Series 111 - Clutch pedal travel - novice question

Hi all,

Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch pedal
was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like that 3
weeks ago when I parked her up.

All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.

Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?

Thanks

Andrew

Diogenes wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch pedal
> was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like that
> 3 weeks ago when I parked her up.
>
> All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.
>
> Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?
>
> Thanks
>
> Andrew

Problems with the clutch hydraulics. First check level of fluid, it is
probably low. Top it up, probably need to bleed it, and find where the
fluid is going. Most likely the master cylinder (fluid creeping down the
pedal) or the slave cylinder (fluid leaking into the flywheel housing).
However, even if the fluid is not low, it could be the master cylinder.
Plan on replacing both cylinders, and maybe the flexible hose. Workshop
manual recommended, but it is not a big job.
JD

On or around Sun, 11 Sep 2005 19:33:59 +1000, JD <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>Diogenes wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch pedal
>> was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like that
>> 3 weeks ago when I parked her up.
>>
>> All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.
>>
>> Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Andrew
>
>Problems with the clutch hydraulics. First check level of fluid, it is
>probably low. Top it up, probably need to bleed it, and find where the
>fluid is going. Most likely the master cylinder (fluid creeping down the
>pedal) or the slave cylinder (fluid leaking into the flywheel housing).
>However, even if the fluid is not low, it could be the master cylinder.
>Plan on replacing both cylinders, and maybe the flexible hose. Workshop
>manual recommended, but it is not a big job.

The other thing that can cause this is the master cylinder not returning
properly to the rest position. try lifting the pedal with your toe. Also
worth checking that the pushrod adjustment is right in the pedal box under
the bonnet - the pushrod should not be tight at the end of it's travel - the
cylinder has a spring inside which pushes the piston back "home", the
pushrod need to be adjusted so that it doesn't inhibit this.

Not likely that this is a problem unless something's been changed though.
The master cylinder piston not returning to the home position is quite
likely though, only reliable cure I've found is to replace the bugger,
though in theory they can be stripped, cleaned and rebuilt with new seals.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Satisfying: Satisfy your inner child by eating ten tubes of Smarties
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.

"Diogenes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi all,
>
> Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch pedal
> was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like that
3
> weeks ago when I parked her up.
>
> All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.
>
> Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?
>
> Thanks
>
> Andrew
>
>

Most likely (in my opinion) to be an incorrectly set pushrod. the pushrod is
the bit that joins the pedal to the piston and should be of adjustable
length.

if the pushrod is set too short, there will be a large arc of "free play"
where the piston does not apply any pressure to the hydraulic line (most
likely what is occuring for you).

if the pushrod is set too long, it will not have any of this "free play" and
may not completely engage the clutch after successive engages/disengages, as
the pressure builds up in the line and cannot release. i had this problem
with a landcruiser where i had to open the bleed nozzle every couple of
minutes as the clutch would not completely engage. realized what the prob
was and shortened the push-rod and bingo, good as new (m/cyl had just been
reco'd so one would hope it was good as new).

hope this is helpful.

Sam.

Samuel wrote:

> "Diogenes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Hi all,
>>
>>Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch pedal
>>was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like that
>
> 3
>
>>weeks ago when I parked her up.
>>
>>All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.
>>
>>Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?
>>
>>Thanks
>>
>>Andrew
>>
>>
>
>
> Most likely (in my opinion) to be an incorrectly set pushrod. the pushrod is
> the bit that joins the pedal to the piston and should be of adjustable
> length.
>
> if the pushrod is set too short, there will be a large arc of "free play"
> where the piston does not apply any pressure to the hydraulic line (most
> likely what is occuring for you).
>
> if the pushrod is set too long, it will not have any of this "free play" and
> may not completely engage the clutch after successive engages/disengages, as
> the pressure builds up in the line and cannot release. i had this problem
> with a landcruiser where i had to open the bleed nozzle every couple of
> minutes as the clutch would not completely engage. realized what the prob
> was and shortened the push-rod and bingo, good as new (m/cyl had just been
> reco'd so one would hope it was good as new).
>
> hope this is helpful.
>
> Sam.

..... also check that the pedal return spring has not broken.

Samuel wrote:

>
> "Diogenes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Started the old girl this morning (2 1/4 petrol, SWB) and the clutch
>> pedal
>> was 'limp' for the first 4-5 inches (ie no pressure). It wasn't like
>> that
> 3
>> weeks ago when I parked her up.
>>
>> All the 'action' now occurs over the last inch. Drives/changes gear fine.
>>
>> Any suggestions as to what might have happened and what to look for ?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>
> Most likely (in my opinion) to be an incorrectly set pushrod. the pushrod
> is the bit that joins the pedal to the piston and should be of adjustable
> length.
>
> if the pushrod is set too short, there will be a large arc of "free play"
> where the piston does not apply any pressure to the hydraulic line (most
> likely what is occuring for you).
>
> if the pushrod is set too long, it will not have any of this "free play"
> and may not completely engage the clutch after successive
> engages/disengages, as the pressure builds up in the line and cannot
> release. i had this problem with a landcruiser where i had to open the
> bleed nozzle every couple of minutes as the clutch would not completely
> engage. realized what the prob was and shortened the push-rod and bingo,
> good as new (m/cyl had just been reco'd so one would hope it was good as
> new).
>
> hope this is helpful.
>
> Sam.

Pushrod adjustment is unlikely to have changed in three weeks of disuse!
JD

>
> Pushrod adjustment is unlikely to have changed in three weeks of disuse!
> JD


Too true JD. I missed that in the initial posting. not much gets past you!

one thing that could stuff it in 3 weeks is putting the wrong fluid into it.
Granted not everyone is stupid as me, but i once put automatic fluid into
the clutch master cylinder thinking that it would do a similar job. Alas, it
didn't and this is why i had to get the bloody cylinder reco'd in the first
place.

Sam.

Samuel wrote:

>>
>> Pushrod adjustment is unlikely to have changed in three weeks of disuse!
>> JD
>
>
> Too true JD. I missed that in the initial posting. not much gets past you!
>
> one thing that could stuff it in 3 weeks is putting the wrong fluid into
> it. Granted not everyone is stupid as me, but i once put automatic fluid
> into the clutch master cylinder thinking that it would do a similar job.
> Alas, it didn't and this is why i had to get the bloody cylinder reco'd in
> the first place.
>
> Sam.

Yes - so will assembling a cylinder with greasy hands. (guess how I know)
JD

On or around Mon, 12 Sep 2005 21:50:21 +1000, "Samuel"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Most likely (in my opinion) to be an incorrectly set pushrod. the pushrod is
>the bit that joins the pedal to the piston and should be of adjustable
>length.

However, it's not that likely to have reset itself...
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others"
George Orwell (1903 - 1950) Animal Farm

In news:[email protected],
JD <[email protected]> typed:
| Samuel wrote:
|
|||
||| Pushrod adjustment is unlikely to have changed in three weeks of
||| disuse! JD
||
||
|| Too true JD. I missed that in the initial posting. not much gets
|| past you!
||
|| one thing that could stuff it in 3 weeks is putting the wrong fluid
|| into it. Granted not everyone is stupid as me, but i once put
|| automatic fluid into the clutch master cylinder thinking that it
|| would do a similar job. Alas, it didn't and this is why i had to get
|| the bloody cylinder reco'd in the first place.
||
|| Sam.
|
| Yes - so will assembling a cylinder with greasy hands. (guess how I
| know) JD

My S11A clutch failed last year - turned out to be a collapsed flexible
hose, not allowing the fluid to return to the master. One pump too many
while driving & the cylinder popped out & bent the pushrod. A new slave
cylinder & hose later all was fixed. Don't make things the way they used to,
only lasted 37 years ... better change the three brake hoses too I suppose.

Karen


--
"I'd far rather be happy than right any day."
- Slartibartfast