routing

M

Matthew Maddock

Guest

• Jun 28, 2006

• #21

> Talking of which (UPS) and straying even further off-topic....
>
> I need a UPS - wants to be rack-mounted and deliver 4-6 amps for about
> 10-20 minutes. Need the type where all power is routed through rather
> than the cut-in jobbies.
>
> any thoughts?

I've always been impressed with the APC ones. Used to run these
ourselves (Smart range) and supplied loads to customers on our
machines. Aside from the usual dead batteries after a few years,
only ever had one that cause a problem and APC were *excellent* in
after-sales support - very quick replacement with a brand new unit
no questions asked, I just gave them the serial number.

Matt.

P.S. Don't ever buy replacement batteries from APC - we used to
service ours with batteries from RS - exactly the same manufacturer
and type but 1/4 of the price!

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 28, 2006

• #22

On 2006-06-28, William Tasso <[email protected]> wrote:

> I need a UPS - wants to be rack-mounted and deliver 4-6 amps for about
> 10-20 minutes. Need the type where all power is routed through rather
> than the cut-in jobbies.

My favourite is the MGE ones, cheaper than APC but just as good, and
at least as intelligent, maybe more so. They also write open-source
linux drivers for "nut", which helps for me.

www.hardware.com, www.misco.com and www.insight.com tend to trade
cheapest prices, sometimes one will be cheapest for the floor-standing
version where the other will be cheaper for the rack-mount.

I have an APC Smart-UPS 3000 in my rack at home (behind me right now
in fact), when I get one of the other racks online I'll fit MGE I
reckon as I'll be paying out of my own pocket this time and MGE are a
better deal. My APC can power my rack for about 50 minutes, living out
in the sticks, I need that!

Beware that APC have a serial port on the back labelled "serial", but
if you plug an RS232 cable into it, it'll power off the load
immediately. You need a specially wired cable. It's stupidity like
that which makes me not like APC so much.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 28, 2006

• #23

On 2006-06-28, Matthew Maddock <[email protected]> wrote:

> P.S. Don't ever buy replacement batteries from APC - we used to
> service ours with batteries from RS - exactly the same manufacturer
> and type but 1/4 of the price!

http://www.mdsbattery.co.uk/

Also rather good on the prices for battery packs. Not just for UPSes
either, ipods, PDAs etc. I've had good service from them.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

A

Austin Shackles

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #24

On or around Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:31:31 +1200, EMB <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>Mother wrote:
>>
>> I 'kin love customers who let their feckwitted stoned student son p!ss
>> around with their business critical systems - no, I really _do_ love
>> them - as we have their credit card number and they agree to pay not
>> only my time, but an id-IOt interface error tax too.
>>
>> See: www.id-iot.com for full diagnostic details...
>
>I passed my tolerance level for problems caused by the terminally
>dimwitted the other day, and told the CEO of my largest client that he
>could stick his service agreement wherever he wanted and that I was off
>to find a new client with less nepotism, fewer ****wits and less stress.
>
>The response was great - they now pay me 10% more per hour and their two
>biggest problems will be collecting their final pay cheques (with
>included ****wit cards) at the end of July.

Result!
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"Nessun maggior dolore che ricordarsi del tempo felice nella miseria"
- Dante Alighieri (1265 - 1321) from Divina Commedia 'Inferno'

 

A

AJH

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #25

On Wed, 28 Jun 2006 23:30:36 +0100, Ian Rawlings
<[email protected]> wrote:

>> I need a UPS - wants to be rack-mounted and deliver 4-6 amps for about
>> 10-20 minutes. Need the type where all power is routed through rather
>> than the cut-in jobbies.
>
>My favourite is the MGE ones,

These MGE ones seem to be line interactive, which I think means it is
a "cut in jobby". I have a Liebert interactive and I blame it for
corrupting a hard drive.

I too would like a 2000VA ups, the mains in -> float battery -> reform
sinewave type but I assume there is a big efficincy trade off??

AJH

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #26

On 2006-06-29, AJH <[email protected]> wrote:

> These MGE ones seem to be line interactive, which I think means it is
> a "cut in jobby". I have a Liebert interactive and I blame it for
> corrupting a hard drive.

You'r thinking of a "standby" UPS, they supply straight mains through
a transfer switch which flips over to battery supply when the mains
fails.

A "Line Interactive" UPS has a combined inverter and charger which
will take power from either the battery or the mains. The
inverter/charger is running all the time, and there's no explicit
switch-over to battery, the inverer/charger just sort of takes
whatever it can get, sort of like in a vehicle where you have an
alternator and an engine, if the alternator can't supply enough then
the battery power is used, but if the alternator is supplying enough
then the battery recharges. There's no charge/discharge relays.

An "Online" UPS runs on battery all the time, with the battery being
charged by the mains while also supplying power to the load. They
tend to get hot due to energy wasted in the AC->DC->AC cycle so
chances are it'll have a fan running full-time.

Harrumph, while trying to get some specifics on Delta types, I found a
decent wikipedia page which says it all better than me, so a waste of
typing..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uninterruptible_power_supply

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

S

Steve Taylor

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #27

Ian Rawlings wrote:
> On 2006-06-29, AJH <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> These MGE ones seem to be line interactive, which I think means it is
>> a "cut in jobby". I have a Liebert interactive and I blame it for
>> corrupting a hard drive.
>
> You'r thinking of a "standby" UPS, they supply straight mains through
> a transfer switch which flips over to battery supply when the mains
> fails.

Do you have any idea where I can get servicing info for APC UPS "Smart
-UPS 2200 " perchance ?

Thanks

Steve

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #28

On 2006-06-29, Steve Taylor <[email protected]> wrote:

> Do you have any idea where I can get servicing info for APC UPS "Smart
> -UPS 2200 " perchance ?

Try the following line in a google search;

"Smart UPS 2200" filetypedf

A few promising links but I don't know exactly what you have, they do
change the gear from time to time while keeping the name the same.

Note that if it's not working after a long time of not being used, try
taking the batteries out and recharging them. Some of them power the
intelligence from the batteries, so if the batteries are flat they
won't power the relays up to engage the charger.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

E

EMB

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #29

Steve Taylor wrote:

> Do you have any idea where I can get servicing info for APC UPS "Smart
> -UPS 2200 " perchance ?

Yep, but being in NZ it's prolly not a lot of use to you.


--
EMB

 

E

EMB

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #30

Austin Shackles wrote:
> On or around Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:31:31 +1200, EMB <[email protected]>
> enlightened us thusly:

>>The response was great - they now pay me 10% more per hour and their two
>>biggest problems will be collecting their final pay cheques (with
>>included ****wit cards) at the end of July.
>
>
> Result!

'Twas. And today they improved the reult by deciding they'll pick up
the tab for my mobile phone too. I can feel calls to afl members being
made in the near future.


--
EMB

 

S

steve

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #31

EMB wrote:
> Steve Taylor wrote:
>
>> Do you have any idea where I can get servicing info for APC UPS "Smart
>> -UPS 2200 " perchance ?
>
> Yep, but being in NZ it's prolly not a lot of use to you.
>
>
Hell, if all else fails...

Steve

 

S

steve

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #32

Ian Rawlings wrote:

> Note that if it's not working after a long time of not being used, try
> taking the batteries out and recharging them. Some of them power the
> intelligence from the batteries, so if the batteries are flat they
> won't power the relays up to engage the charger.
>

How the heck is a mormal user, without access to the right gear supposed
to do that ?

Steve

 

M

Matthew Maddock

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #33

> Note that if it's not working after a long time of not being used, try
> taking the batteries out and recharging them. Some of them power the
> intelligence from the batteries, so if the batteries are flat they
> won't power the relays up to engage the charger.

Either that our they are dead! Sometimes you'll struggle to get them
out because they have expanded so much! Best to keep a regular check
on the internals if you are sensible - better to find out it's
fubar before you actually have to rely on the unit for real!

Matt

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #34

On 2006-06-29, Matthew Maddock <[email protected]> wrote:

> Either that our they are dead!

Well obviously... Most UPSes (all the ones I have) do a regular
self-test which runs the load on batteries for a few seconds, but with
a line interactive UPS, if the batteries fail then the load does not
get powered off. The UPS then starts shouting at you and you can
often change the battery pack without powering off the load.

Recommended battery life is 3 years, cheap to replace if you don't buy
from the manufacturer!

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

I

Ian Rawlings

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #35

On 2006-06-29, steve <[email protected]> wrote:

> How the heck is a mormal user, without access to the right gear supposed
> to do that ?

The batteries are user-changeable, and are normally (in all the cases
I've seen) 12 volt batteries that can be recharged sufficiently using
a standard car charger on trickle charge. Sometimes they are joined
together with a fused link to make a 24 volt pack, but you just unplug
the link and charge each cell individually.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!

 

W

William Tasso

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #36

On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 12:44:07 +0100, EMB <[email protected]> wrote:

> Austin Shackles wrote:
>> On or around Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:31:31 +1200, EMB <[email protected]>
>> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>> The response was great - they now pay me 10% more per hour and their
>>> two biggest problems will be collecting their final pay cheques (with
>>> included ****wit cards) at the end of July.
>> Result!
>
> 'Twas. And today they improved the reult by deciding they'll pick up
> the tab for my mobile phone too. I can feel calls to afl members being
> made in the near future.

Would you like a job? Always got room for a customer facing tech with
those negotiating skills

--
William Tasso

110 V8

 

W

William Tasso

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #37

On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:57:17 +0100, AJH <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Wed, 28 Jun 2006 23:30:36 +0100, Ian Rawlings
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>> I need a UPS - wants to be rack-mounted and deliver 4-6 amps for about
>>> 10-20 minutes. Need the type where all power is routed through rather
>>> than the cut-in jobbies.
>>
>> My favourite is the MGE ones,
>
> These MGE ones seem to be line interactive, which I think means it is
> a "cut in jobby".

In addition to the splendid post from Ian, there's this site:
http://www.pcguide.com/ref/power/ext/ups/typesStandby-c.html

Follow the links at the foot of each article for a brief discussion in
plain English of each major 'type' of UPS

> I have a Liebert interactive and I blame it for
> corrupting a hard drive.

I blame Telecity/RedBus - you don't want to know how much we pay them for
"un-interruptible" power that failed three times in quick succession last
Friday. I'm still dealing with the hangover.


> I too would like a 2000VA ups, the mains in -> float battery -> reform
> sinewave type but I assume there is a big efficincy trade off??

Online UPSs - generate a lot of heat making the conversions

--
William Tasso

110 V8

 

S

Simon Isaacs

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #38

On Wed, 28 Jun 2006 23:30:57 +0100, Matthew Maddock
<[email protected]> scribbled the following
nonsense:

>> Talking of which (UPS) and straying even further off-topic....
>>
>> I need a UPS - wants to be rack-mounted and deliver 4-6 amps for about
>> 10-20 minutes. Need the type where all power is routed through rather
>> than the cut-in jobbies.
>>
>> any thoughts?
>
>I've always been impressed with the APC ones. Used to run these
>ourselves (Smart range) and supplied loads to customers on our
>machines. Aside from the usual dead batteries after a few years,
>only ever had one that cause a problem and APC were *excellent* in
>after-sales support - very quick replacement with a brand new unit
>no questions asked, I just gave them the serial number.
>
>Matt.
>
>P.S. Don't ever buy replacement batteries from APC - we used to
>service ours with batteries from RS - exactly the same manufacturer
>and type but 1/4 of the price!

i've got an APC Smart BackUPS 500, bought about 8 years ago, battery
still works, and stills gives me time to save my work and shut the PC
down when there is a power outage. Seems to even out the spikes too,
as it beeps on a spike. Bought it when I was at uni, as the power had
a habit of tripping out easily due to some very sensitive trip
switches in the halls of residence......
--

Simon Isaacs

"Bad officials are elected by good citizens who do not vote"
George Jean Nathan (1882-1955)

ROT13 me....

 

E

EMB

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #39

William Tasso wrote:

> Would you like a job? Always got room for a customer facing tech with
> those negotiating skills

You don't want me - I'm rude, arrogant and don't suffer fools gladly so
I'm not really the most customer friendly animal to have on your staff.

We could however work out a deal for you to employ SMWBO - she's a lot
more customer friendly than I am and it would be a bloody good result if
I could export her 12000 miles away.

--
EMB

 

W

William Tasso

Guest

• Jun 29, 2006

• #40

On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 22:04:39 +0100, EMB <[email protected]> wrote:

> William Tasso wrote:
>
>> Would you like a job? Always got room for a customer facing tech with
>> those negotiating skills
>
> You don't want me - I'm rude, arrogant and don't suffer fools gladly so
> I'm not really the most customer friendly animal to have on your staff.

perfect - you'll fit right in

> We could however work out a deal for you to employ SMWBO - she's a lot
> more customer friendly than I am and it would be a bloody good result if
> I could export her 12000 miles away.

naughty <g>

--
William Tasso

110 V8