Wheels & inner tubes

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suew

Well-Known Member
Posts
9,190
Location
Leeds
No need to take the **** or tell me to do a search AS

1. I know I'm clueless :D
2. I did search :p

So for the questions

1. Why do my original wheels need inner tubes
2. If I replace them with different (wider) steel wheels will I still need an inner tube. I would much rather not have them and the tyres I want are tubeless
3. If I do still need to have inner tubes will new tubeless tyres work with them

I dont really want alloys I just want some black steel ones which are a bit wider about 7" I think.

Thank you

Oh and the reason I dont want tubes is Redhand suggested that instead of two spares I carry one and some tyreweld stuff which would mean less weight and clutter in the 90.
 
from what i understand its mainly a safety thing.

If a tubeless tyre gets a puncture then the tyre deflates slowly through the hole caused by the puncture. If its a tubed tyre then it can burst like a baloon and cause the tyre to deflate very quickly kinda like a blow out.

Some challenge trucks run tubes to help keep the tyre pressing on the rim when they are running low pressure and steep angles.
 
think its all down to the rims design.
my aftermarket steel wheels have valves fitted but are of the fatter type as used on propper trackters & stuff,
but I did buy a second hand tyre from a local place that fitted a tube in it??
was nothing but trouble for weeks, I took it back twice,
asked why he tubed it,
he said they rip out the old valves and fit new,
then found they never had a match for my rim.
so I bought half a dozen correct sized ones online,
and without a tyre changer,
relying on my old banger racing day skills,
took the tyre of the rim, took the feckin tube out, fitted a new correct valve,
put the tyre back on,
and been trouble free since...









completely wore out this old man,
but one who triumphed while saying,
I dunnit.....



took to me bed almost later...........:)
 
I think its only illegal to have tubes inside tubeless designed tyres if that makes sense.


+1
yep !

oh, tyre weld in a can...

some say ****e ??

then why do modern car makers not fit a spare wheel or tyre from new, but supply a can of tyreweld instead...



Dooohhhhh ...................lol

use`em fer years matey....
2 cans fer a landie wheel though,
as even god cant fill all that void inside a big tyre with just one blow !
 
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No need to take the **** or tell me to do a search AS

1. I know I'm clueless :D
2. I did search :p

So for the questions

1. Why do my original wheels need inner tubes
2. If I replace them with different (wider) steel wheels will I still need an inner tube. I would much rather not have them and the tyres I want are tubeless
3. If I do still need to have inner tubes will new tubeless tyres work with them

I dont really want alloys I just want some black steel ones which are a bit wider about 7" I think.

Thank you

Oh and the reason I dont want tubes is Redhand suggested that instead of two spares I carry one and some tyreweld stuff which would mean less weight and clutter in the 90.

Hi Sue
 
At last, a tyre question that is unlikely to get flamed!

1. That's all down to the construction of the wheel, older wheels tended to be made in two parts; rim and centre and then they were rivetted together. That led to the problem of air leaking from in the tyre through the rivet holes. Tubes stopped that.

2. If the replacement wheels have the rim and centre welded together, in other words the wheel is designed for tubeless tyres then no you shouldn't put tubes in them.

3. Apart from being unlawful, tubes in tubeless tyres isn't a good idea, what happens is that air gets trapped between the inside of the tyre and the tube and doesn't have a way out. This can lead to these little pockets of air overheating while in use which can cause all sorts of problems which the tyre wasn't designed to handle, and ultimately could cause a catastrophic failure.

Tyreweld is OK when used for it's designed purpose; to give you a temporary fix to a puncture in the tread area, not the sidewall of the tyre and get you to a tyre fitter who can remove, repair and refit a damaged tyre. The main problems with it are some tyre fitters don't like the mess it can make inside the tyre and secondly, the size of Landy tyres is generally larger than Joe Bloggs' car tyres. That can mean that the Tyreweld can might leave the tyre grossly under-inflated, for that reason I also carry a T-Max compressor.

On the subject of alloys or steely-wheels, that can be down to the problems with corrosion on the inside edge of the rim seal with the tyre bead. Alloy corrosion tends to leave deeper pits and scoring than on steel wheels which can result in air leaks from the seal giving the same symptoms as a slow puncture.


 
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Hi Sue
 
At last, a tyre question that is unlikely to get flamed!

1. That's all down to the construction of the wheel, older wheels tended to be made in two parts; rim and centre and then they were rivetted together. That led to the problem of air leaking from in the tyre through the rivet holes. Tubes stopped that.

2. If the replacement wheels have the rim and centre welded together, in other words the wheel is designed for tubeless tyres then no you shouldn't put tubes in them.

3. Apart from being unlawful, tubes in tubeless tyres isn't a good idea, what happens is that air gets trapped between the inside of the tyre and the tube and doesn't have a way out. This can lead to these little pockets of air overheating while in use which can cause all sorts of problems which the tyre wasn't designed to handle, and ultimately could cause a catastrophic failure.

Tyreweld is OK when used for it's designed purpose; to give you a temporary fix to a puncture in the tread area, not the sidewall of the tyre and get you to a tyre fitter who can remove, repair and refit a damaged tyre. The main problems with it are some tyre fitters don't like the mess it can make inside the tyre and secondly, the size of Landy tyres is generally larger than Joe Bloggs' car tyres. That can mean that the Tyreweld can might leave the tyre grossly under-inflated, for that reason I also carry a T-Max compressor.

On the subject of alloys or steely-wheels, that can be down to the problems with corrosion on the inside edge of the rim seal with the tyre bead. Alloy corrosion tends to leave deeper pits and scoring than on steel wheels which can result in air leaks from the seal giving the same symptoms as a slow puncture.


Thank you, I understand it now :D :D

As for the tyre weld stuff, it was to replace my 2nd spare which I carry due to being worried about driving without a spare if I got a puncture. I also carry a tyre inflator so it would only be needed if I got 2 punctures. Might be a good chance of it fixing 1 of them so I could get to the road and call Green Flag :confused:
 
Just to clear up a few misunderstandings re tyres and tubes , and peoples misconceptions esp re being unlawful !
Tubeless tyres in good condition, both new and retreads, fitted to the appropriate wheels and operated correctly, do not need inner tubes however there are some circumstances when it is useful to use a tube. When tubes are fitted, it is important for the user to understand the potential drawbacks.

When a tubeless tyre is punctured, the penetrating object is gripped by the inner liner (the built-in tube) and thus air loss through the penetration will be gradual. By contrast, when a tube type or a tubeless tyre fitted with a tube is punctured, once the tube is penetrated, air loss will normally be sudden. In this case, air will rapidly escape through the valve hole in the wheel and between the tyre beads and the wheel which, with a tube fitted, no longer provides a hermetic seal. Sudden pressure loss in a tyre can result in bead dislodgement and a loss of vehicle control.
When a tube is fitted to any tyre, it is important that the inside of the tyre is carefully examined to ensure that there is no feature which could cause premature tube failure due to cuts or chafing. Such examples are:-

Any tire manufacturer’s paper or plastic identification labels must be removed and label indentations buffed smooth.
Damage to the inside of the tyre, possibly due to a previous penetration or repair can lead to chafing of the tube and subsequent failure.
The increased thickness of the tyre / tube assembly can cause running temperatures to increase and could under prolonged conditions cause premature tyre failure.

Not withstanding the potential hazards, there are circumstances when the use of tubes may be recommended. The following points should be noted:

Inner tubes must be fitted to all tyres that are NOT marked as “Tubeless” and to all tyres marked as “Tube Type”.
Always use a new tube in a tyre with matching size marking.
NEVER install a non-radial tube in a radial tyres
Inner tubes should also be used:

Where tubeless tyres are fitted to non-safety wheels or multi-piece wheels.
Where tubeless tyres are fitted with wire spoked wheels where air could otherwise escape through the spoke holes in the wheel.

Inner tubes should not be used as a means of repairing a puncture to a tubeless tyre, as a proper repair should be carried out to retain the tubeless properties of the tyre.
The fitment of tubes to tyres of 65 series and lower is not recommended.
If correct size tubes are not available, an alternative size tube should NOT be used.

Wire wheels, multi-piece wheels and some single piece wheels designed for tube type applications CANNOT be used as tubeless fitments and the use of a tube (regardless of whether the tyre is “tube type” or “tubeless”) is ESSENTIAL FOR SAFETY. Always use tubes in such fitments.
© Cooper Tire & Rubber Company Europe Limited

Also not mentioned is fitting a tube to a punctured tubeless tyre may affect the speed rating of the tyre , (this is more related to W an V ratings)
Getting hold of the right size tube can be difficult as most tyre (fast fit types) firms want to sell you a new tyre !!!

Tyres will usually last longer tubeless, as they run cooler (also one of the advantages of nitrogen inflation) , tubeless are more puncture friendly, and are preferable on overland 4x4 as can be repaired insitu in most instances , or can allow reinflation to repair at a more convenient (safer ) location or time eg not midday sun in desert areas. HTSH
 
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Thank you, as someone said earlier, a tyre thread which is useful :D :D

If they were all like this there would be a point to searching :p:D
 
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