Series 3 Indicator Troubleshooting...... after a visit to the garage and MOT

So, George passed his MOT (apparently) and have a lovely bill to suggest a lot of work was done from the last visit to the garage. However, now ive got indicator problems..... even though they were fine before.

The vehicle had been wired so the lights would work of ignition live but this has now been changed to battery live since the MOT man said it had to be that way. This is the biggest electrical change since all was well as far I can tell, plus wiring a glow plug switch from the battery straight to the switch and then plugs.

Indicators are working fine with headlights and sides off. Once the side lights in position 2 are engaged and I try to use the indicators the flasher unit buzzes which I presume means there isn't enough power to run it. In position 3 with the lights on, the flasher unit makes no noise, HOWEVER the warning lights for the indicators on the dash are lit up solid and the indicator bulbs are also solid. This issue occurs when the vehicle is both running and not running.

Now to check the Earths as I have been advised, HOW? I understand setting the meter to omhs, however where do the probes go to check the earth from the flasher unit for example since i've the 4 pin version? Is this the only earth I can check for this?

I would like to start the wiring from scratch however im moving in 2 weeks and need to have this sorted so I can make a 400 mile trip....

Hopefully someone has hit this wall in the past and can help! Sorry i'm only ever asking questions but im still early into the experience

Interesting. It would be usual and easy to blame bad earths and it may be bad earths, but it could also be the change from lights on ign to bat or a mix of both. There's no science to checking the earths - just a 12v bulb and 2 wires, one to bat live and the other to what should be earthed, if it doesn't light or is dull its a bad earth, the hard part is getting whatever screw, clip or bit of bent metal clean. As mine is ex-army all the earths are wired back to the bulkhead which makes this job a lot easier. did the indicators ever work right after the wiring change? Some indicator instrument lights are cross connected so they are live - live when off and earth through the "off" bulb when on, if its wired like this the light wiring change could mess it up by cross connecting indictor earth to sidelight live. I would still start with cleaning all the bulb holders and taking a wire from each bulb case to bat earth and seeing what happens, but if that doesn't work be prepared to dig deeper into how its wired.

As you've paid the garage to fix your issues I would just take it back as I see it as their responsibility now.
Could be a simple earth issue, or a can of worms perhaps?

Be careful probing about with a ohm meter. Make sure the circuit being tested is switched off, if you accidentally put 12 volts through a meter set to ohms you may damage it. It sounds like the indicator bulbs are getting a feed that is independant of the the flasher relay so somehow the indicators are now wired into the feed for the lights and that feed is after the relay. Either that or your relay is faulty, they are not expensive so it may be worth changing it so as to eliminate it from the problem.

Col

Land Raver said:

As you've paid the garage to fix your issues I would just take it back as I see it as their responsibility now.
Could be a simple earth issue, or a can of worms perhaps?

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I would normally do this but seeing as they've caused the fault and ive not been impressed with their work to date its not worth bringing it back to them. They are the sort of lads that would rob the wire they needed from a crusty junker and put it into mine in the hope it would all work.

Take a wire from battery to live feed on the indicators and see if they work. If it works, just leave it connected. Not working look at flasher unit and fuse. Earth from battery with wire to indicator circuit and see if this works as well.

Does it have a 2 wire or 3 wire flasher unit? I seem to remember this can be imporant but I can't remember why!

rob1miles said:

Does it have a 2 wire or 3 wire flasher unit? I seem to remember this can be imporant but I can't remember why!

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I remember seeing in a few other threads and people were talking about the 2 and 3 pin flasher units, but i've got a 4 pin. What i'm going to do today is rewire the fuse box and put it back to as standard as possible. Then start testing for earths and see where the earth from the flasher unit is going to and see if it can be cleaned. Failing all that, make new earths for the indicators and headlights.

So this morning I cleaned the contacts on the indicators and tested the earths on them and all is well. However the issue of the indicators not working when the lights are on remains. The earth on the flasher unit is good, ive cleaned all the contacts etc.

One thing that has me confused is why the indicator warning lights on the dash light up when I put the side/main lights on. Even when the lights are wired to ignition live (they had been fused) they (warning lights) still light up solid, dim when the side lights are on and bright when the headlights are on.

Could it just be a bad flasher unit that needs replacing? One thing I didnt mention, was aswell as making the lights wiring to batt live they also took the 12v feed to the inspection sockets are wired in a small 12v socket for me. On the wiring diagram it shows the power for the lights coming from that feed with a clinch connector which I cant find because when I follow the black and brown wires of the 12v inspection sockets feed it dissapears into the loom.

Thank you all for the help so far!

How bright are your headlights?
Maybe they have a bad earth so using dash indicator lamps as secondary path to earth.

Blackburn said:

How bright are your headlights?
Maybe they have a bad earth so using dash indicator lamps as secondary path to earth.

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Just going to try that now! The lights are their usual brightness and dont appear to change when the indicator is used. I just wired the indicators straight from ignition live just to see if something was getting confused on the fuse box but no.

Try pushing the indicator stalk a little bit to see if it is making good contact.

Gmacz said:

Try pushing the indicator stalk a little bit to see if it is making good contact.

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The indicator is working though just not when the side and headlights are on. I pulled the indicator warning lights out and still it won't indicate with the lights on and the relay fuses buzzes when just the side lights are on.

There is a short somewhere by the sound of it. It can take ages to track down electrical problems like this. I would be tempted to rewire either the headlights and sidelights or the indicators. Have you tried a different flasher unit?

Col

Although the earths around the vehicle are a bit crummy and will need attention as soon as, I found the problem, it was the instrument panel lights. On the wiring diagram it shows them to have an earth wire but no sign of that in my truck unless maybe the earth into the dash itself. Either way, I disconnected those lights at the lights switch and i'm set up again.

Dash light earths are usually black wires attached to gauge mounting screws then a common one to ground either back of dash or on steering box strengthening bracket under bonnet.

For some reason there's no earths coming off the back of them. I suppose I am lucky owner No. 13 after all

So after I thought all was well it wasnt. I was even on the phone to the local garage and it was working one second and not the next. Just to wrap up the story in case anyone has the same issue in the future. I clean/replaced all the earth connectors around the vehicles including the rear which seemed to be the worst due to not really being covered properly. I still had issues at this stage and turned my attention to the dash. I think what did the trick was making an earth which went to a number of places behind the dash and ran it straight to the bulkhead. Everything is working again and brighter than before. If anyone ever needs a hand on troubleshooting im more than happy to help Thanks for the advice everyone!

I have an earth terminal block screwed to the bulkhead and run all the earths to it and one thicker wire from that to the bat earth to be sure.
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Dylan353 said:

The vehicle had been wired so the lights would work of ignition live but this has now been changed to battery live since the MOT man said it had to be that way

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my lights are ignition on live and I have had no problems getting an mot with them like that since 2010.

had lots of other problems getting it through though