series question about BOLTS

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A

Andy

Guest
Hiya guys,

right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
on a series land rover,

im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.

all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,

andy
 
Andy wrote:
> Hiya guys,
>
> right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
> on a series land rover,

Aha - first problem. I doubt you'll find any other vehicle with as much
of an assortment of different threads and sizes as a series Landrover.
Depending on the year the will have a mixture of some or all of the
following: BSF, Whitworth, UNF, UNC and metric. In accordance with
Murphy's law, the commonest size on *your* Landrover is the one you
haven't got a spanner for.
>
> im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
> of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.

2nd problem - most of the ones you'll need for rebuilding are likely to
be specialised fasteners anyway (door hinge bolts, etc) so you'll
probably end up buying them "on demand" when you need them. Quite apart
from which, bolts are bloody expensive - you probably won't want to have
a lot of money tied up in bolts on the off chance you may need them.
>
> all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
> spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,

Because bolt size and spanner size don't always correlate eg an M8 bolt
commonly has either a 12mm (JIS) or 13mm (ISO) head. Also the thread
pitch can vary - "normal" M8 is M8x1.25mm, but 1.00mm is also used.


--
EMB
change two to number to reply
 

"Andy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hiya guys,
>
> right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
> on a series land rover,
>
> im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
> of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.
>
> all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
> spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,
>
Because the heads are not always the same size for the same size of thread.

In general.........
M3 = 5.5mm spanner
M4 = 7mm spanner
M5 = 8mm spanner
M6 = 10mm spanner
M8 = 13mm spanner
M10= 17mm spanner
M12= 19mm spanner
M16= 24mm spanner

The japs tend to use smaller a/f sizes for the same size thread.

But, all this talk of M.etc will be irrelevant if you are building a series,
as you will be into UNC/UNF and whitworth.

The whitworth system is far simpler, i.e. you tighten a 1/4 whit bolt with a
1/4 whit spanner!


 
On or around Sat, 07 Aug 2004 23:50:28 +0100, Andy <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>Hiya guys,
>
>right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
>on a series land rover,
>
>im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
>of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.
>
>all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
>spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,

I think you'll find that most of the bolts on a series are (meant to be)
pre-metric, specially if it's an old one.

UNF and UNC, for the most part. You'll find plenty of 1/4" UNF and 5/16"
UNF on the bodywork, even on early 90/110s there are still some. Most of
the bodywork ones are about 1" long. some are shorter, some longer.

common UNF/UNC sizes:
thread head a/f
1/4" 7/16"
5/16" 1/2"
3/8" 9/16"
7/16" 5/8"
1/2" 11/16"
9/16" 3/4"

common metric sizes:
thread head ISO other head - often with captive "washer"
6mm 10mm 8mm those have a name, but I've
8mm 13mm 10mm forgotten it again.
10mm 17mm 14mm
12mm 19mm 17mm

but they're not all guranteed to have the same size heads - sometimes, as
well, you'll find a different size nut.

all sorts of funny-sized heads/nuts on the 300 TDi, including quite a number
of 15mm a/f on 10mm threads.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
Too Busy: Your mind is like a motorway. Sometimes it can be jammed by
too much traffic. Avoid the jams by never using your mind on a
Bank Holiday weekend.
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 
I have a set of metric and imperial sockets, when one does not fit the other
does, and when none fit the nut is rounded.

When I put bolts back in I use whatever fits in the hole and sometimes with
a bloody big washer.

--
Larry
Series 3 rust and holes

"Austin Shackles" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:eek:[email protected]...
> On or around Sat, 07 Aug 2004 23:50:28 +0100, Andy <[email protected]>
> enlightened us thusly:
>
>
> I think you'll find that most of the bolts on a series are (meant to be)
> pre-metric, specially if it's an old one.
>
> UNF and UNC, for the most part. You'll find plenty of 1/4" UNF and 5/16"
> UNF on the bodywork, even on early 90/110s there are still some. Most of
> the bodywork ones are about 1" long. some are shorter, some longer.
>
> common UNF/UNC sizes:
> thread head a/f
> 1/4" 7/16"
> 5/16" 1/2"
> 3/8" 9/16"
> 7/16" 5/8"
> 1/2" 11/16"
> 9/16" 3/4"
>
> common metric sizes:
> thread head ISO other head - often with captive "washer"
> 6mm 10mm 8mm those have a name, but I've
> 8mm 13mm 10mm forgotten it again.
> 10mm 17mm 14mm
> 12mm 19mm 17mm
>
> but they're not all guranteed to have the same size heads - sometimes, as
> well, you'll find a different size nut.
>
> all sorts of funny-sized heads/nuts on the 300 TDi, including quite a
number
> of 15mm a/f on 10mm threads.
> --
> Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
> Too Busy: Your mind is like a motorway. Sometimes it can be jammed by
> too much traffic. Avoid the jams by never using your mind on a
> Bank Holiday weekend.
> from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.


 
Austin Shackles wrote:

>
> common UNF/UNC sizes:
> thread head a/f
> 1/4" 7/16"
> 5/16" 1/2"
> 3/8" 9/16"
> 7/16" 5/8" bolt head & 11/16 nut <<<----
> 1/2" 3/4" <<<----
> 9/16" 13/16" <<<----

Couple of minor corrections as per <<<----

--
EMB
change two to number to reply
 
On Saturday, in article
<[email protected]>
[email protected] "Andy" wrote:

> Hiya guys,
>
> right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
> on a series land rover,

Probably 3.7mm Whitworth...

> im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
> of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.
>
> all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
> spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,

Seriously, the series construction was in the era of Imperial bolts, and
a lot of them were Whitworth threads. In a lot of places a metric nut
and bolt would be fine. But be consistent. Don't have three metric and
four Whitworth holding the wing on.

(And the lens-mount thread on old Leica cameras is apparently Whitworth
profile, Imperial pitch, and metric diameter...)

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."
 
On Sunday, in article <[email protected]>
[email protected] "SimonJ" wrote:

> The whitworth system is far simpler, i.e. you tighten a 1/4 whit bolt with a
> 1/4 whit spanner!

My father tells me they shifted the relationship a step during WW2, and
really old Whitworths have a bigger head. I ought to ask the Vicar, his
steam engines are old enough for that to crop up.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."
 
> I have a set of metric and imperial sockets, when one does not fit the
other
> does, and when none fit the nut is rounded.
>
Time for the gas spanner!

> When I put bolts back in I use whatever fits in the hole and sometimes
with
> a bloody big washer.
>
You must be a rover factory trained technician!! ;)


 
But the Leica thread became a classic for compact cameras, especially when
the cheap Russian Imitations flooded the market.

Same could be said for the Pentax 42mm thread that had a long hold until
they eventually succumbed and went bayonet.

I still say from the latest digital Pentax to any of the older post 42 mm
thread varieties you have access to the widest set of lenses available, as
even the digital body can take the old screw threads with an adaptor.

As for versatility I like the K1000 a sort of series go anywhere Pentax :)

whoops that is totally OT


--
Larry
Series 3 rust and holes

""David G. Bell"" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Saturday, in article
> <[email protected]>
> [email protected] "Andy" wrote:
>
>
> Seriously, the series construction was in the era of Imperial bolts, and
> a lot of them were Whitworth threads. In a lot of places a metric nut
> and bolt would be fine. But be consistent. Don't have three metric and
> four Whitworth holding the wing on.
>
> (And the lens-mount thread on old Leica cameras is apparently Whitworth
> profile, Imperial pitch, and metric diameter...)
>
> --
> David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.
>
> "History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
> was bitten by a radioactive spider."


 
I have a set of metric and imperial sockets, when one does not fit the other
does, and when none fit the nut is rounded.

When I put bolts back in I use whatever fits in the hole and sometimes with
a bloody big washer.

--
Larry
Series 3 rust and holes

"Austin Shackles" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:eek:[email protected]...
> On or around Sat, 07 Aug 2004 23:50:28 +0100, Andy <[email protected]>
> enlightened us thusly:
>
>
> I think you'll find that most of the bolts on a series are (meant to be)
> pre-metric, specially if it's an old one.
>
> UNF and UNC, for the most part. You'll find plenty of 1/4" UNF and 5/16"
> UNF on the bodywork, even on early 90/110s there are still some. Most of
> the bodywork ones are about 1" long. some are shorter, some longer.
>
> common UNF/UNC sizes:
> thread head a/f
> 1/4" 7/16"
> 5/16" 1/2"
> 3/8" 9/16"
> 7/16" 5/8"
> 1/2" 11/16"
> 9/16" 3/4"
>
> common metric sizes:
> thread head ISO other head - often with captive "washer"
> 6mm 10mm 8mm those have a name, but I've
> 8mm 13mm 10mm forgotten it again.
> 10mm 17mm 14mm
> 12mm 19mm 17mm
>
> but they're not all guranteed to have the same size heads - sometimes, as
> well, you'll find a different size nut.
>
> all sorts of funny-sized heads/nuts on the 300 TDi, including quite a
number
> of 15mm a/f on 10mm threads.
> --
> Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
> Too Busy: Your mind is like a motorway. Sometimes it can be jammed by
> too much traffic. Avoid the jams by never using your mind on a
> Bank Holiday weekend.
> from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.


 
The message <[email protected]>
from Andy <[email protected]> contains these words:

> Hiya guys,

> right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
> on a series land rover,

> im just sort of rebuilding mine and wanted to go out and get a dollap
> of nuts and bolts, but not sure what to get.

> all this M6 M8 confuses me, why cant they sell them by the size of
> spanner required to do em up. id know where i was then,

> andy
Look in mags for LR fasteners, bite the bullet pay the price and get a
fully labled seperately bagged set of nuts bolts washers etc to do the
job you set out to do. Amazing how it improves life, if not the wallet,
but then my local supplier charges UKP 1 to 5 for a pack of 1/2 doz nuts
and bolts depending on size, and the last time I used a major
distributor "Lamberts" it was minimum order 500 .
 
Larry wrote:
>
> But the Leica thread became a classic for compact cameras, especially when
> the cheap Russian Imitations flooded the market.
>
> Same could be said for the Pentax 42mm thread that had a long hold until
> they eventually succumbed and went bayonet.
>
> I still say from the latest digital Pentax to any of the older post 42 mm
> thread varieties you have access to the widest set of lenses available, as
> even the digital body can take the old screw threads with an adaptor.
>
> As for versatility I like the K1000 a sort of series go anywhere Pentax :)
>
> whoops that is totally OT
>

My first decent SLR camera, that was. I won a few competitions with
one. I still have an excellent condition K1000 and it's predecessor the
Spotmatic F.

--
Regards,
Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.dannyscoffee.com (UK advert for my mobile espresso service)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/European online ordering for Malabar
Gold blend)
swap Z for above characters in email address to reply
 
> but then my local supplier charges UKP 1 to 5 for a pack of 1/2 doz nuts
> and bolts depending on size, and the last time I used a major
> distributor "Lamberts" it was minimum order 500 .

Try screwfix


 
danny wrote:
> >>
>> As for versatility I like the K1000 a sort of series go anywhere
>> Pentax :)
>>
>> whoops that is totally OT
>>
>
> My first decent SLR camera, that was.

Mine too.

> I won a few competitions with
> one.

I never entered any, but some of my best photos were taken with it.

> I still have an excellent condition K1000 and it's predecessor
> the Spotmatic F.

Sold mine, and wish I hadn't. Dad had a Spotmatic, and my Mum GAVE IT AWAY
to a relative who expressed a vague interest in it, when he died. I was
completely gutted. By the time I found out, he had lost it, or sold it, or
something.

A "Series" camera - I like it.



--
--
Rich

Land Rovers
Boat
Dog
Wife
Kids - in that order


 
David G. Bell wrote:

> On Saturday, in article
> <[email protected]>
> [email protected] "Andy" wrote:
>
>> Hiya guys,
>>
>> right, just need to know what the most common sized nut and bolts are
>> on a series land rover,
>
(snip)

> Seriously, the series construction was in the era of Imperial bolts, and
> a lot of them were Whitworth threads. In a lot of places a metric nut
> and bolt would be fine. But be consistent. Don't have three metric and
> four Whitworth holding the wing on.
>
(snip)

Actually, while Whitworth were used to some extent, most of the body bolts
(which is what you are mainly talking about here) on Series one were BSF,
or BA in the smaller sizes. The BSF gradually changed through the early
sixties to UNF, and by the end of Series three production some metric sizes
were creeping in (But my 86 110 still has a lot of UNF).

Probably the most common sizes are 1/4" UNF in 1" and 1 1/2" lengths, and
5/16" UNF in 1 1/2" and 2" lengths, and 4 and 6 BA 1/2" or 3/4" long. In
Series 1 (+S2 & early S2a) the UNF would have been BSF. All body bolts and
nuts should be galvanised (not zinc plated) or, for Series 1 (early at
least) Sherardized - which is virtually unobtainable today.

Many Landrover owners replace these with metric sizes, and it is up to you
whether you do this. Some use stainless steel, but this must be done with
caution, avoiding electrical contact between the alloy body panels and
Stainless steel. In any case, use anti-seize compound in assembly.

JD

 
On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
[email protected] "Richard Brookman" wrote:

> danny wrote:
> > >>
> >> As for versatility I like the K1000 a sort of series go anywhere
> >> Pentax :)
> >>
> >> whoops that is totally OT
> >>
> >
> > My first decent SLR camera, that was.
>
> Mine too.
>
> > I won a few competitions with
> > one.
>
> I never entered any, but some of my best photos were taken with it.
>
> > I still have an excellent condition K1000 and it's predecessor
> > the Spotmatic F.
>
> Sold mine, and wish I hadn't. Dad had a Spotmatic, and my Mum GAVE IT AWAY
> to a relative who expressed a vague interest in it, when he died. I was
> completely gutted. By the time I found out, he had lost it, or sold it, or
> something.
>
> A "Series" camera - I like it.

The Fed-2 is quite good.

Check my brother's photo site, and the Ely cathedral pictures, at
jfbell20.fotopages.com -- I think he used his Fed for that, a fifties
design, while the lens is a piece of 21st Century kit.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."
 
I have an old spotmatic too but the meter is none too reliable these days.
The K1000 though goes on for ever, I also like the ME supers, nice and
compact. Olympus were the original compact SLR and then Pentax made a rather
unsucessful 110 SLR of all things, but now SLR's have got bigger and bulkier
again. Why Nikons had such a bulky motordrive I'll never know, completely
over the top but at the time it marked out the press photographer, (who seem
to have gone over to Canons these days, the fickleness of fashion)

--
Larry
Series 3 rust and holes

"danny" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Larry wrote:

>
> My first decent SLR camera, that was. I won a few competitions with
> one. I still have an excellent condition K1000 and it's predecessor the
> Spotmatic F.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Danny
>
> http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
> http://www.dannyscoffee.com (UK advert for my mobile espresso service)
> http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/European online ordering for Malabar
> Gold blend)
> swap Z for above characters in email address to reply


 
On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 01:58:29 +0100, "Larry" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I have an old spotmatic too but the meter is none too reliable these days.
>The K1000 though goes on for ever, I also like the ME supers, nice and
>compact. Olympus were the original compact SLR and then Pentax made a rather
>unsucessful 110 SLR of all things, but now SLR's have got bigger and bulkier
>again. Why Nikons had such a bulky motordrive I'll never know, completely
>over the top but at the time it marked out the press photographer, (who seem
>to have gone over to Canons these days, the fickleness of fashion)

The SLR 110 was a superb camera - a real camera, but with a compact
film format and it really did fit in a pocket. Results were
suprisingly good, but film was limited to tourist-fodder stuff. No
slide film and no really slow or fast stuff.

I moved from Pentax (I used to have a Super A and an LX) a few years
back to an EOS. Far more useable than most Nikon's, but probably
lacking that nth degree of robustness.

The best pictures I ever took were with my (original) Olympus Trip. A
cracking lens, easy to use and somehow much better than any other
camera I've had since. I think it's because there is only one thing
to think about - i.e. what you are pointing it at.

One point about SLR's, which also applies to Series Land Rovers, is
that they have to be used. My Dad has one of every Pentax SLR ever
made up to the mid 80's when it all went wrong (a strange thing to
collect, but there you are). We were going to take a couple of
Spotmatics on a trip just for nostalgias sake and had to abandon the
idea. The shutters had all siezed slightly - not enough to lock
solid, but enough for the rear curtain to lag behind significantly.
--

Tim Hobbs

'58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig"
'77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt"
'95 Discovery V8i aka "The Disco" (FOR SALE)
'03 Volvo V70

My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk
Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com
Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com
 
Larry wrote:
> Same could be said for the Pentax 42mm thread that had a long hold until
> they eventually succumbed and went bayonet.
>
> I still say from the latest digital Pentax to any of the older post 42 mm
> thread varieties you have access to the widest set of lenses available, as
> even the digital body can take the old screw threads with an adaptor.
>
> As for versatility I like the K1000 a sort of series go anywhere Pentax :)
>

I think it was originally the Contax then Practica 42mm thread and was
adopted by Pentax. I used to have a Practica, a bit heavy but an excellent
SLR as were the Practicar and CZ Jena lenses. Unfortunately the lens
mounting did not survive the high deceleration of a motorbike crash.

The broken Practica was replaced by an Olympus OM2N, an excellent and very
lightweight SLR that is still going strong 23 years later. I'm tempted by a
digital SLR but they are so big to say nothing of expensive.

--
Keith (London, UK)
Land Rover Discovery 300TDI
Triumph Sprint Executive
Piaggio X9

 
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