not entirely hypothetical

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T

Tim Hobbs

Guest
Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
something less crap)...

It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
Navara Adventura, which do I choose?

Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
Residuals probably cancel out the difference.

Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land Rover....
Off road ability will be good enough in either.

I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
on a motorway.


--
Tim Hobbs
 
In message <[email protected]>
Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> wrote:

> Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
> something less crap)...
>
> It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>
> Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
> Residuals probably cancel out the difference.
>
> Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land Rover....
> Off road ability will be good enough in either.
>
> I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
> on a motorway.
>
>


I don't know about the financial side, but a customer has a Navara
(6 month old) and it makes LR build quality look quite good! Last
night the entire upper tailgate latch mechanism did a Range Rover
and fell to bits! Again.

Richard
--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
Boycott the Yorkshire Dales - No Play, No Pay
 
Tim Hobbs wrote:
> Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
> something less crap)...
>
> It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>
> Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
> Residuals probably cancel out the difference.
>
> Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land Rover....
> Off road ability will be good enough in either.
>
> I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
> on a motorway.


What are the relative servicing costs? In this part of the world LR
dealers seem to charge about twice what Nissan dealers do.


--
EMB
 
On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 15:25:10 +0000, Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> wrote:

>Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
>something less crap)...
>
>It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
>so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
>Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>


I'd have the Defender on that basis that the new Navara is as ugly as
sin.

Alex


 
Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> uttered summat worrerz funny about:
> Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
> something less crap)...
>
> It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>
> Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
> Residuals probably cancel out the difference.
>
> Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land Rover....
> Off road ability will be good enough in either.
>
> I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
> on a motorway.


New L200? Supposed to be expected to hold value better than the Nissan from
what our local rag says anyway.
I


 
On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 19:54:29 +0000, Alex <[email protected]>
wrote:

>On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 15:25:10 +0000, Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
>>something less crap)...
>>
>>It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
>>so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
>>Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>>

>
>I'd have the Defender on that basis that the new Navara is as ugly as
>sin.
>
>Alex
>


The flanks are very reminiscent of the new Discovery. The interior is
from a different century to the Defender as well. It's a bit bling
for my tastes, but I'll be sat inside it rather than looking at it so
I'm not too fussed on that score.

In the Defender's favour is that it's a Land Rover and that there's
arguably more scope on the inside for fitting some of the toys we are
working on.

On that subject, btw, one of our guys bought in an OBD2 data logger
and strapped a Bluetooth board on the back of it. Plugged straight
into the Volvo, the Passat and his Prius and instantly reported all
the fault codes (none on the Volvo thankfully), real time rpms, speed,
engine load, throttle position etc to my laptop. Very slick and very
cheap.

--
Tim Hobbs
 
On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 20:13:12 -0000, "Lee_D"
<[email protected]> scribbled the following
nonsense:

>Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> uttered summat worrerz funny about:
>> Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
>> something less crap)...
>>
>> It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
>> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
>> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>>
>> Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
>> Residuals probably cancel out the difference.
>>
>> Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land Rover....
>> Off road ability will be good enough in either.
>>
>> I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
>> on a motorway.

>
>New L200? Supposed to be expected to hold value better than the Nissan from
>what our local rag says anyway.
>I
>


I have to admit, an L200 is what I would go for if I was doing a lot
of motorway miles, if a lot of off road then the 110.
--

Simon Isaacs

Peterborough 4x4 Club Chairman, Newsletter Editor and Webmaster
Green Lane Association (GLASS) Financial Director
101 Ambi, undergoing camper conversion www.simoni.co.uk
1976 S3 LWT, Fully restored, ready for sale! Make me an offer!
Suzuki SJ410 (Wife's) 3" lift kit fitted, body shell now restored and mounted on chassis, waiting on a windscreen and MOT
Series 3 88" Rolling chassis...what to do next
1993 200 TDi Discovery
1994 200 TDi Discovery body shell, being bobbed and modded.....
 
Lee_D wrote:
> Tim Hobbs <[email protected]> uttered summat worrerz funny about:
>> Considering adding to the fleet (well, swapping the A-Class for
>> something less crap)...
>>
>> It's still pretty efficient to run a Double Cab as a company vehicle,
>> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
>> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?
>>
>> Purchase price is near enough not to matter, but favours the Nissan.
>> Residuals probably cancel out the difference.
>>
>> Nissan is leather and full of nice toys. Defender is a Land
>> Rover.... Off road ability will be good enough in either.
>>
>> I'm likely to do 30,000 miles a year in this truck, about 75% of them
>> on a motorway.

>
> New L200? Supposed to be expected to hold value better than the
> Nissan from what our local rag says anyway.
> I


New L200 every time! I've heard all sorts of problems with navaras. Been
having this discussion on another NG, the L200 seems to have won hands down.
As someone who runs a Shogun as an everyday hack I can vouch for
reliability, service and build of mitsubishi.

--
Graham

101 GS
101 Radio Body


 
On or around Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:04:01 -0000, "Graham G"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>
>New L200 every time! I've heard all sorts of problems with navaras. Been
>having this discussion on another NG, the L200 seems to have won hands down.
>As someone who runs a Shogun as an everyday hack I can vouch for
>reliability, service and build of mitsubishi.


I hear that the TD5 is still a bit lacklustre in the defenders, too.

Now, if ford can get their act together to put the 2.7 V6 from the disco 3
into the replacement...

mind, the L200 seems to be less of a bull**** truck than the rest.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
In Touch: Get in touch with yourself by touching yourself.
If somebody is watching, stop touching yourself.
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 
Tim Hobbs wrote:

> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?


I like to think that when I buy British stuff that it keeps the country
ticking over and keeps some UK industry going. In ten years you
probably won't have an option :-(

Some things you just can't look at that way but I like 110s, the DC is
a sensible piece of kit. I'd be happy to do 30K a year in one - the
TD5 does fine at legal speeds (good for keeping the license!).

Regards

William MacLeod

 
Austin Shackles wrote:
> On or around Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:04:01 -0000, "Graham G"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>
>>New L200 every time! I've heard all sorts of problems with navaras. Been
>>having this discussion on another NG, the L200 seems to have won hands down.
>>As someone who runs a Shogun as an everyday hack I can vouch for
>>reliability, service and build of mitsubishi.

>
>
> I hear that the TD5 is still a bit lacklustre in the defenders, too.
>
> Now, if ford can get their act together to put the 2.7 V6 from the disco 3
> into the replacement...
>
> mind, the L200 seems to be less of a bull**** truck than the rest.


And the current Toyota Hilux even less again - it would be my pick of
what's on the market at present in this class of vehicle.

--
EMB
 
On or around 15 Mar 2006 15:16:07 -0800, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Tim Hobbs wrote:
>
>> so in a straight shootout between the 110 Double Cab and the Nissan
>> Navara Adventura, which do I choose?

>
>I like to think that when I buy British stuff that it keeps the country
>ticking over and keeps some UK industry going. In ten years you
>probably won't have an option :-(
>
>Some things you just can't look at that way but I like 110s, the DC is
>a sensible piece of kit. I'd be happy to do 30K a year in one - the
>TD5 does fine at legal speeds (good for keeping the license!).


The chap I know who's just got rid of his 55 plate for an 06 plate nissan
tends to tow a large trailer quite a lot.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"My centre is giving way, my right is in retreat; situation excellent.
I shall attack. - Marshal Foch (1851 - 1929)
 
On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:36:36 +0000, Austin Shackles
<[email protected]> scribbled the following nonsense:

>On or around Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:04:01 -0000, "Graham G"
><[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>
>>New L200 every time! I've heard all sorts of problems with navaras. Been
>>having this discussion on another NG, the L200 seems to have won hands down.
>>As someone who runs a Shogun as an everyday hack I can vouch for
>>reliability, service and build of mitsubishi.

>
>I hear that the TD5 is still a bit lacklustre in the defenders, too.
>
>Now, if ford can get their act together to put the 2.7 V6 from the disco 3
>into the replacement...


wont happen, I have it from someone who works in R&D that its gonna be
the Transit lump.......
--

Simon Isaacs

Peterborough 4x4 Club Chairman, Newsletter Editor and Webmaster
Green Lane Association (GLASS) Financial Director
101 Ambi, undergoing camper conversion www.simoni.co.uk
1976 S3 LWT, Fully restored, ready for sale! Make me an offer!
Suzuki SJ410 (Wife's) 3" lift kit fitted, body shell now restored and mounted on chassis, waiting on a windscreen and MOT
Series 3 88" Rolling chassis...what to do next
1993 200 TDi Discovery
1994 200 TDi Discovery body shell, being bobbed and modded.....
 
EMB wrote:

> And the current Toyota Hilux even less again - it would be my pick of
> what's on the market at present in this class of vehicle.
>


Although all the Surf's I've looked at appear to have saggy rear ends,
even if the later 3.0 diesels aren't the disaster the old ones were.
No good for towing by the looks of them, so I'm left with looking at
older (3.1tdi) Izusu trooper (Bighorn). I'd like a 110 with the 3.1
engine in it....


--
Regards,
Danny

http://www.gaggia-espresso.com (a purely hobby site)
http://www.dannyscoffee.com (UK advert for my mobile espresso service)
http://www.malabargold.co.uk (UK/European online ordering for Malabar
Gold blend)
swap Z for above characters in email address to reply

 
On or around Thu, 16 Mar 2006 07:56:01 +0000 (UTC), Simon Isaacs
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>On Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:36:36 +0000, Austin Shackles
><[email protected]> scribbled the following nonsense:
>
>>On or around Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:04:01 -0000, "Graham G"
>><[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>
>>>
>>>New L200 every time! I've heard all sorts of problems with navaras. Been
>>>having this discussion on another NG, the L200 seems to have won hands down.
>>>As someone who runs a Shogun as an everyday hack I can vouch for
>>>reliability, service and build of mitsubishi.

>>
>>I hear that the TD5 is still a bit lacklustre in the defenders, too.
>>
>>Now, if ford can get their act together to put the 2.7 V6 from the disco 3
>>into the replacement...

>
>wont happen, I have it from someone who works in R&D that its gonna be
>the Transit lump.......


mind, they run that up to 137 kraut-horses, with torque overboost. Although
if it follows in the fine old LR tradition it'll have abvout 100 BHP and be
as flat as a fart.

why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"If you cannot mould yourself as you would wish, how can you expect
other people to be entirely to your liking?"
Thomas À Kempis (1380 - 1471) Imitation of Christ, I.xvi.
 
Austin Shackles wrote:

> why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?
>


To keep RPI, Allisport and Overfinch in a living?

P.
 
On or around Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:11:36 +0000, "Paul S. Brown"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Austin Shackles wrote:
>
>> why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?
>>

>
>To keep RPI, Allisport and Overfinch in a living?


heh. could have a point there.

but John Jones the Farmer doesn't want to have to fart about, he wants
something that works out of the box. If Dai Davies down the road has a
nissan and says hey this is great, lugs my sheep trailer far better than the
landy ever did, then JJ is going to go an buy one. increasingly few LRs
around this area and a lot more Jap double-cabs.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Too Busy: Your mind is like a motorway. Sometimes it can be jammed by
too much traffic. Avoid the jams by never using your mind on a
Bank Holiday weekend.
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 
Austin Shackles wrote:

> On or around Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:11:36 +0000, "Paul S. Brown"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>Austin Shackles wrote:
>>
>>> why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?
>>>

>>
>>To keep RPI, Allisport and Overfinch in a living?

>
> heh. could have a point there.
>
> but John Jones the Farmer doesn't want to have to fart about, he wants
> something that works out of the box. If Dai Davies down the road has a
> nissan and says hey this is great, lugs my sheep trailer far better than
> the
> landy ever did, then JJ is going to go an buy one. increasingly few LRs
> around this area and a lot more Jap double-cabs.
>


Landrover lost this market in Australia and most of the rest of the world to
the Japanese over twenty years ago. Mainly due to better dealer network,
price and comfort, to some extent power and quality control. Landrover, by
concentrating on luxury cars has sent a clear signal they don't want this
market. There is a rumour here that they are about to close all dealers
outside of the state capitals, which shows just how much they want this
market. (How would you be if your ECU needs resetting 1000km from the
nearest dealer?)
JD
 
In message <[email protected]>
JD <[email protected]> wrote:

> Austin Shackles wrote:
>
> > On or around Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:11:36 +0000, "Paul S. Brown"
> > <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >
> >>Austin Shackles wrote:
> >>
> >>> why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?
> >>>
> >>
> >>To keep RPI, Allisport and Overfinch in a living?

> >
> > heh. could have a point there.
> >
> > but John Jones the Farmer doesn't want to have to fart about, he wants
> > something that works out of the box. If Dai Davies down the road has a
> > nissan and says hey this is great, lugs my sheep trailer far better than
> > the
> > landy ever did, then JJ is going to go an buy one. increasingly few LRs
> > around this area and a lot more Jap double-cabs.
> >

>
> Landrover lost this market in Australia and most of the rest of the world to
> the Japanese over twenty years ago. Mainly due to better dealer network,
> price and comfort, to some extent power and quality control. Landrover, by
> concentrating on luxury cars has sent a clear signal they don't want this
> market. There is a rumour here that they are about to close all dealers
> outside of the state capitals, which shows just how much they want this
> market. (How would you be if your ECU needs resetting 1000km from the
> nearest dealer?)
> JD


They pretty much did that here - a whole raft of dealers who could not/
would not stump around £1 million to have their premises tarted up
to look like a glorified hairdressing salon lost their franchises, the
net result being that those most likley to want one have to travel
into a city (or large town) to get one, and even worse, to get
it serviced (and be given a Nissan Micra coutesey car!).

Having said that though, the double cab trend is doing a Dihatusu
round here - everyone dumps LR in favour of the latest trend, then
come back to LR (were talking Defender *users* here, not the Life
Style bridage).

It seems to very much depend on the individual dealers though - round
here Defender sales (and the follow-on sales from the rest of the
range) are *very* strong again after a bit of a pasue while the
first Td5's were "tested") - personaly I believe that has a lot
to do with having two big dealerships within the same distance
from the user base, i.e. competition. You have a hell of a job
getting a second hand Defender at all, and it's been that way
for some time now - indeed a half decent early 90 is fetching
around £1000 more than the same vehicle would have 3 years ago.

Richard
--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
Boycott the Yorkshire Dales - No Play, No Pay
 
beamendsltd wrote:

> In message <[email protected]>
> JD <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Austin Shackles wrote:
>>
>> > On or around Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:11:36 +0000, "Paul S. Brown"
>> > <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>> >
>> >>Austin Shackles wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> why TF do LR so persistently underpower their vehicles?
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>To keep RPI, Allisport and Overfinch in a living?
>> >
>> > heh. could have a point there.
>> >
>> > but John Jones the Farmer doesn't want to have to fart about, he wants
>> > something that works out of the box. If Dai Davies down the road has a
>> > nissan and says hey this is great, lugs my sheep trailer far better
>> > than the
>> > landy ever did, then JJ is going to go an buy one. increasingly few
>> > LRs around this area and a lot more Jap double-cabs.
>> >

>>
>> Landrover lost this market in Australia and most of the rest of the world
>> to the Japanese over twenty years ago. Mainly due to better dealer
>> network, price and comfort, to some extent power and quality control.
>> Landrover, by concentrating on luxury cars has sent a clear signal they
>> don't want this market. There is a rumour here that they are about to
>> close all dealers outside of the state capitals, which shows just how
>> much they want this market. (How would you be if your ECU needs resetting
>> 1000km from the nearest dealer?)
>> JD

>
> They pretty much did that here - a whole raft of dealers who could not/
> would not stump around £1 million to have their premises tarted up
> to look like a glorified hairdressing salon lost their franchises, the
> net result being that those most likley to want one have to travel
> into a city (or large town) to get one, and even worse, to get
> it serviced (and be given a Nissan Micra coutesey car!).
>
> Having said that though, the double cab trend is doing a Dihatusu
> round here - everyone dumps LR in favour of the latest trend, then
> come back to LR (were talking Defender *users* here, not the Life
> Style bridage).
>
> It seems to very much depend on the individual dealers though - round
> here Defender sales (and the follow-on sales from the rest of the
> range) are *very* strong again after a bit of a pasue while the
> first Td5's were "tested") - personaly I believe that has a lot
> to do with having two big dealerships within the same distance
> from the user base, i.e. competition. You have a hell of a job
> getting a second hand Defender at all, and it's been that way
> for some time now - indeed a half decent early 90 is fetching
> around £1000 more than the same vehicle would have 3 years ago.
>
> Richard


Yes - but you live in a country you can drive across in a morning! So even
so, you are never very far from a dealer. Hard finding a second hand
Defender here, mainly because they are so rare to start with. I get this
state's main "farming" paper, the Land, which is a weekly. They have a
large classified advertising section, with a section for four wheel drives.
Without doing an actual count, I would say that probably only every second
or third issue has any Landrover at all advertised, and probably only three
or four times a year is there a Defender (or Series) advertised. This from
a situation forty years ago where there was nothing else except Landrovers.
Even thirty years ago they were common. Although I live in a farming area,
I can't think of anyone else within fifty kilometres that has any
Landrover. Mostly it is a question of whether they have a Toyota or Nissan,
with some Daihatsus, Mitsubishis, Mazda, Suzuki, Ford, Holden etc. Even
Tata and Kia four wheel drives are more common than Landrovers.
JD
 
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