Gearbox problem P38A 4.6 auto hse

Hi all,
Today I was towing a bmw with no wheels on it, just few meters to get it out of the way. I was looking for best traction so wheel spinning is not in my book on the soil where I was. I slowly moved it along and then my gearbox lost drive. Now I knew the high low motor was not in good order but in did engage the low setting and the clunk was there when it was selected. Now I only have first gear and reverse in both high and low but stumped as to what it may be.
Can anyone point the finger at what's to blame or cause, problem (except me).

Mick.:wtf:

Transfer box ECU gone up in smoke is a possible if the Hi/Lo motor was partially seized.

Hi Datatek,
Thanks for replying,
Luckily my mate has 4 poster lift so its on that today. We will be looking at that first thing via the software we have. When its running and selecting D, 3rd, 2nd we can here a small sort of pump noise coming from the gearbox, when in 1st and reverse its not there, any ideas?

Thanks in advance.

Dissapointment to see ATF in the transfer box, managed to replace the high low wiper motor and the ECU under passenger seat, just to make sure first. New, second hand gearbox to go in, just got to pick it up this morning from Nick & Chris in heanor near derby, good lads there, good father and son team. Should be back on he road by tomorrow night, if I'm not too tired from lifting the gbox out?

P38A4.6 said:

Dissapointment to see ATF in the transfer box, managed to replace the high low wiper motor and the ECU under passenger seat, just to make sure first. New, second hand gearbox to go in, just got to pick it up this morning from Nick & Chris in heanor near derby, good lads there, good father and son team. Should be back on he road by tomorrow night, if I'm not too tired from lifting the gbox out?

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Why disappointing to see ATF in the transfer box? It's the correct lubricant.

ATF. Thanks for that, ATF is the correct fluid although I'm raising a question here. As much I can remember I'm sure it was hypoid gear oil was used in the classic transfer box? That said I understand the hypoid gear itself and why its used in the axles, so why, because of the high surface pressure in the transfer box do they suggest the ATF now. Not at all questioning your knowledge or the LR handbook but ?? Could do with a LR or oil techie for this one, even though ATF will be going into the transfer box, again. As for the fault or let's say damage in the gearbox, is clutch plate d (I think) is kaput in the first set, easy to spot once it's apart and a broken, well it looks like a washer with inward facing blades on it , anyway not many things to replace and its ultra clean inside so it's my now spare box. Tip, when waiting for traffic lights, junctions or waiting for some:crazy_driver: to get out of your way, put it in neutral or park and also, I have done this before and it probably did it in in the end, driving manuals and switching off the engine before I'd stopped was probably OK but its not for and auto box maybe.

Thanks for your input and don't forget "all" 4x4s/suvs get a commercial MOT this year, costs more too.

P38A4.6 said:

ATF. Thanks for that, ATF is the correct fluid although I'm raising a question here. As much I can remember I'm sure it was hypoid gear oil was used in the classic transfer box? That said I understand the hypoid gear itself and why its used in the axles, so why, because of the high surface pressure in the transfer box do they suggest the ATF now. Not at all questioning your knowledge or the LR handbook but ?? Could do with a LR or oil techie for this one, even though ATF will be going into the transfer box, again. As for the fault or let's say damage in the gearbox, is clutch plate d (I think) is kaput in the first set, easy to spot once it's apart and a broken, well it looks like a washer with inward facing blades on it , anyway not many things to replace and its ultra clean inside so it's my now spare box. Tip, when waiting for traffic lights, junctions or waiting for some:crazy_driver: to get out of your way, put it in neutral or park and also, I have done this before and it probably did it in in the end, driving manuals and switching off the engine before I'd stopped was probably OK but its not for and auto box maybe.

Thanks for your input and don't forget "all" 4x4s/suvs get a commercial MOT this year, costs more too.

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Never stop the engine or select neutral while moving with an auto, no oil pump running equals a fecked gearbox PDQ.

Stripped the box, got a good spare gear and transfer box now. Nothing much wrong with it, couple of new clutch plates here and there, new spring washer, seals and gaskits. It couldn't get out of 1st gear was the reason and move onto 2nd and on, so certainly don't agree with it being fecked at all, just, heavy. Wonder how many engine and gearboxes including the cars have been scrapped because someone said its fecked. I suppose it easier to say its fecked than investigating it.
Thank anyway, I think? :emps1:

P38A4.6 said:

Stripped the box, got a good spare gear and transfer box now. Nothing much wrong with it, couple of new clutch plates here and there, new spring washer, seals and gaskits. It couldn't get out of 1st gear was the reason and move onto 2nd and on, so certainly don't agree with it being fecked at all, just, heavy. Wonder how many engine and gearboxes including the cars have been scrapped because someone said its fecked. I suppose it easier to say its fecked than investigating it.
Thank anyway, I think? :emps1:

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It didn't work, ergo it's fecked, the repair may have been easy for you, for most it's not and a recon box is the only option. Not expensive though and no excuse for scrappping a car.

Datatek said:

Never stop the engine or select neutral while moving with an auto, no oil pump running equals a fecked gearbox PDQ.

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if in neutral why does it matter.. Surely nothing is rotating? does the pump for the transfer box oil only run if the box is moving rather than the engine?

TCubed said:

if in neutral why does it matter.. Surely nothing is rotating? does the pump for the transfer box oil only run if the box is moving rather than the engine?

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Putting the stick in neutral does not disconnect the prop from the box so everything in the box continues to rotate except the oil pump which is driven by the engine. It may also flag a gearbox fault. Nothing to do with the transfer box.

Datatek said:

Putting the stick in neutral does not disconnect the prop from the box so everything in the box continues to rotate except the oil pump which is driven by the engine. It may also flag a gearbox fault. Nothing to do with the transfer box.

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So the wheels drive the prop shaft which drives the transfer box which drives the gearbox which is disconnected from the engine and thus the oil pump when in neutral?

TCubed said:

So the wheels drive the prop shaft which drives the transfer box which drives the gearbox which is disconnected from the engine and thus the oil pump when in neutral?

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No. With the car in neutral and coasting the engine running the oil pump is being driven. Coasting with the engine stopped will throw a gearbox fault because the gearbox ECU is not getting an engine speed signal from the engine ECU. And no gearbox speed signal can be sent to the engine ECU. That is why when the car is towed on it's wheels a 10 amp fuse must be put in position 11 in the BECM fuse box. To put the transfer box in neutral, or you WILL damage the gearbox. Coasting with the engine switched off is a no no and will always throw a fault.

TCubed said:

if in neutral why does it matter.. Surely nothing is rotating? does the pump for the transfer box oil only run if the box is moving rather than the engine?

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Pump in transfer box is mechanically driven by rotation of transfer box. Not by the engine. Gearbox oil pump is driven by engine.

So is it OK to coast with the gearbox in neutral but with the engine on if that's running the pump?
That's interesting about the transfer pump, so putting the transfer box in neutral before towing is to protect the gearbox rather than the transfer box?
Also just to add a fly when I had my stalling issue I had one case of running (granted only for about 20 yards) with the engine off but still in D, but no fault blipped up...

TCubed said:

So is it OK to coast with the gearbox in neutral but with the engine on if that's running the pump?
That's interesting about the transfer pump, so putting the transfer box in neutral before towing is to protect the gearbox rather than the transfer box?
Also just to add a fly when I had my stalling issue I had one case of running (granted only for about 20 yards) with the engine off but still in D, but no fault blipped up...

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It should have. When towing you put the transfer box in neutral to stop the gearbox being driven with no oil supply. With the transfer box in neutral the pump in there is still being driven but the gearbox isn't. Why would you want to coast in neutral?

wammers said:

It should have. When towing you put the transfer box in neutral to stop the gearbox being driven with no oil supply. With the transfer box in neutral the pump in there is still being driven but the gearbox isn't. Why would you want to coast in neutral?

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Hmm, well that's a mystery that was never solved haha
So when the TB is in neutral does that disconnect it from the gearbox rather than the wheels?
Well in an auto I can see very little reason to coast in neutral due to the lack of lockup meaning it causes little drag, but in a manual it could have some fuel economy benefits

TCubed said:

Hmm, well that's a mystery that was never solved haha
So when the TB is in neutral does that disconnect it from the gearbox rather than the wheels?
Well in an auto I can see very little reason to coast in neutral due to the lack of lockup meaning it causes little drag, but in a manual it could have some fuel economy benefits

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Tb in neutral disconnects the auto box, wheels still drive TB.

Datatek said:

It didn't work, ergo it's fecked, the repair may have been easy for you, for most it's not and a recon box is the only option. Not expensive though and no excuse for scrappping a car.

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I was really lucky to get a newish looking box, it even had the barcode sticker on it. I did look over the car, chassis and general condition of it and wondered why it had been scrapped, the engine was missing and I admit to removing the front axle for another job, and that had new upper and lower ball joints. I think the price of (rip off Britain) petrol,and garage labour charges and not forgetting how much "any" Land Rover spares are eventually put the poor chap off from buying one more thing for it. I do realise some people are not practically minded or age may be an issue or even a disability can impeded us, but owning one, well there's nothing else like it and the older mine gets the more I learn about it, which is a good thing.