Jon Dor
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 1,672
- Location
- Beverley, East Riding of Yorkshire
No nonsense, to-the-point Golden info as always from Mozz...despite him being a Manchester City Fanatic =~}
P38A Ignition Key
- Thread starter simoncant
- Start date
This site contains affiliate links for which LandyZone may be compensated if you make a purchase.
I think I read on another site that there are no more key 1s and 2s left in the supply chain. In any case, I got a replacement about a year ago from Guy Salmon for £160. They didn't ask the key number, and the one supplied has a white label on the back (ie blank). The key is sync'd at the dealers (but just the simple lock &press the button, unlock & press the button). To order it they have used your VIN. If your RR has ever had a replacement BeCM then you need to pause, as the dealer will have the info for the original BeCM, so more detective work required on your part.
I'm unconvinced that turning EKA off is a good idea, as it is one less means of sorting out a permanent immobilisation. I have a query out with BBS about this - they can't tell me what turning it off will do, and though I love fiddling with stuff this may be a bridge too far... Of course other folks may have just jumped in and done it. So I'd be interested to know what has happened, and whether ACTIVE immobilisation is cancelled as well, when you cancel the EKA. Turning off immobilisation in nano just suspends the PASSIVE immobilisation as far as I know.
So for the key, i suggest you bite the bullet and go to the dealers.... once you have the good replacement, then you can refurb the first. Depending on how bad your current fob is you may be able to use a kit off ebay, without having to go as far as opening the case, which I understand is the real PITA
I'm unconvinced that turning EKA off is a good idea, as it is one less means of sorting out a permanent immobilisation. I have a query out with BBS about this - they can't tell me what turning it off will do, and though I love fiddling with stuff this may be a bridge too far... Of course other folks may have just jumped in and done it. So I'd be interested to know what has happened, and whether ACTIVE immobilisation is cancelled as well, when you cancel the EKA. Turning off immobilisation in nano just suspends the PASSIVE immobilisation as far as I know.
So for the key, i suggest you bite the bullet and go to the dealers.... once you have the good replacement, then you can refurb the first. Depending on how bad your current fob is you may be able to use a kit off ebay, without having to go as far as opening the case, which I understand is the real PITA
Last edited:
- Posts
- 15,186
- Location
- Benfleet, Essex
Wow! That is odd.
I had no issues and mine came back withing 48-Hours and was fully fixed. I wonder what went wrong for you.
- Posts
- 18,969
- Location
- Buckinghamshire, UK. ('95 DT)
They have whatever is required. It is just a number in the code transmitted to the car so programmed when the fob is set up. I think some dealers say there are no #1 or #2 if you don't know what number you have. As far as I am aware #3 and #4 do not activate the memory seats.
Some have started saying you can only get #1 on the assumption all #1 keys are gone. Rubbish! I'm still using the original #1 key for mine!
You're right on the Nanocom and the passive immobilisation.
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
Turning off EKA removes the need for EKA. the EKA is for when the FOB loses sync with the BECM, with EKA is off the worst that can happen is the FOB will lose sync and not open the car, re-syncing does not need the EKA code in this situation, the car will open and operate normally with the key. Turning off the immobiliser means the EDC is re- mobilised at all times when the ignition is turned on unless there is some problem with the BECM which causes the code to be lost. Loss of the code requires diagnostics in all cases if the code is corrupted or lost. The alarm remains operational All this only apples to the diesel which uses a fixed sync code for the EDC. No idea what happens with the V8 but I do know the the immobiliser operation is different.
Last edited:
Tenebreaux
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 3,836
- Location
- Armagh
Fob was unrepairable, which is fair enough. He seemed to lose interest after that. Had it for three weeks, didn't answer emails, didn't answer the phone. I started a case in small claims for the cost of a replacement key and, miraculously, his email started working again two minutes after I let him know the case details.
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
Mr Sporty fixes FOB's by swapping the chip to a working doner board, it doesn't always work. Mine came back with the wrong key blade, the FOB appeared to work but would not sync to the car so may have also had the wrong chip. There are several different versions of the FOB innards. Always worth a try though.
Tnx Datatek,
On my V8 gems I entered the eka via nanocom to cancel immobilisation (following a flat battery) which requested an eka code or press of the fob on the dash. So I assume that if you've cancelled the eka in the becm menu, and the fob has fallen out of sync after the battery going flat (as it does), you wd be left with an immobile car and no way to enter the becm using a nanocom.
So unless I'm 100pc sure that deselecting for eka in becm also cancels the engine Immobilisation/becm lockout I won't risk fiddling
On my V8 gems I entered the eka via nanocom to cancel immobilisation (following a flat battery) which requested an eka code or press of the fob on the dash. So I assume that if you've cancelled the eka in the becm menu, and the fob has fallen out of sync after the battery going flat (as it does), you wd be left with an immobile car and no way to enter the becm using a nanocom.
So unless I'm 100pc sure that deselecting for eka in becm also cancels the engine Immobilisation/becm lockout I won't risk fiddling
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
EKA only relates to loss of sync between the FOB & the BECM which stops you unlocking with the FOB, nothing directly to do with the immobiliser, it's the action of unlocking that re-mobilises the engine, with EKA enabled the BECM expects the FOB to unlock and unlocking with the key does not re-mobilise the engine, with EKA disabled the BECM does not expect the FOB to unlock so unlocking with the key blade re-mobilises the car which can still be done with Nanocom if needs be.
I have 2 P38 diesels running with EKA and immobiliser disabled because I'm too tight to buy a second FOB for the project car, no problems encountered. The settings can be changed back at any time with Nanocom if needs be.
- Posts
- 58,170
- Location
- Preston Lancs.
The EKA code has nothing to do with engine to BECM sync.
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
That is what I said
- Posts
- 58,170
- Location
- Preston Lancs.
Post 29 doesn't say that either - so we agree. If it was my use of the phrase "engine immobilisation/ becm lockout" - i was just referring to the alarmed state which immobilises the engine and also prevents the BeCM from being edited.
Datatek, thanks for the info re EKA, good to know. If you carry the nanocom you would always have an EKA get out of jail, no? I'm still not getting how the EKA does anything to correct/ resync the FOB and BECM. The EKA is just used to exit the alarmed state, surely? (eg I entered the EKA code on my car after flat battery and then got to alarm deactivated/ engine remobilised - i THEN also had to resynch the FOB and BeCM)
But out of curiosity, with EKA disabled: When you unlock your cars with the key do all 4 doors unlock? Do the fobs still work for remote unlocking (even if they're no longer required to get out of the alarmed state)?
Datatek, thanks for the info re EKA, good to know. If you carry the nanocom you would always have an EKA get out of jail, no? I'm still not getting how the EKA does anything to correct/ resync the FOB and BECM. The EKA is just used to exit the alarmed state, surely? (eg I entered the EKA code on my car after flat battery and then got to alarm deactivated/ engine remobilised - i THEN also had to resynch the FOB and BeCM)
But out of curiosity, with EKA disabled: When you unlock your cars with the key do all 4 doors unlock? Do the fobs still work for remote unlocking (even if they're no longer required to get out of the alarmed state)?
Last edited:
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
EKA does not resync the FOB, on post 99 cars the FOB will resync via the passive coil in the ignition lock, on earlier cars there is a different procedure after EKA has let you in.
With EKA turned off, all 4 doors unlock/lock either with the FOB or the key blade so the car is always accessible/operational regardless of the state of the FOB.
Thanks for clarifying that Datatek.
To answer my own question about why EKA disabling may not be a good idea it's the key in the door which disables the alarm. After 20+ years the micro-switches in the door may fail/ have failed. If you have no option of entering EKA via the OBD II port, then you are left trying to pull the door card and ground wires in the door (if you're not super-locked). I found a long thread elsewhere of someone who had EKA disabled and this was what he ended up having to do - even though his Nano would have got him in in a matter of minutes if EKA had been enabled (in a v36 onwards BeCM)
To answer my own question about why EKA disabling may not be a good idea it's the key in the door which disables the alarm. After 20+ years the micro-switches in the door may fail/ have failed. If you have no option of entering EKA via the OBD II port, then you are left trying to pull the door card and ground wires in the door (if you're not super-locked). I found a long thread elsewhere of someone who had EKA disabled and this was what he ended up having to do - even though his Nano would have got him in in a matter of minutes if EKA had been enabled (in a v36 onwards BeCM)
Last edited:
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
EKA can be enabled or disabled at will so there will never be a need to pull a door card off, with EKA turned off it becomes IRRELEVENT and is never needed either from the key or from the Nanocom. If the micro switches are dodgy, you will have problems with or without EKA enabled
You're sure? I thought the alarmed state prevented you making edits to BeCM ? It certainly stops you disabling the EKA from the disarmed state, not tried in reverse. If the micro-switches are dodgy, post v36, you just hop in with the nanocom and an EKA to dis-arm, no problem, but if you've disabled EKA, you're screwed, (unless an alarmed BeCM will accept the edit to re-enable the EKA code). Why take the risk, if you have a nanocom?
Datatek
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 43,986
- Location
- Near Poitiers SW France
You are confusing the alarm and the alarmed and locked state of the BECM. In the unlikely event that the BECM is alarmed and locked you can do nothing with a Nanocom, it's nothing to do with EKA, You then need Faultmate with the direct access 035 module to unlock the BECM.
You go your own way, I have been running 2 P38's with EKA and the immobiliser turned off for a long time now, initially because a dodgy micro switch in the drivers door lock was causing problems, that problem also went away. The alarm remains active and is disabled by the act of unlocking by key or Fob.
