Designa chassis

A

Andy.Smalley

Guest

• May 17, 2005

• #21

"beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:21bd616c4d%[email protected]...
> In message <[email protected]>
> "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> >
>> > As I read it - need to *retain* points, not gain them. So, for a leaf
>> > sprung Series motor, you can change the chassis to a coil sprung one,
>> > but changing the engine will put you one point over.
>> >
>> > And, yes, there are an awfult lot of "illegally registered" vehicles
>> > out there.........
>> >
>> > Richard
>>
>>
>> But if you change the chassis to a coil sprung one you would
>> also have to change the suspension and the axles so you would
>> only end up with 5 points
>
> The scores on the doors:
> ------------------------
> Chassis/Body Shell/Monocoque 5 Points
> Suspension 2 Points
> Axles 2 Points
> Transmission 2 Points
> Steering 2 Points
> Engine 1 Point
>
> The blurb:
> ----------
> "This covers vehicles which are substantially altered from their
> original specification, but which are not kit conversions".
>
> "In these cases the vehicle components used from the original
> vehicle will be given a numerical value and, in order to retain
> the original registration mark the vehicle must score eight or
> more points.
> If less than eight points are scored or a second-hand or modified
> chassis or altered monocoque bodyshell is used an ESVA/SVA/MSVA
> certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q'
> prefix registration number will be allocated."
>
> So, our hypothetical Series vehicle with a coil sprung chassis
> fitted will only retain 3 points even if fitted with the original
> engine and gearbox - 5 Points short!
>
> The chassis will be changed - no points retained
> The suspension will change (leaf to coil) - no points retained
> The axles will be changed - no points retained
> The steering will be changed - no points retained
>
> Whether modifying an existing axle to take coils would retain
> the points could be debated - but the quote above: "substantially
> altered from their original specification" would imply not.
>
> Richard
>


But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though

--
Andy

SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
It's big, it's mean it's really, really green

 

B

beamendsltd

Guest

• May 17, 2005

• #22

In message <[email protected]>
"Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:21bd616c4d%[email protected]...
> > In message <[email protected]>
> > "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> >
> >> > As I read it - need to *retain* points, not gain them. So, for a leaf
> >> > sprung Series motor, you can change the chassis to a coil sprung one,
> >> > but changing the engine will put you one point over.
> >> >
> >> > And, yes, there are an awfult lot of "illegally registered" vehicles
> >> > out there.........
> >> >
> >> > Richard
> >>
> >>
> >> But if you change the chassis to a coil sprung one you would
> >> also have to change the suspension and the axles so you would
> >> only end up with 5 points
> >
> > The scores on the doors:
> > ------------------------
> > Chassis/Body Shell/Monocoque 5 Points
> > Suspension 2 Points
> > Axles 2 Points
> > Transmission 2 Points
> > Steering 2 Points
> > Engine 1 Point
> >
> > The blurb:
> > ----------
> > "This covers vehicles which are substantially altered from their
> > original specification, but which are not kit conversions".
> >
> > "In these cases the vehicle components used from the original
> > vehicle will be given a numerical value and, in order to retain
> > the original registration mark the vehicle must score eight or
> > more points.
> > If less than eight points are scored or a second-hand or modified
> > chassis or altered monocoque bodyshell is used an ESVA/SVA/MSVA
> > certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q'
> > prefix registration number will be allocated."
> >
> > So, our hypothetical Series vehicle with a coil sprung chassis
> > fitted will only retain 3 points even if fitted with the original
> > engine and gearbox - 5 Points short!
> >
> > The chassis will be changed - no points retained
> > The suspension will change (leaf to coil) - no points retained
> > The axles will be changed - no points retained
> > The steering will be changed - no points retained
> >
> > Whether modifying an existing axle to take coils would retain
> > the points could be debated - but the quote above: "substantially
> > altered from their original specification" would imply not.
> >
> > Richard
> >
>
>
> But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
> the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
> hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
>

The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
"substantially altered from their original specification".

Richard

--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
Helping keep Land Rovers on and off the road to annoy the Lib Dems

 

A

Andy.Smalley

Guest

• May 17, 2005

• #23

>>
>> But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
>> the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
>> hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
>>
>
> The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
> on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
> have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
> If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
> it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
> depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
> "substantially altered from their original specification".
>
> Richard
>


you're right I was thinking of the steering set up on the axle
I forgot about the chassis mounted parts
--
Andy

SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
It's big, it's mean it's really, really green

 

R

Rich

Guest

• May 17, 2005

• #24

Why not go for using the Range Rover reg number / chassis number that way
you have got the points :-

You are using the chassis 5 points
also the axles 2 points
and suspension 2 points
the steering 2 points
engine possible to use a different one
transmition possible to use a different one

Total 11 points


Is this not right I think it is but please let me know as I am about to
start something similar.

You need to think " I am changing the body and not I am changing the chassis
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rich


--
To reply remove " spam "
"beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:d8f3676c4d%[email protected]...
> In message <[email protected]>
> "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >
> > "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:21bd616c4d%[email protected]...
> > > In message <[email protected]>
> > > "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > >> >
> > >> > As I read it - need to *retain* points, not gain them. So, for a
leaf
> > >> > sprung Series motor, you can change the chassis to a coil sprung
one,
> > >> > but changing the engine will put you one point over.
> > >> >
> > >> > And, yes, there are an awfult lot of "illegally registered"
vehicles
> > >> > out there.........
> > >> >
> > >> > Richard
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> But if you change the chassis to a coil sprung one you would
> > >> also have to change the suspension and the axles so you would
> > >> only end up with 5 points
> > >
> > > The scores on the doors:
> > > ------------------------
> > > Chassis/Body Shell/Monocoque 5 Points
> > > Suspension 2 Points
> > > Axles 2 Points
> > > Transmission 2 Points
> > > Steering 2 Points
> > > Engine 1 Point
> > >
> > > The blurb:
> > > ----------
> > > "This covers vehicles which are substantially altered from their
> > > original specification, but which are not kit conversions".
> > >
> > > "In these cases the vehicle components used from the original
> > > vehicle will be given a numerical value and, in order to retain
> > > the original registration mark the vehicle must score eight or
> > > more points.
> > > If less than eight points are scored or a second-hand or modified
> > > chassis or altered monocoque bodyshell is used an ESVA/SVA/MSVA
> > > certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q'
> > > prefix registration number will be allocated."
> > >
> > > So, our hypothetical Series vehicle with a coil sprung chassis
> > > fitted will only retain 3 points even if fitted with the original
> > > engine and gearbox - 5 Points short!
> > >
> > > The chassis will be changed - no points retained
> > > The suspension will change (leaf to coil) - no points retained
> > > The axles will be changed - no points retained
> > > The steering will be changed - no points retained
> > >
> > > Whether modifying an existing axle to take coils would retain
> > > the points could be debated - but the quote above: "substantially
> > > altered from their original specification" would imply not.
> > >
> > > Richard
> > >
> >
> >
> > But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
> > the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
> > hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
> >
>
> The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
> on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
> have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
> If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
> it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
> depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
> "substantially altered from their original specification".
>
> Richard
>
> --
> www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
> Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
> Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
> Helping keep Land Rovers on and off the road to annoy the Lib Dems

 

B

beamendsltd

Guest

• May 18, 2005

• #25

In message <[email protected]>
"Rich" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Why not go for using the Range Rover reg number / chassis number that way
> you have got the points :-
>
> You are using the chassis 5 points
> also the axles 2 points
> and suspension 2 points
> the steering 2 points
> engine possible to use a different one
> transmition possible to use a different one
>
> Total 11 points
>
>
> Is this not right I think it is but please let me know as I am about to
> start something similar.
>
> You need to think " I am changing the body and not I am changing the chassis
> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> Rich
>
>
> --

You're absolutely right - but the main reason for people doing
it the other way round is to get a tax free coil sprung motor.

Richard

> To reply remove " spam "
> "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:d8f3676c4d%[email protected]...
> > In message <[email protected]>
> > "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:21bd616c4d%[email protected]...
> > > > In message <[email protected]>
> > > > "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > As I read it - need to *retain* points, not gain them. So, for a
> leaf
> > > >> > sprung Series motor, you can change the chassis to a coil sprung
> one,
> > > >> > but changing the engine will put you one point over.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > And, yes, there are an awfult lot of "illegally registered"
> vehicles
> > > >> > out there.........
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Richard
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> But if you change the chassis to a coil sprung one you would
> > > >> also have to change the suspension and the axles so you would
> > > >> only end up with 5 points
> > > >
> > > > The scores on the doors:
> > > > ------------------------
> > > > Chassis/Body Shell/Monocoque 5 Points
> > > > Suspension 2 Points
> > > > Axles 2 Points
> > > > Transmission 2 Points
> > > > Steering 2 Points
> > > > Engine 1 Point
> > > >
> > > > The blurb:
> > > > ----------
> > > > "This covers vehicles which are substantially altered from their
> > > > original specification, but which are not kit conversions".
> > > >
> > > > "In these cases the vehicle components used from the original
> > > > vehicle will be given a numerical value and, in order to retain
> > > > the original registration mark the vehicle must score eight or
> > > > more points.
> > > > If less than eight points are scored or a second-hand or modified
> > > > chassis or altered monocoque bodyshell is used an ESVA/SVA/MSVA
> > > > certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q'
> > > > prefix registration number will be allocated."
> > > >
> > > > So, our hypothetical Series vehicle with a coil sprung chassis
> > > > fitted will only retain 3 points even if fitted with the original
> > > > engine and gearbox - 5 Points short!
> > > >
> > > > The chassis will be changed - no points retained
> > > > The suspension will change (leaf to coil) - no points retained
> > > > The axles will be changed - no points retained
> > > > The steering will be changed - no points retained
> > > >
> > > > Whether modifying an existing axle to take coils would retain
> > > > the points could be debated - but the quote above: "substantially
> > > > altered from their original specification" would imply not.
> > > >
> > > > Richard
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
> > > the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
> > > hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
> > >
> >
> > The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
> > on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
> > have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
> > If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
> > it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
> > depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
> > "substantially altered from their original specification".
> >
> > Richard
> >
> > --
> > www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
> > Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
> > Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
> > Helping keep Land Rovers on and off the road to annoy the Lib Dems
>
>

--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
Helping keep Land Rovers on and off the road to annoy the Lib Dems

 

T

Tom Woods

Guest

• May 18, 2005

• #26

On Tue, 17 May 2005 08:46:08 +0000 (UTC), beamendsltd
<[email protected]> wrote:

>> But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
>> the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
>> hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
>>
>
>The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
>on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
>have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
>If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
>it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
>depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
>"substantially altered from their original specification".

Hmm. The coil sprung 88 i know uses a series steering box and all the
series linkages down to (and including) the drop arm that comes out of
the relay in the front chassis x-member.
At this point it uses a custom made linkage that goes down to the
axle. The original series one wasnt quite long enough (it would fit
but made getting the wheels pointing and moving right kinda hard!).

It attaches to standard RR axles (as far as i know).

You could say that the axle changes would come under the 'axle' points
on the DVLA list.

The actual steering bits inside the vehicle (the box, both drop arms
and a couple of linkages) are the original series bits. You could
claim that this meant that you had not changed the steering.

The only bit that is somewhat in the middle is the lengthened linkage
between the 2.

 

R

Rich

Guest

• May 18, 2005

• #27

Why not go for using the Range Rover reg number / chassis number that way
you have got the points :-

You are using the chassis 5 points
also the axles 2 points
and suspension 2 points
the steering 2 points
engine possible to use a different one
transmition possible to use a different one

Total 11 points


Is this not right I think it is but please let me know as I am about to
start something similar.

You need to think " I am changing the body and not I am changing the
chassis"

Rich

"beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:d8f3676c4d%[email protected]...
> In message <[email protected]>
> "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >
> > "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:21bd616c4d%[email protected]...
> > > In message <[email protected]>
> > > "Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > >> >
> > >> > As I read it - need to *retain* points, not gain them. So, for a
leaf
> > >> > sprung Series motor, you can change the chassis to a coil sprung
one,
> > >> > but changing the engine will put you one point over.
> > >> >
> > >> > And, yes, there are an awfult lot of "illegally registered"
vehicles
> > >> > out there.........
> > >> >
> > >> > Richard
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> But if you change the chassis to a coil sprung one you would
> > >> also have to change the suspension and the axles so you would
> > >> only end up with 5 points
> > >
> > > The scores on the doors:
> > > ------------------------
> > > Chassis/Body Shell/Monocoque 5 Points
> > > Suspension 2 Points
> > > Axles 2 Points
> > > Transmission 2 Points
> > > Steering 2 Points
> > > Engine 1 Point
> > >
> > > The blurb:
> > > ----------
> > > "This covers vehicles which are substantially altered from their
> > > original specification, but which are not kit conversions".
> > >
> > > "In these cases the vehicle components used from the original
> > > vehicle will be given a numerical value and, in order to retain
> > > the original registration mark the vehicle must score eight or
> > > more points.
> > > If less than eight points are scored or a second-hand or modified
> > > chassis or altered monocoque bodyshell is used an ESVA/SVA/MSVA
> > > certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q'
> > > prefix registration number will be allocated."
> > >
> > > So, our hypothetical Series vehicle with a coil sprung chassis
> > > fitted will only retain 3 points even if fitted with the original
> > > engine and gearbox - 5 Points short!
> > >
> > > The chassis will be changed - no points retained
> > > The suspension will change (leaf to coil) - no points retained
> > > The axles will be changed - no points retained
> > > The steering will be changed - no points retained
> > >
> > > Whether modifying an existing axle to take coils would retain
> > > the points could be debated - but the quote above: "substantially
> > > altered from their original specification" would imply not.
> > >
> > > Richard
> > >
> >
> >
> > But why would the steering be changed ? you would only be modifying
> > the axle to accommodate the springs and possibly shockers
> > hence my guess at 5 point still not enough either way though
> >
>
> The Steering would be changed since it is completely different
> on leaf and coil vehicles. To fit the original system it would
> have to be heavily modified and therefore no longer standard.
> If you had a new chassis made with provision for the new steering
> it would not be a relacement - a sublte difference, but government
> depts. are not noted for subtltey..... again, the key phrase is
> "substantially altered from their original specification".
>
> Richard
>
> --
> www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
> Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
> Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
> Helping keep Land Rovers on and off the road to annoy the Lib Dems

 

A

Andy.Smalley

Guest

• May 18, 2005

• #28

"beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:bc23e66c4d%[email protected]...
> In message <[email protected]>
> "Rich" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Why not go for using the Range Rover reg number / chassis number that way
>> you have got the points :-
>>
>> You are using the chassis 5 points
>> also the axles 2 points
>> and suspension 2 points
>> the steering 2 points
>> engine possible to use a different one
>> transmition possible to use a different one
>>
>> Total 11 points
>>
>>
>> Is this not right I think it is but please let me know as I am about to
>> start something similar.
>>
>> You need to think " I am changing the body and not I am changing the chassis
>> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>
>> Rich
>>
>>
>> --
>
> You're absolutely right - but the main reason for people doing
> it the other way round is to get a tax free coil sprung motor.
>
> Richard
>


I have a guy come in for MOT with a 1963 series2
V8, 5 speed g/box,coil sprung, disc brakes all round, defender front end
and Series 3 dash and still claims to be tax exempt

--
Andy

SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
It's big, it's mean it's really, really green

 

R

Rich

Guest

• May 18, 2005

• #29

What you need is what I have got last Christmas and that is a 1972 Range
Rover so I can do that and keep the reg doc

Rich

--
To reply remove " spam "
"Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "beamendsltd" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:bc23e66c4d%[email protected]...
> > In message <[email protected]>
> > "Rich" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> Why not go for using the Range Rover reg number / chassis number that
way
> >> you have got the points :-
> >>
> >> You are using the chassis 5 points
> >> also the axles 2 points
> >> and suspension 2 points
> >> the steering 2 points
> >> engine possible to use a different one
> >> transmition possible to use a different one
> >>
> >> Total 11 points
> >>
> >>
> >> Is this not right I think it is but please let me know as I am about to
> >> start something similar.
> >>
> >> You need to think " I am changing the body and not I am changing the
chassis
> >> !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> >>
> >> Rich
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >
> > You're absolutely right - but the main reason for people doing
> > it the other way round is to get a tax free coil sprung motor.
> >
> > Richard
> >
>
>
> I have a guy come in for MOT with a 1963 series2
> V8, 5 speed g/box,coil sprung, disc brakes all round, defender front end
> and Series 3 dash and still claims to be tax exempt
>
> --
> Andy
>
> SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
> It's big, it's mean it's really, really green
>
>