At my wits end...help.

[EdoubleD]

After snapping off a stub hub bolt in the rear axle chassis of a D1 300tdi I've made the situation worse.
I tried welding a nut onto the bolt several times but because it's a high tensile bolt (and my beginner welding skills) the weld just kept snapping under the torque without budging the bolt.

I thought fine I'll drill it out, slowly moving up the diameter of drills. I stupidly moved from 6.5 to 8mm (m10 x1.5m hole) and have ended up taking some of the axle casing out with the drill. Probably about 0.5mm at the bottom of the hole See picture:

I'm really at my wits end with this and to be honest don't really know where to turn. I don't know how to get the rest of the bolt out and even if I do have I done too much damage to the casing.

I can get hold of another 300tdi axle casing but given how much of a disaster this job I'm reallt nervous about attempting to swap the lot. The vehicle is in the entrance to my work warehouse and I need it gone as it will be in the way in the very near future.

Any advice or opinions on the casing change would be appreciated, I'm very much at my wits end with this....if I wasn't a grown man I could cry to be honest!

 

[Magicgrotto]

FOOOK WIT comes to mind ! As you have now drilled thru the thread you should be able to collapse the rest of the bolt with a HAMMER & CHISEL !
And when you come to put it back together DON'T go mad with the Spanners !

 

[Dippypud]

Stud extractor might work or just bash it, but take care, too much force can crack the flange...

 

[neilly]

I thought from your previous post you had a friendly neighbourhood landy man going to give you a hand.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/broken-bolt-help.314452/
Looks like you have gone seriously off ctr , so even a helicoil is not going to be much use.
If you only need to move it out of the way ,then reassembling as is with one knackered bolt and move it. Then spray all bolts with penetratng spray and get a frien or two with the right kit to help you do an axle change. By the looks of your previous post the axle is very rusty, so who knows what state the other fixing bolts / nuts are in.

Good luck,

 

[Magicgrotto]

I thought from your previous post you had a friendly neighbourhood landy man going to give you a hand

May have had a look & done a runner !

 

[EdoubleD]

I thought from your previous post you had a friendly neighbourhood landy man going to give you a hand.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/broken-bolt-help.314452/
Looks like you have gone seriously off ctr , so even a helicoil is not going to be much use.
If you only need to move it out of the way ,then reassembling as is with one knackered bolt and move it. Then spray all bolts with penetratng spray and get a frien or two with the right kit to help you do an axle change. By the looks of your previous post the axle is very rusty, so who knows what state the other fixing bolts / nuts are in.

Good luck,

yes I did but he's not around and I stupidly forged on. It's a captive bolt but isn't blind. I'm wondering if I drill it whether it's a bad idea to then bolt the other side?
And yes the axle is rusty, I don't know any one with the right kit who's not a garage machanic and so therefore ££. The guy I was going to use would still have wanted some money I might as well take it to them either way now.

 

[GATSO]

put the stub back on as a guide to try and re center the hole ,,,slowly

 

[Magicgrotto]

Is it me or do I need new GLASSES ? The PICY I see you have drilled IT ! & my understanding is that you drilled a bit off centre so you should have broke thru the thread ! IF that is the case then you should be able to TW*T wots left with a Hammer & chisel & get it to move !

 

[gstuart]

Is it me or do I need new GLASSES ? The PICY I see you have drilled IT ! & my understanding is that you drilled a bit off centre so you should have broke thru the thread ! IF that is the case then you should be able to TW*T wots left with a Hammer & chisel & get it to move !

daft question, yeh i know , lol

wondering if a bit of heat would help

 

[neilly]

daft question, yeh i know , lol

wondering if a bit of heat would help

The welding of the nut onto it, should have put quite a bit of heat into it....You would hope.

Cheers

 

[gstuart]

The welding of the nut onto it, should have put quite a bit of heat into it....You would hope.

Cheers

true, got one of the butane torches, the small plumber canister type , has been useful in the past

does look drilled out, wonder if it can be knocked it in on itself ,

had to use some heat the other day , in getting a seized up bolt that was holding my old air tank in, what a job that was , nothing like a challenge

 

[jamesmartin]

put the stub back on as a guide to try and re center the hole ,,,slowly

exactly using a 10mm drill bit to get the center started then a 2 or 3mm bit

 

[EdoubleD]

The welding of the nut onto it, should have put quite a bit of heat into it....You would hope.

Cheers

I mig welded a nut on three times at a touch over 100amps which should of got the penetration I needed and certainly heated the bolt up a fair bit but alas the welds would not hold once I put anything over about 10 - 15nm torque on it. With the current I was a bit worried about overheating the actual axle case and making it brittle, as you can see it's not in the best shape.

I've also heated it with a blow torch hoping to get it out with grips before I went down the welding route. All the other bolts were heated and while stiff came out ok. I tapped them with an m10 x 1.5 to clean them up.

Regards the drilling, yes have ended up drilling off centre but haven't quite gone through the thread. As someone said I think the best I can do here is to fit the new stub axle then use that as a guide for drilling an M10 hole, securely fasten on the other side using a nylock nut and threadlock combined with a touch of silicone to fill the mess where the paper gasket/seal will sit flush to the case

I guess we all have to learn some how and I'm definitely one of those people who learns by mistakes. I'm fairly new to working on the car but have done a number of engine related jobs which have been OK (starter, fuel lift, valve clearances, timing belt etc). This thread is probably hilarious for some people but not so much for me....such is life.

 

[neilly]

exactly using a 10mm drill bit to get the center started then a 2 or 3mm bit

I sadly think he is way beyond that . Would have been a good way to start to.

Cheers

 

[jamesmartin]

I sadly think he is way beyond that . Would have been a good way to start to.

Cheers

he has welder, very little is unsalvageable

 

[neilly]

new stub axle then use that as a guide for drilling an M10 hole,

If you are going to do this, then double check the diameter of the hole in the stub axle. to get a drill bit that fits and is in the ctr , you will probably need a bigger size. When you say drilling an M10 hole what size do you mean?

Cheers

 

[EdoubleD]

If you are going to do this, then double check the diameter of the hole in the stub axle. to get a drill bit that fits and is in the ctr , you will probably need a bigger size. When you say drilling an M10 hole what size do you mean?

Cheers

Correct if I'm wrong but I thought m10 x 1.5mm required a 8.38mm for 100% thread engagement. So I would start with 8mm, for 70% it's 8.86mm so at a push I'll go up to 9 but obviously I want the high tensile bolt to be as snug as possible.

 

[neilly]

Correct if I'm wrong but I thought m10 x 1.5mm required a 8.38mm for 100% thread engagement. So I would start with 8mm, for 70% it's 8.86mm so at a push I'll go up to 9 but obviously I want the high tensile bolt to be as snug as possible.

OK, I assumed you were going to use the stub axle as a guide to get the ctr of the drill way. Otherwise you are drilling in what could be a 10.5mm /11mm hole in the stub axle with an 8,5mm drill, which as you have already shown can lead to wandering off of ctr.As you said about fitting a Nyloc onto the back of it.
A tapping drill if you are going to tap anything is 8.5mm for an M10 coarse thread, not sure how you are getting your calculations there.

Cheers

 

[jamesmartin]

Correct if I'm wrong but I thought m10 x 1.5mm required a 8.38mm for 100% thread engagement. So I would start with 8mm, for 70% it's 8.86mm so at a push I'll go up to 9 but obviously I want the high tensile bolt to be as snug as possible.

start with a 10mm drill to get a true center then use a small drill then drill to tapping size,

 

[EdoubleD]

start with a 10mm drill to get a true center then use a small drill then drill to tapping size,

OK thanks, I clearly need treating like a bit of an idiot if you've read the thread. When you say tapping size, what size do you mean?