P38 DSE Overheating (yet another)

Have to agree with Datatek, sounds like everything is working fine, possibly a sticky thermostat.

Hi guys!!
Today got home and sat down to think about what you all said!!.....then I went to the car....I had just arrived from work (one hour jurney!)...so it was still hot.....opened the bonnet.....then I touched the top part of my aftermarket new Rad.....all long the top very hot (you could just only touch it...very hot!.....I thinks is normal..hot.....)..then I got to my knees....under the engine bay........touched the bottom part of the Rad......and WWWoooooouuuuu!!!!!......Just hot! (but not flipi.....hot like the top part...just a bit hot.....).....
I think my Rad that is knew is no good....the Rad is my problem I think! Now I think that buys cheap stuff is no good thing!!!
I´m going to mend the hold one that I´ve still got....see how it goes....I´ll tell you when I do it!!!
(The rest is new....viscous fan,thermostat,water pump,temp sensor, I changed everything....!!!! and As I said before....no oil is cooling system...no cooling traces on the oil system...no strange fumes in the exhaust..etc!!!)
I think that the Rad is my problem!
I´ll come back in a week with the resault...hope it workes!! What do you all think?
Thanks ans regards!
Adal

For me, the most important test you can do after a run is to try to squeeze the top hoses.
If they are very hard then there's more pressure in there than there should be.
If you can compress them easily, start smiling - there's a chance it's probably not the head.

Rangeroverp38DSE said:

I think that the Rad is my problem!

Click to expand...

You haven't identified a problem! I wouldn't be thinking of repairing a rad (good luck) or taking the head off just because the temp gauge rises under load.

Hi Folks! I´m back with new report on my overheating problem!
I Took my radiator to have it looked because I thought that it didnt have the middle Partition inside it! Well....I must say I was right...the guy told me that it was very strange...he had only seen that ones before....now the second!
Please watch out the aftermarket rads if you buy one! The guy told me it was a good radiator because the core was aluminium and it removes the heat better. I dont know....but he made a partition and says its ok...now the water wont flow across the top.
(I am mending the old metal one aniway so I can have a spair)
The radiator not having tha partiton explains that the top part of the radiator got realy hot and the bottom part was fairly cold...and that the cooling liquid was not flowing through the radiator, just across the top. That explains my temp gauge going up to nearly red only under load......because the radiator wasnt cooling the liquid!!! (I have never had head problems nor anything else that could make one think about the head gasket....thats why I was hopping and not thinking about the head gasket).
tonight ill install the rad and I hope that my problems will end...Just hope!Because everything else is new as I whrote in the previous post´s.
I´ll come back to report on it ones it is finished and tested!
Thank for your advise and bare in mind this can happen with a new aftermarket rad.
regards!
Adal trujillo
(Please forgive my english whriting)..thanks!

Hi!
Today on my 60 mile journey to work....the temp gauge niddle didnt move from the 12 oclock position no matter the load!....My problem was definitly the radiator!
Hope everything stays like that and everybody bare in mind my situation! It could happen to anyone!
thanks for the help and advise of the previous posts!
regards!

Confirmed!
Temp gauge on 12 o´clock no matter load! thats how I like it!
Adal

Adal,

Well, this is very interesting news. Like you, I have replaced everything related to the cooling system, and yes my new radiator is also an aftermarket one. My car is still overheating.

On thing I tried the other day was to turn the heater on full, and then the temperature went from middle into the blue. (i have my thermostat removed). This is when I also suspected the radiator is just not doing its job. I will remove the radiator today, and take it to the mechanic for inspection of the baffle. I really hope this is the problem.
I will report back.

Thanks Karl

Bad news Im afraid.
After removing the radiator and taking to the radiator specialist, he opened the top tank and confirmed that the baffle is in place and there is nothing wrong with the radiator.

Something else is causing my overheat problem I guess.

Interestingly, I purchased one of the infrared thermometers and measures the top radiator hoses when hot. There is only a 2 degree celsius difference!
I put the heater on full and measures the heater hoses and there is an 8 degree difference!

I dont know whats wrong.

kzrocky said:

Bad news Im afraid.
After removing the radiator and taking to the radiator specialist, he opened the top tank and confirmed that the baffle is in place and there is nothing wrong with the radiator.

Something else is causing my overheat problem I guess.

Interestingly, I purchased one of the infrared thermometers and measures the top radiator hoses when hot. There is only a 2 degree celsius difference!
I put the heater on full and measures the heater hoses and there is an 8 degree difference!

I dont know whats wrong.

Click to expand...

Rad hoses delaminating on the inside can sometimes cause this, they look ok to the eye, but water flow sucks the wall in restricting flow.

Datatek said:

Rad hoses delaminating on the inside can sometimes cause this, they look ok to the eye, but water flow sucks the wall in restricting flow.

Click to expand...

Hoses are new.
But Im open to anything to fix my rangie.
Obviously something I have missed (and every other mechanic too)

KZ....did you say you didnt have a thermostat fitted?

In the p38 the thermostat is essencial, because the coolant system consists in two different systems....one "small" system and a "big" system. Tha small system is the system inside the engine itself and the big system is the one formed by the radiator. Tha thermostat is essencial because when the engine is cold (thermostat closed) the coolant only drives round the engine (small system). When it gets hot...the thermostat opens (and with the little disc that the tharmostat has at the rear closes the small system. The thermostat closes the small system and then the water pump sucks coolant from the radiator and not from the engine.
If you dont have thermostat two thing happen: first, the engine takes much more to get hot and drinks more diesel...and two....the water pump tends to suck the hot coolant (from the small system) rather than the cold coolant comming from the radiator.
When you run under load ore steep roads the engine gets hot because the coolant isnt getting cooled.
Someone correct me if thougth are taht I´m wrong!
(and excuse my english whriting please)
You said your radiator was new and its checked, ok!. What about the water pump (the impeller of the pump,if original, are plastic and the main boddy in metal....sometimes the plastic impeller gets unstuck....and because its plastic you dont hear it like other water pumps!..check it....just take it out and have a look at it. This way you can discard that its the water pump.
have a new thermostat fitted. And check the viscous unit! that about all...if everything gets checked well you shoudnt have any problem. At least that was my case....and mine goes perfect no matter load now! (here in Canary islands we normaly have hot temperatures!).
regards!
Adal Trujillo
(after checking all that,If thing dont get better,I would start thinkind on making one of those sniff test...to see if theres something strange coming out of the exhaust).Check the pressure in the coolant system pipes...when it gets hot they should get a bit hard (not rock hard),but enough so you can just squeeze a bit!

Hi Adal,

Did you managed to fix your DSE?
Mine has just the same symptoms.
Everything in the cooling system is new (water-pump, thermostat, viscous, radiator, head gasket, hoses..even the cylinder head -propely skimmed)...
He keeps getting hot....dont know what to do further more..
The rad is not oem LR...even its new.....hope the bug is in there

Best regards
Joao

My friend!
Runs like an absolute dream! temp gauge spot on the middle...at 12 oclock (no matter load ore outside temp) Here in the canary islands....around 20 ºC (dont know whats that in celcious).
You have to star checking every single thing!
If you know that cant be the headgasket then it must be another thing you are missing!
When I had the radiator out I checked the system with a hose (I just plugged a water hose in every pipe to see if there was some sort of restiction to the flow somewhere...and it was all perfect). then start discarding things!
The system is not so complicated: radiator, hoses, thermostat,water pump, viscous unit (very importat).
Hope you have luck!
Regards!

Is it actually overheating or is it just electrically overheating? (as in, could one of the temp sensors be duff causing it to overheat)

My RR is at the shop...
My mechanic will check the rad and remove the head and test it.
Just hope is not the engine block.....

By the way, what does the ETC sensor do?
jton, the engine gets realy hot...i dont believe is an electrical issue..

Everything seems to be ok....
head cylinder (tested and is ok).
Head gasket (no signs of leackege), water pump, thermostat, viscous and radiator also ok (all of these were new). All the hoses were new..

Now the block will be stripped and tested.....


(sorry Adal for overtaking your thread, but all this information may help someone else...no point opening a new thread for same issue...)

jonasserra said:

Everything seems to be ok....
head cylinder (tested and is ok).
Head gasket (no signs of leackege), water pump, thermostat, viscous and radiator also ok (all of these were new). All the hoses were new..

Now the block will be stripped and tested.....


(sorry Adal for overtaking your thread, but all this information may help someone else...no point opening a new thread for same issue...)

Click to expand...

how was the cylinder head tested??

-Will

Hi Will,

The water way has been or hidro or pneumatic tested....not sure.
Also the face doesnt show any crack.

My mechanic will strip the block and by what he told me, the block will be air pressurized and submerged in water.
If theres any crack in the cylinder wall (compression to water), it will be refurbished -machined and then will be aplied a layer...
(i am very sorry, but i dont know many english terms...besides my english may seem very strange for you..)

...block has been pneumatic tested...looks just fine, no damage.

Face block had to be skimmed (was slightly warped ..... sorry, dont know the correct term..) wich could get air into the cooling system from the combustion chambers, and make the water buble in the expantion tank and then rise the engine temperature..

Everything else is just fine (cylinder head, head gasket - which has to be new, thermostat, water-pump, viscous, hoses...)

The ETC sensor will have a new loom (an original LR fix made to this model year -1998).

...hope this will fix the issues for good..