just joined, listing my problem!

After introducing myseld earlier i was advised to put this post in here for others to see.

Not after the miracle cure as i have exhausted all i can think of or seen throughout my search, so i wil just put my symptoms down and leave it be.

Its a 2000 TD4 freelander, and until now has been fine (including some heavy duty offroading a year ago over the tank trails of Salisbury plain (gaylander indeed)

so to quote from previous post

And what is this most recent problem to challenge the forum with?

It is always worth remembering that if main stealer mechanics were so Goddam smart, they wouldn't be mechanics, they would be brain surgeons or something. Ask the forum - say exactly year and model of Landy, give the best description you can of the problem, how it started, how it shows up, then sit back and wait.....

CharlesY


The most recent problem is that the engine cranks but wont start. its like its immoblised.

its not immobilised as far as i turn off the immobiliser, the immob light goes out. so i started diagnosing from there.

its not the fuel pump in the tank, its not a blocked fuel filter, it has fuel up to the injectors as i cracked off the unions and there is fuel there. so basically the injectors are the stopping point.

possible faults.. bad injectors, faulty crank sensor (or other sensor related) or an ecu fault.

I am a mechanic in training ,and i really hate the idea of someone else working on my cars (yeah i have a few) but right now, i need to know what the ecu thinks the problem is, or if the ecu is the fault.

I wont go to the main stealers, ever. so i am going to an independent who i hope will diagnose the fault for me.

Oh, bit of history, the car wasworking fine, i washed it,used it for a 3 mile journey and then parked on a slope. there is fuel in there, so that sensor should be fine (but i guess it may have gone)

My money is on it being the crank sensor or alarm ecu, but who knows, find out on monday!

finally... the wife made me buy it.. i drive jap cars normally, and to be honest i drove a lot of defenders over a military career, and i am amazed how much the freelander can do, considering its main purpose is the road. dont tell the wife but i have found myself quite attached to it!

its good that you are quite attatched to the wife,makes for a long and happy marriage...and youll need one of those if your venturing into landrover ownership lol
its hard to diognose a fault without seeing car etc and youve most of the points highlighted anyway....but and its a wild outsider...are your heater plugs working?, gotta be worth checking

Hi mate and welcome, dont listen to the nosher's putting down freelanders down, they just havnt worked out it out what "fun" it is to own one.
Anyhoo, mine just died on a speed bump at work have a read of this post, it may help or not but you have to try every thing http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f9/my-freelander-has-just-died-70220.html

I'm not a nosher and I quite like gaylanders.....seen a bobcat one on a pay and play day twas gor gee uss

Sounds like you may not have enough fuel pressure at cranking speed.
Do a search for Injector leak off test if your unsure how to do it.

If it's only hot starting thats a problem then it's the cam sensor.

Here it is...

Remove one of the leak-off pipes from the top of an injector and block/clamp off the fuel return to the tank, if you want put a tube to the top of the injector and the other end into a container, switch the ignition on (don't start) and see if there is any leak off. Do the same thing to each injector in turn until you find the leaking one.
If the valve in the injector is not closing the fuel system is unable to create high enough fuel pressure to the common rail for the engine to start up.

Chaser said:

Here it is...

Remove one of the leak-off pipes from the top of an injector and block/clamp off the fuel return to the tank, if you want put a tube to the top of the injector and the other end into a container, switch the ignition on (don't start) and see if there is any leak off. Do the same thing to each injector in turn until you find the leaking one.
If the valve in the injector is not closing the fuel system is unable to create high enough fuel pressure to the common rail for the engine to start up.

Click to expand...

Hi Chaser...

kinda lost me a bit there. could you expand a little.

The fuel pipe joins teh injector on a union connection. where am i cracking of and testing.

I have carried out a fuel test to check the fuel gets TO the injectors, just making sure its not the same test your suggesting as i got lost while reading it.

I am not sure what a leak off pipe is, so think thats where i got lost

Wife's 03plate td4 Freelander wouldn't start last year, she had it recovered to a main dealer whilst I was away.
£160 (2 hours labour to diagnose the fault on the computer)
2 faulty injectors
replaced started and ran fine

final total

£750

she now drives a Corsa

There should be little or no fuel from the top of the injector when the ignition is on without the engine running. If there is the fuel pressure cannot build up enough in the rail for starting as it requires more pressure to start than it does to run.

You can twist off the rubber leak off pipe to each injector in turn and test.
Because the leak off pipes are connected in series you need to blank/clamp the open ends.
If one injector obviously leaks more than the others then change it.

another long shot but worth checking anyway......do freelanders have a fuel shut off valve? usually reset them by pressing the top back down with the ignition turned to on if so......

Another test. When you crank it is there any white smoke from the exhaust? If no then there is no fuel entering the cylinders. Its going to be a fuel problem for sure. Its a matter of tracing it through the system. In the case of Shamus1578 L series he had a short in one of the wire looms in the engine management system. If the ECU can't run then no fuel is injected and the syptoms look exactly like yours. If there is low fuel pressure due to a failed pump, blocked filter, leak or a faulty injector then you'll get no fuel and the syptoms are the same. As the chaps said above, check your fuel pressure first. If the pressure is up in the common rail then the engine management is next in line for checking. The cut off valve is another easy check.

Keep us posted and good luck.

right, simple things first. have you checked the fuel cut off switch. this has a red rubber cover, and as you look at the engine from the front of the car, is at the back right hand side, just under the fuse/ecu box. can be located by a white sticker with a crossed out petrol (or diesel pump) shown on it. Give this a good hard press down to reset it if necessary. Assuming this is okay, would be looking to one of two issues, as previously stated. Then check all the relevant fuses

1) camshaft position sensor. This is located on the top of the engine under the cover. with both covers off, it will be just in front of the yellow oil filler cap, and can be seen by the 3 wires going to it from the loom. Can't really do any fault finding on this, just make sure the plug is home and properly seated. Not sure what reading you should get from this on a DVM, but from memory, a duff sensor will cause a fault code to be stored in the ecu, so any garage with diagnostics (not just land rover) should be able to read and confirm. A new one should be less than £50.

2) faulty injector. As part of its "advanced" design, the TD4 engine monitors the pressure at each injector, and requires that the pressure at all 4 injectors be equal. If you have a faulty injector, fuel under pressure will leak off via the return fuel line, or into the cylinder. This imbalance will prevent the engine from starting. The only way to test is to do a leak off test as described above. Disconnect the hoses one at time from the injectors, and put the end into a glass jam jar. crank the engine over and compare the amount of fuel delivered in a fixed period of time, say 2 seconds. if there is in imbalance, it will show in the amount of fuel delivered each time. (don't forget to empty the jar each time).

As a guide, mine had this problem, and it turned out to be a faulty injector. whilst the garage had it, at my request, they removed all 4 injectors and refurbished them, before refitting. Total cost, including diagnostics, and 2 lots of recovery, one to the garage, and then on to the diesel specialist they use was about £750.

If you are thinking of removing the injectors yourself, depending on the mileage, get ready for a struggle. If they haven't been out by 40k, it's going to be hard work. but there is a really good thread on here describing how to make your won slide hammer to get them out. there is a "proper" one made by Draper I think which does the job as well.

Good Luck, keep us posted.

Injector leak off test only requires ignition on O.P. not cranking, as the injectors valve need to be closed during the test.

thanks for the advice guys.

Still no luck and have done everything up to the injector leak off test, as i am not confident to do it correctly right now (stressed out)!!

Its booked in for a diagnostic on Monday so will be dropping it off tomorrow.

fingers crossed for me please!!

will let you all know what the outcome is.

Chaser said:

Injector leak off test only requires ignition on O.P. not cranking, as the injectors valve need to be closed during the test.

Click to expand...

always happy to be corrected !

Quick check to verify whether there is sufficient low fuel pressure arriving at the high pressure fuel pump: remove the electrical connection from the low pressure fuel sensor on the fuel filter (below under bonnet fusebox : download 'rave' vie 'greenoval' site for better details) if the engine now starts then you have insufficient low fuel pressure and need to check the 2 pumps and the fuel filter.D..

well she went in today... so just a waiting game now until the guy diagnoses on Monday.

Strange thing was i could see pound coins rolling out my wallet as i drove away... bad omen time.

pound coins? Dream on. Got any 20's or 50's in there? Actually - take ur cheque book...............

mysteryman said:

pound coins? Dream on. Got any 20's or 50's in there? Actually - take ur cheque book...............

Click to expand...

More right than youprobably imagined.

Turned out to be the high pressure fuel pump. i checked the low pressure pumps, but not the high.

400 notes later, and off we go again. definetly going green laning more now, cant have that sort of money going to waste!

anyone know some routes in Northants!