Series 3 A Frame fitting

A

Adrian Ford

Guest

• Feb 4, 2005

• #1

Hi all,
Bought an old A Frame with Pads and Chains at the bottom.I guess
the padded bottoms of the A Frame push up to the steering somewhere then you
secure the chains around it. But Where on a Series 3 do you fit it.
Has anyone any Idea don't want it falling off whilst towing?
Thanks
Adrian Ford

 

J

JD

Guest

• Feb 4, 2005

• #2

Adrian Ford wrote:

> Hi all,
> Bought an old A Frame with Pads and Chains at the bottom.I
> guess
> the padded bottoms of the A Frame push up to the steering somewhere then
> you secure the chains around it. But Where on a Series 3 do you fit it.
> Has anyone any Idea don't want it falling off whilst towing?
> Thanks
> Adrian Ford
A-frames for towing do not normally attach to the steering. They normally
attach to the bumper on a Landrover. The A-frame constrains the front of
the towed vehicle to following the towing vehicle, and the steering, which
is left free, follows by castor action.
Note that in most jurisdictions towing a Landrover with an A-frame and no
driver is considered to be an unbraked trailer in excess of the maximum
weight allowed, and hence illegal. But in many places you have a good
chance of getting away with it.
JD

 

A

Adrian Ford

Guest

• Feb 4, 2005

• #3

Thanks JD
Saved me a lot of time I would have been laid under the
landrover for hours trying to work out where it went.
So if I turned it around and wanted to tow my Peugeot 806 with my Landrover
would i have to take the Front bumper of the peugeot(low ground clearance)
and attatch it to something solid..

Not really intending on doing any long distance towing its a "just in case"
one or the other breaks down...

Thanks
Adrian Ford

"JD" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Adrian Ford wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> > Bought an old A Frame with Pads and Chains at the bottom.I
> > guess
> > the padded bottoms of the A Frame push up to the steering somewhere then
> > you secure the chains around it. But Where on a Series 3 do you fit it.
> > Has anyone any Idea don't want it falling off whilst towing?
> > Thanks
> > Adrian Ford
> A-frames for towing do not normally attach to the steering. They normally
> attach to the bumper on a Landrover. The A-frame constrains the front of
> the towed vehicle to following the towing vehicle, and the steering, which
> is left free, follows by castor action.
> Note that in most jurisdictions towing a Landrover with an A-frame and no
> driver is considered to be an unbraked trailer in excess of the maximum
> weight allowed, and hence illegal. But in many places you have a good
> chance of getting away with it.
> JD

 

M

Mark Gardiner

Guest

• Feb 5, 2005

• #4

>.I guess
>the padded bottoms of the A Frame push up to the steering somewhere then you
>secure the chains around it.

Do not attach any part of the A-Frame to the steering gear - it goes up against
the front bumper and is held to it by the chains.

The towed vehicle will follow the towing vehicle by the cornering forces
transmitted through the A-frame when the leading vehicle moves sideways for a
corner.

To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is the
over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.

Don't be tempted to tow anything whose weight is close to yours, as it doesn't
work! Darwin rules apply, and IANAL.

Mark

 

A

Alex

Guest

• Feb 5, 2005

• #5

>
>To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is the
>over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
>operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.
>
I've never, as far as I can remember, seen anybody using the full
a-frame kit.

What's the position for a spec-lift? Surely that counts as an unbraked
trailer as well.

Alex

 

A

Adrian Ford

Guest

• Feb 5, 2005

• #6

> >To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is
the
> >over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
> >operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.
Being Second hand I don't have over-run cable, is this in case the towed
vehicle breaks from the a frame and it applies the towed vehicles brakes to
stop it. Like on a caravan?

Thanks
Adrian Ford
"Alex" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> >
> >To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is
the
> >over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
> >operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.
> >
> I've never, as far as I can remember, seen anybody using the full
> a-frame kit.
>
> What's the position for a spec-lift? Surely that counts as an unbraked
> trailer as well.
>
> Alex

 

A

AJG

Guest

• Feb 6, 2005

• #7

In message <[email protected]>, Adrian Ford
<[email protected]> writes
>> >To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is
>the
>> >over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
>> >operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.
>Being Second hand I don't have over-run cable, is this in case the towed
>vehicle breaks from the a frame and it applies the towed vehicles brakes to
>stop it. Like on a caravan?
>
No, it's because the trailer is in excess of 750kg so by law must be
fitted with overrun brakes which act along with the vehicle brakes. What
they actually do is
a) allow you to stop in the first place and
b) stop you running into the vehicle in front as your inadequate vehicle
brakes fail ...

--
AndyG

 

M

Mark Gardiner

Guest

• Feb 7, 2005

• #8

I went to the trouble of drilling a keyhole slot in the brake-pedal of my SIIA
pickup so that it would work legally with the brake cable of the A-Frame, and
when I started using it to tow my wife's SJ413, I couldn't use the same method
because of the brake-pedal rubbers, so bought the conversion-kit that wedges in
between the front of the driver's seat-base and the floor, and operates the
brakes by pushing the pedal instead of pulling from below. Worked really well
behind both my Hiace van and Range Rover.
Spec-frames are a partial-suspend, or front-lift only, and don't become a
trailer until they fall off and the lighting cable pulls them along! Also -
Spec-frames can only be fitted to substantial vehicles. where the weight
difference is not so much of a problem.

Mark

2002 KLR650 C7,
1989 KMX200,
1981 PE175 X, now sold,but without memories
1971 Range Rover ( mostly in bits! )
remove_nojunk to reply off group

 

A

Adrian Ford

Guest

• Feb 7, 2005

• #9

"Mark Gardiner" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I went to the trouble of drilling a keyhole slot in the brake-pedal of my
SIIA
> pickup so that it would work legally with the brake cable of the A-Frame,
and
> when I started using it to tow my wife's SJ413, I couldn't use the same
method
> because of the brake-pedal rubbers, so bought the conversion-kit that
wedges in
> between the front of the driver's seat-base and the floor, and operates
the
> brakes by pushing the pedal instead of pulling from below. Worked really
well
> behind both my Hiace van and Range Rover.
>
Mark,
Is the conversion kit expensive? Bought the A-Frame as a "just in
case" item , also im looking for a spare series3 and if i found one I was
going to use it to tow it home behind my series 3. If its just a case of a
few miles would i get away with just using the a-frame unbraked or is it
totally dangerous?.

Thanks
Adrian Ford remove_nojunk to reply off group

 

A

Alex

Guest

• Feb 7, 2005

• #10

On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 06:22:53 -0000, "Adrian Ford"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Mark Gardiner" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> I went to the trouble of drilling a keyhole slot in the brake-pedal of my
>SIIA
>> pickup so that it would work legally with the brake cable of the A-Frame,
>and
>> when I started using it to tow my wife's SJ413, I couldn't use the same
>method
>> because of the brake-pedal rubbers, so bought the conversion-kit that
>wedges in
>> between the front of the driver's seat-base and the floor, and operates
>the
>> brakes by pushing the pedal instead of pulling from below. Worked really
>well
>> behind both my Hiace van and Range Rover.
>>
>Mark,
> Is the conversion kit expensive? Bought the A-Frame as a "just in
>case" item , also im looking for a spare series3 and if i found one I was
>going to use it to tow it home behind my series 3. If its just a case of a
>few miles would i get away with just using the a-frame unbraked or is it
>totally dangerous?.
>

It depends on for what purpose you are moving the vehicle. For
emergency recovery the rules are different to the transit of a vehicle
for general purposes.

Alex

 

W

Warwick Barnes

Guest

• Feb 8, 2005

• #11

> Bought the A-Frame as a "just in
> case" item ,

I expect there will be lots becoming available, my local 'dismantler'
says you can only now use if towed vehicle has currently valid MOT, TAX,
& INSURANCE, if not then all wheels now have to be off the road!
Apparenly you can no longer treat a towed vehicle as a trailer in any
circumstances.

 

P

Phillip Simpson

Guest

• Feb 9, 2005

• #12

Hi Mark,
do you have any details of who sells or makes these over-run
cable devices?

Does this device work only in emergency situation ie seperation of the
2 vehicles or for all braking?

Cheers

Phillip


On 05 Feb 2005 16:46:22 GMT, [email protected]ojunk (Mark
Gardiner) wrote:

>>.I guess
>>the padded bottoms of the A Frame push up to the steering somewhere then you
>>secure the chains around it.
>
>Do not attach any part of the A-Frame to the steering gear - it goes up against
>the front bumper and is held to it by the chains.
>
> The towed vehicle will follow the towing vehicle by the cornering forces
>transmitted through the A-frame when the leading vehicle moves sideways for a
>corner.
>
>To conform to the law, you must also fit the rest of the kit, which is the
>over-run cable from the sliding hitch, in through the open window, and
>operating the brake-pedal of the towed car.
>
>Don't be tempted to tow anything whose weight is close to yours, as it doesn't
>work! Darwin rules apply, and IANAL.
>
>Mark

 

A

AJG

Guest

• Feb 10, 2005

• #13

In message <[email protected]>, Warwick Barnes
<[email protected]> writes
>> Bought the A-Frame as a "just in
>> case" item ,
>
>I expect there will be lots becoming available, my local 'dismantler'
>says you can only now use if towed vehicle has currently valid MOT,
>TAX, & INSURANCE, if not then all wheels now have to be off the road!
>Apparenly you can no longer treat a towed vehicle as a trailer in any
>circumstances.

I thought the towed vehicle has always had to be fully road legal ...?

--
AndyG

 

W

Warwick Barnes

Guest

• Feb 12, 2005

• #14

The message <[email protected]>
from AJG <[email protected]> contains these words:

> In message <[email protected]>, Warwick Barnes
> <[email protected]> writes
> >> Bought the A-Frame as a "just in
> >> case" item ,
> >
> >I expect there will be lots becoming available, my local 'dismantler'
> >says you can only now use if towed vehicle has currently valid MOT,
> >TAX, & INSURANCE, if not then all wheels now have to be off the road!
> >Apparenly you can no longer treat a towed vehicle as a trailer in any
> >circumstances.

> I thought the towed vehicle has always had to be fully road legal ...?

> --
> AndyG
Quite likely you are correct, but new regulations are coming through
faster than anyone can keep up, I not sure of the nuances, but i think
you can only tow a vehicle with any wheels on road if currently in first
class condition, wheras you used to be able to tow by lifting a broken
axle off the ground.
Any body in the broken car business is getting regulations at the rate
of feet of shelf space per month, plus visits from inspectors who often
have no idea what the thing they are whinging about even looks like.
I expect it will all settle eventually to what everyone thinks is
correct until bitten by the regs.