replace the crank seal on the front timing cover

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elliot0850

elliot0850

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Hi trying to replace the crank seal on the front timing cover 300tdi, have removed the old seal (all rubber) order a new one off line and it's came as part metal part rubber.
Spoke to a local land rover garage and they said you have to die grind part of the casing off to allow to new seal to fit. (As you can no longer get the old type seal)
Has anyone done this if so do you have any pictures of what actually needs grinding off and which way around the seal goes?
Thanks in advance
 
elliot0850 said:
Hi trying to replace the crank seal on the front timing cover 300tdi, have removed the old seal (all rubber) order a new one off line and it's came as part metal part rubber.
Spoke to a local land rover garage and they said you have to die grind part of the casing off to allow to new seal to fit. (As you can no longer get the old type seal)
Has anyone done this if so do you have any pictures of what actually needs grinding off and which way around the seal goes?
Thanks in advance
Click to expand...

On the one we have done the seal was fitted from the 'inside' of the case ...

No modifying was needed to the front case ...
 
That's how I removed the old one from the inside. Here are pictures of the new and the old one, Does this look about right? As it doesn't seem to fit and will stick out proud hitting the crank pulley?
image.jpg
 
I was also supplied one the 'later' types of seal for the timing front cover, the old one was the design too, i.e. metal and rubber.

Grateful if any light can be shed on how to fit this type of seal.
 
elliot0850 said:
Hi trying to replace the crank seal on the front timing cover 300tdi, have removed the old seal (all rubber) order a new one off line and it's came as part metal part rubber.
Spoke to a local land rover garage and they said you have to die grind part of the casing off to allow to new seal to fit. (As you can no longer get the old type seal)
Has anyone done this if so do you have any pictures of what actually needs grinding off and which way around the seal goes?
Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Stick to the original seal LINKY another LINKY to cheaper ones. Loads on ebay too
 
Reading this , I think you are talking about the one that goes in the front timing cover , fitted from the "inside" of the cover.

But then I wonder if you really mean the one that goes into the timing chest.

Are you using the correct seal in the right place? they look very similar, I also had one of the metal ring ones, did not seem to fit the case I had, ( but I do not remember which seal it was I was trying to use it in place of ) i went back to the ones listed below.

iirc, do double check these numbers. ERR4576 goes in the timing cover , fitted from inside the cover. ERR 4575 goes into the timing chest, use the pulley to drive it home square.
http://new.lrcat.com/#!/1228/13789/16869/1308/17058

Cheers
 
Thanks, and yes, I am referring to the seal that is fitted into the front timing cover. According the all the IPCs, ERR 4575 is fitted into the rear cover (chest) and ERR 4576 is fitted to the front cover. 4575 is supplied in the bottom gasket set, STC 2801, so I'm happy that the correct one has been fitted here.

I removed a metal/rubber seal from the front cover (ERR 7143), and was supplied exactly the same part by Turners, even though it doesn’t appear that I ordered 4576 or 7143!!! I’ll order 4576; thanks :)
 
Just wondering how you all went fitting your seal?

I reliably established (through Turners) that ERR7143 was an update to ERR4576 and fully interchangeable.

I also confirmed that it should be fitted like so with the rubber side against the inside of the front cover.

However it doesn't fit! Has anyone else had experience grinding the outside of the seal or timing casing in order to make it fit as suggested in the original post?
 

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topdeadcentre said:
Just wondering how you all went fitting your seal?

I reliably established (through Turners) that ERR7143 was an update to ERR4576 and fully interchangeable.

I also confirmed that it should be fitted like so with the rubber side against the inside of the front cover.

However it doesn't fit! Has anyone else had experience grinding the outside of the seal or timing casing in order to make it fit as suggested in the original post?
Click to expand...
Do not grind anything off your timing cover :eek:
I've done a search on Turner's and they do not stock ERR 7143. If I were you I'd stick to the original seal LINK to TURNERS you don't need to buy it there. LINK to Ebay You can get them for less that £3 on the bay, but for items like this you might as well get a reliable brand/G coded/OEM part for just a few quid more.
As @neilly pointed out in Post #8 above, there might be some confusion with an alternative part for the front crankshaft oil seal. I think that's what he was saying anyway. His understanding of his Russian Cyrillic, in that LRCat link, is way better than mine. ;):p
 
Thanks! Yes it is curious that given it's a supposed update the best around such as Turners stock the old design.

It is simply too large to fit into the recess in the cover (by about 4mm), so even though they are theoretically interchangable, I should probably cut my losses and sources and old style one!
 
topdeadcentre said:
Thanks! Yes it is curious that given it's a supposed update the best around such as Turners stock the old design.

It is simply too large to fit into the recess in the cover (by about 4mm), so even though they are theoretically interchangable, I should probably cut my losses and sources and old style one!
Click to expand...
I'm not so sure they are interchangeable. ERR 7143 may be an alternate part for the front crank oil seal, but that's a different seal to the one you are putting in the timing case cover.
 
Yes, ERR4576 and ERR4173 are definitely for the front cover and not the timing case (which is ERR4575).

It was apparently a supplier update and the cover itself was never altered at any point (which means the new one should fit into any cover...)

Here's a question for you- I excitedly hooked up my amateur smoke machine to my freshly rebuilt engine and the only leak was through the back of the crank shaft pulley.

I'm hoping that it is because there is no pressure against the seal and that when the front cover gets put on and everything torqued down it will seal up nicely..

The crank shaft o ring and timing case seal were both changed and are in place.

 
topdeadcentre said:
Yes, ERR4576 and ERR4173 are definitely for the front cover and not the timing case (which is ERR4575).

It was apparently a supplier update and the cover itself was never altered at any point (which means the new one should fit into any cover...)

Here's a question for you- I excitedly hooked up my amateur smoke machine to my freshly rebuilt engine and the only leak was through the back of the crank shaft pulley.

I'm hoping that it is because there is no pressure against the seal and that when the front cover gets put on and everything torqued down it will seal up nicely..

The crank shaft o ring and timing case seal were both changed and are in place.

Click to expand...

I've never seen that done before!
Where did you connect the smoke machine and what sort of pressure is it creating?
Not sure, but that is probably getting past the O ring. Once fully assembled and torqued up it should be ok.
 
I took the dipstick out and put it in there. They are very simple contraptions- you can even make one yourself but it was cheap to buy. Extremely useful for finding all sorts of leaks.

I hooked it up to a compressor, it has its own pressure regulator that keeps the pressure very minimal. Not sure exactly what it is- I'm told you can also use a hand held bike pump or even blow to circulate the smoke.

It's a similar in design to the one used in this video:



Yes, I'm hoping that once it's seated firmly on the o ring it'll be fine.
 
Al2O3 said:
I'm not so sure they are interchangeable. ERR 7143 may be an alternate part for the front crank oil seal, but that's a different seal to the one you are putting in the timing case cover.
Click to expand...

So I ended up getting my hands on both styles of seal but lo and behold neither are going to fit...

I think the shell of the old seal may still be in there- I had written this off as a possibilty as I thought the old seal was entirely rubber. I've been rough trying to shift it but with no success and I thought I'd see if anyone might have an idea before I get really brutal with it.

Am I correct in thinking the recess should go straight down and not be given an extra lip by what I'm thinking could be part of my old seal?
 

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