each crossover chain is tensioned via an automatic chain tensioner, which acts directly on the chains via a guide rail. The tensioners are located between the exhaust and inlet camshafts at the front or rear of the cylinder head, depending on the cylinder bank.

gstuart said:

Primary drive is provided by a single toothed belt from the crankshaft to the exhaust camshaft gears of each cylinder bank via two idler pulleys and a tensioner.
Timing belt adjustment is carried out by an eccentric type tensioner mounted on the RH front face of the cylinder block.


Secondary drive is provided by two short crossover chains, which transfer drive from the exhaust camshaft gears to the inlet camshaft gears. The crossover drives are located at the rear of the RH cylinder bank and the front of the LH cylinder bank. This allows for a much shorter and simpler run for the main camshaft drive belt at the front of the engine.
Each crossover chain is tensioned via an automatic chain tensioner, which acts directly on the chains via a guide rail. The tensioners are located between the exhaust and inlet camshafts at the front or rear of the cylinder head, depending on the cylinder bank.

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Your info is so helpful and this is the reason I've come on the forum!!
Thank you for all your info and help I'll keep you posted on my findings

Rnicholson90 said:

Your info is so helpful and this is the reason I've come on the forum!!
Thank you for all your info and help I'll keep you posted on my findings

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Ur very welcome and indeed Plse keep us posted

Lifting cam would logically be snapped bearing cap or retaining bolts or bent cam,good luck.

gstuart said:

Ur very welcome and indeed Plse keep us posted

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So finally after a year I'm getting the range rover brought 130miles up to me and Im going to get it stripped and see what's wrong with it! I've got a jag s type ready to strip and put in if it's beyond repair!! So I may need some info in a couple of weeks time when I finally get it in the workshop?!!!

gstuart said:

Ur very welcome and indeed Plse keep us posted

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Hi mate I've got my car up to where I live now and it's looking like cambelt tensioner failure which has caused the cam cap to snap when the pistons hit the valves, can you remove the cylinder heads with the body on or is it still body off job? Thanks

I have a similar issue where my camshaft chain snapped and also broke some of my lifters im now currently replacing parts although I'm not sure how to check if the timing is lined up correctly without lifting the body off

Don't think the worst could be just top end if as you seem to think cam has snapped had one with camchain snapped as mentioned due to tensioner failure no other damage you might get away with just a head, crank failure will usually lock engine solid and then not always the end of engine you have chosen best route covers off and fingers crossed

The crank moves freely same as passenger side cam. The cam shaft is not damaged only the lifters and chain however I am unsure how to do the timing as a side note the timing belt stripped the teeth on the crank pully. I have the replacement lifters chain and belt but I am unsure how to get it back in time.

Any advice or guidance would be brilliant thank you

Rnicholson90 said:

Oh don't worry I'll keep it all updated on here I hate reading forum post that don't have the outcome or the findings! I'm going back to my home town this weekend which is where my truck is so I'll be whipping the rocker covers of to see whats underneath

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There is a utube channel LR time they are a German couple who have rebuilt about 3 2.7 and 3.0 l engines for discovery 3 and 4 all in English and a good watch

Unfortunately it sounds like pistons and valves have met hence lifter damage head removal probably best at this point to assess further damage most likely bent valves

I have heard of the cam cap bolts snapping

tyregeezer said:

Unfortunately it sounds like pistons and valves have met hence lifter damage head removal probably best at this point to assess further damage

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At this point I wanted to just get the timing lined up first and try manual turning to assess then if needed strip the head off

lynall said:

I have heard of the cam cap bolts snapping

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When taking the rocker cover off the bolts holding the camshaft down were finger tight not sure if that's where they were stretched due to chain failure or whoever did the head work previously didn't tighten properly.

I have only owned this car for 2 months and was running fine till this happened but looks as though it has had head work as the camshaft bolts look new

Sorry if sounding dumb new to the landy scene but not wanting to give up on her yet

Don't give up mate seems that worst case is replacement head or rebuild about £300 at this point, look through a manual check out LRtime on YouTube give you idea, but you need to find what broke those lifters check the top of the valves that the rocker arms run on this will show damage if they have been impacted usually gouging

tyregeezer said:

Don't give up mate seems that worst case is replacement head or rebuild about £300 at this point, look through a manual check out LRtime on YouTube give you idea, but you need to find what broke those lifters check the top of the valves that the rocker arms run on this will show damage if they have been impacted usually gouging

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I shall look after work tonight and get back to you thank you

tyregeezer said:

Don't give up mate seems that worst case is replacement head or rebuild about £300 at this point, look through a manual check out LRtime on YouTube give you idea, but you need to find what broke those lifters check the top of the valves that the rocker arms run on this will show damage if they have been impacted usually gouging

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Looking at the valves there is no gouging that I could see the camshaft looks fine to so I'm not sure so now I want to get the timing right and turn manually to see if there is any problems and then go from there going through the list slowly will give an update when I have got that far.

Looking through the Haynes manual I can't see how to get the cams in time or where they should be I have found tdc on the crank but don't know how to get the camshafts in time with it so that Inlet and outlet are not open the same time? Of that's possible