Freelander 1 Fornt brake lower guide pin stuck

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Hippo

Hippo

Lord Hippo
Posts
55,092
The bottom guide pins on the front brakes both sides seem to be stiff and near seized. Top one is ok. It seems to be the rubber around the guide pin which causes the fault (not the dust cover rubber). There’s no rust that I can see. Just seems to be tight and the rubber on the guide pin seems to want to move over the lip on the guide pin thus causing it to get stuck. Going to get replacements but will it be the guide pin at fault or the socket hole thing in the calliper body? Does this socket come out or is it part of the calliper? And what do you use on yours - Copper grease?
 
Thanks. I did have a go at cleaning out the hole but it didn't work. So I thought new part next.
 
The pin will always "rust" into the calliper as it is a dissimilar metal. Clean the pin with emery cloth and then (as JM said) clean out the hole using a drill bit and some WD40 or Joker 440. The drill bit should be an easy fit, it's not the aim to remove any metal and enlarge the hole, just to remove the foreign material that is stopping the pin from moving freely. Spray the drill bit, push it in and out and spin it around (by hand) until no rust or grime is on the drill bit.

Clean off the area with brake cleaner and coat the pin with Copperslip, push it in and out of the hole a few times, clean off any excess grease, replace the pads and repeat the process. Everything should slide smoothly in and out.

You'll need to redo this at least once every year possibly twice on the lower pins.

If you have some silicone grease this is better for the rubber (than oil based).

Is this your first attempt a DiY mechanics Help I Permanently Piss On-myself ? Remember to wear gloves and not to get any grease on the pads or the surface of the brake disk. The key to most of these jobs is 'mechanical sympathy', if you need to force it in/out/on/off then something is wrong.
 
Hippo said:
The bottom guide pins on the front brakes both sides seem to be stiff and near seized. Top one is ok. It seems to be the rubber around the guide pin which causes the fault (not the dust cover rubber). There’s no rust that I can see. Just seems to be tight and the rubber on the guide pin seems to want to move over the lip on the guide pin thus causing it to get stuck. Going to get replacements but will it be the guide pin at fault or the socket hole thing in the calliper body? Does this socket come out or is it part of the calliper? And what do you use on yours - Copper grease?
Click to expand...
Exactly the problem we had. Two types of guide pins. Early brakes have plain pins you have later type.. Your top pins are plain the lower ones have a plastic sleeve which deteriorates with age. No sign of rust. Copper grease doesn't help.
We bought a guide pin set part no SEE100340 @ £18. Comes with special grease. Still slightly stiffer than top pins.
 
JonFre said:
Exactly the problem we had. Two types of guide pins. Early brakes have plain pins you have later type.. Your top pins are plain the lower ones have a plastic sleeve which deteriorates with age. No sign of rust. Copper grease doesn't help.
We bought a guide pin set part no SEE100340 @ £18. Comes with special grease. Still slightly stiffer than top pins.
Click to expand...
Hi.
Will be getting a new set of pins too. Had another go today. For some reason the rubber around the pin wants to push off when sliding the pin in. As you say the copper grease doesn't help much. It's as if the rubber is a bit too big for the pin. Hence buying some more. I did clean out the hole as per the drill bit suggestion from James but still having problems. So I'll get some new pins on order from the stealer tomorrow. Currently the pin does move a bit but it's not as free as I think it should be. Brakes work ok but it's something I picked up on during service checks and would like to make it right. Pads/disks were changed this time last year. All is ok except for the pins.
 
theres no inherent issue with using copper slip or any grease ,if you have nylon bush thats been altered by corrossion it will be tight
 
Thanks. Not sure whats causing it. Will have another look at the hole and see when I fit the new pins. The rubber round the pins wants to slide off the end of the pin as you push it in, so it's difficult to get the pin in. Same for pulling it out. It's as if the rubber is gripping the hole. Whn the rubber comes off it travels over a wider lip on the pin. I think it's this which make the pin stick as the pin+lip+rubber is too wide for the hole. But from what I saw the hole was ok.
 
jamesmartin said:
theres no inherent issue with using copper slip or any grease ,if you have nylon bush thats been altered by corrossion it will be tight
Click to expand...

Not on Nylon no, but petroleum based greases do break down rubber compounds and will overtime degrade it's elasticity. Copper grease cotains petroleum distillates that will attack rubber in this way and shouldn't be used if it is in contact with rubber. Silicone grease (an organic compound) is safe with rubber and will not degrade it's properties.

I take it these is a nylon sleeve over the brake pin to stop any dissimilar metal corrosion between the brake pad backing and the pin and to allow it to stay in place ?

This sounds like a good idea but given the forces and the temperatures generated as the pads try to fly off the disk i'm surprised it's Nylon, Teflon maybe, i'd have though Nylon would deform to quickly.

Possibly the reason there is a sleeve only on one pin is to ensure that the pad stays close to the disk at all times (?) possibly the braking design requires the pad to 'flop-on' and off the disk using a trailing edge (?) and the stiffer pin aids that ? Being on the bottom it would certainly discourage 'snatch' as the pad meets the disk.
I wouldn't worry if the pins seem tight as the pressure involved will easily move the pad, a little centripetal movement on the upper pin won't hurt either although it's better if the pads do move on and off the disk in a parrallel fashion.

Anyway well done Hippo, you strung your last post together with a good understanding of punctuation, grammar and spelling.
 
All sorted now. Never had a problem before with stuck pins. Cleaned out the copper grease and fitted new pins. Used the grease stuff that came with them. Pins now move easily and don’t need mole grips to pull them out. The rubber around the pins is secure and doesn’t slide off the pin, which is the problem I was having before. £16.64 including allegiance discount.

New pins. Part no SEE100340 from main dealer:

Y41wjBH.jpg

DSCN2584 Y41wjBH

New and old pins. Note the rubber is wider on the old pin. Also not as long because I cut the end off.

nraqyEi.jpg

DSCN2588 nraqyEi

Grease that came with them:

BCoZXS7.jpg

DSCN2589 BCoZXS7

LYrTzUP.jpg

pinlube1 LYrTzUP

mAvmQ7N.jpg

pinlube2 mAvmQ7N
 
Last edited:
Hippo said:
All sorted now. Never had a problem before with stuck pins. Cleaned out the copper grease and fitted new pins. Used the grease stuff that came with them. Pins now move easily and don’t need mole grips to pull them out. The rubber around the pins is secure and doesn’t slide off the pin, which is the problem I was having before. £16.64 including allegiance discount.
Click to expand...
Hippo said:
Excellent info and pics for the archives. They would have saved us some hassle if you had posted just 4 weeks earlier before we did disc and pads change on our two TD4's!
Click to expand...
 
The grease stuff above in post 14 that came with me new pins... would it be any good for putting in the sunroof motor gear? The plastic gear bit which you can put a screw driver in (push in to release mechanisum before turning) and turn, allows you to grease the gear through the screwdriver slot. So far I haven't found anything that solves the motor problem permanently. Spray grease etc only sorts it for 2 weeks then it starts to stick. Fuse has been taken out for a while but I would like my escape hatch to work again.
 
Hippo said:
The grease stuff above in post 14 that came with me new pins... would it be any good for putting in the sunroof motor gear? The plastic gear bit which you can put a screw driver in (push in to release mechanisum before turning) and turn, allows you to grease the gear through the screwdriver slot. So far I haven't found anything that solves the motor problem permanently. Spray grease etc only sorts it for 2 weeks then it starts to stick. Fuse has been taken out for a while but I would like my escape hatch to work again.
Click to expand...
Worth a try, should not do any harm.
 
Anyone know what trw grease in the pic's above is called? Would be nice to be able to buy a tube of it. Thanks.
 
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