Diesel power :-)

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w_mac

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Maybe of interest? www.Water4Gas.com.

I tested my newly fitted 4 water fuel cells today. I am having problems supplying enough vacuum and looks like I will have to fit a vacuum pump (thanks Slob) but even with the system only operating at around 30% or so the boost in performance is amazing!!! Like fecking AMAZING! I also run on 90% veg with a VOW2 pre heater. My engine is tired now and I don’t mind messing about with it if ya ken what I mean. Not for everyone I guess

I can now get up the drive at the front of me house in second gear easily. The old bugger struggled in first!
Nearly 50 in third instead of 40 and she still does not sound as strained. Strained is the magic word really, there is no strain, pulling well.

The claimed 20-50% increase in fuel consumption I will test over time and after I have fitted the vacuum pump.

I’ll let you know how I get along. If anyone is interested I’ll pop the e-books up somewhere for you to download. Saves buying the buggers eh!

Cheers
 
i was looking at this yesterday and spent ages trying to find a free download to see if it was snake oil or not. do yer think yer could e mail a copy to me? ta very muchness
 
So can I fill me tank up from the water mains now? and have you thought of contacting Honda as They are 3/4 of the way into a $2 Billion US. trying to develop an Hydrogen powered car that will be suitable for Mass Production. They're having major problem with the design of the Fuel cell and storage of the Hydrogen Gas. At an high enough pressure.
 
redhand said:
So can I fill me tank up from the water mains now? and have you thought of contacting Honda as They are 3/4 of the way into a $2 Billion US. trying to develop an Hydrogen powered car that will be suitable for Mass Production. They're having major problem with the design of the Fuel cell and storage of the Hydrogen Gas. At an high enough pressure.
Click to expand...
ah now yer see this 'snake oil' is only a supplement to yer doosul or petrol. its not a subsitute for yer fuel but a booster. so yer done need to keep lots of it nor does it have to be under a high pressure.
 
i seem to remember a while back there was an aussie who had converted an old rover v8 sd1.
anyone got the link for that as i,m sure it told you how to build your own on the super cheap
 
Hi,

New here on this forum but I was searching for any reference to anyone applying this water4gas idea on a Land Rover.

I have a 96 Disco that's in good shape. New cats and O2 sensors within the last6000 miles. I have been reading up in this and was wondering if it was worth playing with. Anyone have any thoughts?

Thanks. Len
 
Yep ...... Brown's gas is STEAM.

Steam does not burn.
Water is H2O = H-O-H = HHO, it's all the same.
Water does not burn.
Separating hydrogen and oxygen molecules uses MORE energy (due to inefficiency) than we will get by burning the hydrogen again.

Water injection (as a fine atomised mist, NOT as steam vapour) will sometimes have a good effect on power and fuel consumption in an engine.

It will help particularly when the engine is running hard and is very hot inside.

It is not new technology. They were using water injection extensively in aero engines and racing engines from the first world war on.

CharlesY
 
its not water injection charlesy. it seperates the h from the o² and feeds it into yer engine to boost yer fuel supply.. you have a small jar of water and two electrodes to perform that electolosissss thing.

i int read up on it all yet but the simple version is . you produce the hydrogen in situ and pipe in ito yer manifold or yer air intake.
 
slob said:
its not water injection charlesy. it seperates the h from the o² and feeds it into yer engine to boost yer fuel supply.. you have a small jar of water and two electrodes to perform that electolosissss thing.

i int read up on it all yet but the simple version is . you produce the hydrogen in situ and pipe in ito yer manifold or yer air intake.
Click to expand...

No meaningful quantity of hydrogen gas can be obtained in this way.
And it's the H that is two, and the O that is 1, seeing as in this water molecule oxygen has a valency of TWO, thus needs TWO hydrogens to make a "set", hence H2O . two Hs, and one O.

Take a litre of water. It weighs one kilo. It is made up of molecules of Hydrogen gas and Oxygen gas. Each molecule of water is 2 hydrogen atoms joined to one oxygen atom, aka H2O or another way H-O-H. A lot of energy was RELEASED as heat when the three atoms combined to form a water molecule. AT LEAST that much energy must be put back IN if you want to separate them again. Those are the laws of Physics and chemistry. There is meantime NO WAY ROUND THAT.

But ignoring that meantime .... back to our litre of water.

One atom of oxygen weighs 16 times as much as one atom of hydrogen, so in our one litre or one kilo of H20 we can work out the weight of hydrogen. In easy numbers, about one ninth of the mass of water is hydrogen gas, lets say about 110 grams. If that was liquid like diesel fuel that would be about two egg-cups full. The potential energy released from burning this hydrogen CAN NOT exceed the energy it took the split the water apart. The energy to split the atoms from each other by electrolysis came from the car's alternator, powered by diesel fuel. Hydrogen releases a lot LESS energy than diesel weight for weight. Hydrogen may be a CLEAN hot fuel, but is isn't particularly energetic.

Now, if we can agree that the basic laws of science apply, I would like someone to explain to me two things:

first, where does all the claimed EXTRA energy come from, because is certainly isn't from 110 grams of hydrogen in the lengthy time it will take to split a litre of water to all gases, and

second, why isn't this being used world wide ?

I bet there's going to be some answers of interest!

CharlesY
 
but yer willing to accept that less than 1% of acetone can make a difference. we have a member with this thing fitted so lets just wait and see what his findings are before yer start getting all scientiffic on us. oh and yer spotted ma late night boo boo i see. course its H² O and not O² H.
 
Hi CharlesY,

A very fine piece of work. I'll be honest, I'm just having fun and trying to save a few quid. I went for my first 50 mile round trip today on a full tank of veg got home filled it up and it looks like I have managed around 50MPG! I will confirm this over time though. The last thing I want to do is start exaggerating and sound like a fool :)

It is the way the my old diesel is running though that has impressed me though. I have a 8 mile stretch of road that I have been driving down for the past year now, that I can mange 50-55mph (RR diffs) depending on the breeze that I could keep at 65MPH with less strain! I Have lost my flat spot between 40mph and 45mph which gets me into 4th quicker and so on which really helps with slowing the traffic up a little.

Still an old landy but for me anyway there is a marked difference. Oh yeah, she runs a lot quieter .

Early days I guess and I still have the timing to mess about with, but I'll do that when I have sorted a better source of vacuum..

People are using the technology world wide! there are plans to run using only brown gas and folks do but it is much more complex than a booster. Maybe that might be a hoot to try :)

All the best...
 
Water vapor in to a petrol engine has the following effects.
1. Octain increase
Only usesfull if you advance the timing and increase the compression ratio

2. Replaces petrol used for Cooling with water.
Only usefull if you run high compression (see 1) ie turbo / super charger.
ie it reduces periginition when using very high pressures.

3. Leaning out the mixture (Controlled air leak)

Here are some links i found.
Water injection (engines) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.turbotuning.net/Artikel/naca-wr-e-264.pdf
Mother Earth Alcohol Fuel: Ron Novak's Do-It-Yourself Water Injection System
116+ Octane With Water Methanol Injection!

Stay away from the "Snake oil" lot claiming to run a car on water.
 
slob said:
but yer willing to accept that less than 1% of acetone can make a difference. we have a member with this thing fitted so lets just wait and see what his findings are before yer start getting all scientiffic on us. oh and yer spotted ma late night boo boo i see. course its H² O and not O² H.
Click to expand...

Yes, the acetone thing is quite different. Quarter of one percent is enough to make it work. In my 90 litre tank, adding 50 ml acetone does the job.
It is a PHYSICAL thing that takes place, exactly like dropping one drop of Fairy Liquid onto a basin full of water. The detergent reduces the surface tension of the water to a fraction of what it was, and that seems to be what the acetone does to diesel fuel. The result seems to be that on injection the tiny atomised droplets of fuel have much less surface tension holding them as little droplets, and so they break up and vapourise sooner and more thoroughly, giving a smoother cleaner more efficient burn cycle.

I am doing it. I like it so far!

CharlesY
 
grand job, now lets wait till yer maun has some results from his water/ hydrogen thing. as yer know am not a fan of snake oil but i think this old water fer gas thing might be worth a look see. if its bollocks then we'll all know from his results, if not we can thank him fer doing the test fer us
 
It's pure snake oil!
Just a simple water-spray and the other thing to disguise it.

It is possible to say how much hydrogen gas can be liberated from water due to a certain amount of electricity being passed through the electrolysis tank. In this case they claim 1 to 3 amps at 12 volts, that is, 12 to 36 watts. That is a INSIGNIFICANT amount of electrical energy, and while there will be a few bubbles apparent, it will make no measurable difference to the engine, though the water-spray aspect might make it feel smoother.

Even at 2,000 rpm, a typical 2.5 litre diesel Landy Engine needs to breathe in five litres of air PER REVOLUTION, or no less than 10,000 litres of air per MINUTE! And that's without the turbo.

Believe me - there is NO POSSIBLE WAY that the snake-oil jam jars and tubes can make hydrogen in any amount that would affect the engine in any measurable way.

However, I tipped 50 ml of acetone into my full tank of diesel today.

That does make a difference.
In due course I think Slob will report along the same lines.
Most if not all of the so-called fuel treatments are mostly based on kerosene, with acetone as the working ingredient.

CharlesY
 
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