Bugger, head gasket blown ...

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P

Paul - xxx

Guest
Disco 300 Tdi, Ah well, towing the caravan we've had two instances in the
last week or so when the engine temp gauge has moved above horizontal, but
immediately dropped down to normal when slowing down or cresting the hill,
so with the hot weather we didn't think much of it and there are no external
signs of impending doom anywhere. This time it just kept going hotter and
hotter, very quickly, so pulled onto hard shoulder with coolant ****ing out
of system. Seems like it's pressurised the cooling system and just blown
all the coolant back out through the expansion tank vents.

Just when we need it for the next four weekends and when I can't fix it
myself so it has to go into the garage later today ... I'd guess expensive
.... :(

Isn't it typical, I can change things like the bumpers and bloody tyres no
worries, but when it's something major I have no time, so it'll cost lots,
Murphys law I guess.

I is not a happy man at the mo'.

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!



 
On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 07:38:15 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>
>Just when we need it for the next four weekends and when I can't fix it
>myself so it has to go into the garage later today ... I'd guess expensive
>... :(
>

There must be a plague of it going around.

I'm wondering whether or not to get shot of our one, and buy a V8... There
are a couple of nice ones on fleabay at the moment...

mind, it'll cost a bit to make the swap - a 300 TDi even in good nick with a
blown head gasket is not gonna fetch big bucks. It has got a near-new
exhaust though...

however, that engine has had the head replaced not that long ago. only way
I'll trust it now is a full rebuild, 'cos I'd want the block out and checked
properly. The price of a new engine is such that I doubt it's worth it,
although that would be one way.

It was said when I got the head for it that if the head's been cooked it's a
waste of time doing anything with it - summat to do with it being heat
treated and cooking it spoiling the heat treatment. Anyone know if this is
true?


So... any of you lot selling a nice V8 disco, 7-seat?

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"Festina Lente" (Hasten slowly) Suetonius (c.70-c.140) Augustus, 25
 
Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 07:38:15 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>
>> Just when we need it for the next four weekends and when I can't fix it
>> myself so it has to go into the garage later today ... I'd guess
>> expensive ... :(
>>
>
> There must be a plague of it going around.
>
> I'm wondering whether or not to get shot of our one, and buy a V8... There
> are a couple of nice ones on fleabay at the moment...

We currently can't afford that option ... This weekend I'm supposed to tow
the caravan to Stotfold, the weekend after to Skegness, the weekend after
Holbeach, the weekend after Telford and a fortniught later to Tiverton.
Swapping vehicles in between is bound to be fraught with problems, so I
think we're just going to stump up the cash somehow.

A V8 Disco is on the list when i get a tuit though ... ;)

> however, that engine has had the head replaced not that long ago. only
> way I'll trust it now is a full rebuild, 'cos I'd want the block out and
> checked properly. The price of a new engine is such that I doubt it's
> worth it, although that would be one way.

I'm hoping I caught ours quickly enough, I saw the gauge rising, thought
it'd drop and when it didn't pulled over. Unfortunately the 'Safety
Patrols' gave us a bucket of water and suggested we try to make it off the
motorway (M18/M62 junction) only for it to pop within a few hundred yards.

> It was said when I got the head for it that if the head's been cooked
> it's a waste of time doing anything with it - summat to do with it being
> heat treated and cooking it spoiling the heat treatment. Anyone know if
> this is true?

I've heard that one before but am a little unsure as to what heat treatment
a head undergoes, unless they mean the head has been warped.

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!



 
On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:53:36 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>I've heard that one before but am a little unsure as to what heat treatment
>a head undergoes, unless they mean the head has been warped.

I think the point is supposed to be that it's heat treated once it's
machined. Some alloys (e.g. 6061) harden when heat treated thusly. This is
all credible stuff. what I don't know is whether overheating the engine
gets it hot enough to bugger the heat treatment and if so how long or how
hot it has to have got.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Confidence: Before important work meetings, boost your confidence by
reading a few pages from "The Tibetan Book of the Dead"
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 
Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:53:36 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>> I've heard that one before but am a little unsure as to what heat
>> treatment a head undergoes, unless they mean the head has been warped.
>
> I think the point is supposed to be that it's heat treated once it's
> machined. Some alloys (e.g. 6061) harden when heat treated thusly. This
> is all credible stuff. what I don't know is whether overheating the
> engine gets it hot enough to bugger the heat treatment and if so how long
> or how hot it has to have got.

I understand now, but still don't have an answer ...

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!



 
On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 11:26:25 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
>> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:53:36 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
>> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>
>>> I've heard that one before but am a little unsure as to what heat
>>> treatment a head undergoes, unless they mean the head has been warped.
>>
>> I think the point is supposed to be that it's heat treated once it's
>> machined. Some alloys (e.g. 6061) harden when heat treated thusly. This
>> is all credible stuff. what I don't know is whether overheating the
>> engine gets it hot enough to bugger the heat treatment and if so how long
>> or how hot it has to have got.
>
>I understand now, but still don't have an answer ...

me neither. we need an insider who worked on TDi production...
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Appearances: You don't really need make-up. Celebrate your authentic
face by frightening people in the street.
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 

>> I think the point is supposed to be that it's heat treated once it's
>> machined. Some alloys (e.g. 6061) harden when heat treated thusly. This
>> is all credible stuff. what I don't know is whether overheating the
>> engine gets it hot enough to bugger the heat treatment and if so how long
>> or how hot it has to have got.
>
> I understand now, but still don't have an answer ...
>
> --
> Paul ...
> (8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!


I had a blown head gasket done by Ritters here in Melbourne and on the
invoice was "Hardness test,Pressure test, Surface.

Not sure what it all means but the engine has not given any trouble in over
a year. (touch wood).

The bill was $2600 Aussie (1040 sterling) but included new timing belt Rad
flush lap in valve seats ect,ect.

Expensive? But I have peace of mind knowing the job was done quickly and
very professionaly even got a loan car.


Simon Mills
98 Disco Auto.


 
In message <[email protected]>
Austin Shackles <[email protected]> wrote:

> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 11:26:25 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
> >Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> >> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:53:36 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> >> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >>
> >>> I've heard that one before but am a little unsure as to what heat
> >>> treatment a head undergoes, unless they mean the head has been warped.
> >>
> >> I think the point is supposed to be that it's heat treated once it's
> >> machined. Some alloys (e.g. 6061) harden when heat treated thusly. This
> >> is all credible stuff. what I don't know is whether overheating the
> >> engine gets it hot enough to bugger the heat treatment and if so how long
> >> or how hot it has to have got.
> >
> >I understand now, but still don't have an answer ...
>
> me neither. we need an insider who worked on TDi production...

I can't say we've had any special problems with 300Tdi heads per se,
but we have had to deal with results of the "that'll do" torquing
method, rather than doing it properly, and running a 300Tdi
for even a short period with no water doing very interesting things
to the pistons. Other than that, a skim and a new gasket has done
the job ok.

Richard
--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
RISC-OS - Where have all the good guys gone?
Lib Dems - Townies keeping comedy alive
 
On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 13:01:17 +0100, beamendsltd
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>In message <[email protected]>
> Austin Shackles <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> me neither. we need an insider who worked on TDi production...
>
>I can't say we've had any special problems with 300Tdi heads per se,
>but we have had to deal with results of the "that'll do" torquing
>method, rather than doing it properly, and running a 300Tdi
>for even a short period with no water doing very interesting things
>to the pistons. Other than that, a skim and a new gasket has done
>the job ok.

This one had a new head and was torqued per the book. This leads me to
suspect the whole engine, frankly.

I'm strongly inclined to bung a new gasket in, with a head skim if needed,
and flog it. The vehicle doesn't merit a new engine or a really serious
engine rebuild.

which raises a point though: I've been looking on eBay and there are one or
two very nice looking 200-series V8 discos. The point here is that I've
just bought (but not yet fitted) a whole new set of brakes to put on this
300 TDi.

can I fit the vented discs and calipers for a 300 TDi to a "200" front axle,
and will the later rear calipers fit on an early axle?

I suppose, in fact, there's nothing to stop me buying a "200" and swapping
the axles from the 300 onto it, but it's more work.

Mind, there are a couple of rather nice 300 series V8s, too.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms...
------------------------------------------------\
>> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them.
a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too!
 
Austin Shackles wrote:
> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 13:01:17 +0100, beamendsltd

>
> This one had a new head and was torqued per the book. This leads me to
> suspect the whole engine, frankly.
>
> I'm strongly inclined to bung a new gasket in, with a head skim if needed,
> and flog it. The vehicle doesn't merit a new engine or a really serious
> engine rebuild.
>
> which raises a point though: I've been looking on eBay and there are one or
> two very nice looking 200-series V8 discos. The point here is that I've
> just bought (but not yet fitted) a whole new set of brakes to put on this
> 300 TDi.
>
> can I fit the vented discs and calipers for a 300 TDi to a "200" front axle,
> and will the later rear calipers fit on an early axle?
>
> I suppose, in fact, there's nothing to stop me buying a "200" and swapping
> the axles from the 300 onto it, but it's more work.
>
> Mind, there are a couple of rather nice 300 series V8s, too.

Bite the bullet, fit a Powerstroke 2.8, and keep it for the long term.

On a similar note I'm toying with the idea of dropping a Toyota 1KZ-TE
engine into a rather dead V8 Disco that has appeared on my lawn (SWMBO
permitting of course). Power and torque are a little up on the 300tdi
so it should work out quite well. All the electronic controls for the
injector pump were giving me indigestion but I've managed to acquire a
manual pump to suit which should simplify things a bit.


--
EMB
 
On or around Tue, 01 Aug 2006 11:59:47 +1200, EMB <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>Austin Shackles wrote:
>> On or around Mon, 31 Jul 2006 13:01:17 +0100, beamendsltd
>
>>
>
>Bite the bullet, fit a Powerstroke 2.8, and keep it for the long term.

Yeah, but that's more than we want to spend. This has thrown something of a
spanner into the works - the plan was to do this one up and make it tidy
mechanically, and so forth, and do up the body and put new rubber mats in
and new steps and suchlike. That was when I though the engine was sound :-(

I'm definitely thinking V8s though. V8 on LPG, then replace the gasket on
this one, with a head-skim if needed, and flog it. The parts already got
for this one will fit a replacement vehicle, if the replacement is properly
chosen.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms...
------------------------------------------------\
>> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them.
a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too!
 
Austin Shackles <[email protected]> uttered summat worrerz
funny about:
> Yeah, but that's more than we want to spend. This has thrown
> something of a spanner into the works - the plan was to do this one
> up and make it tidy mechanically, and so forth, and do up the body
> and put new rubber mats in and new steps and suchlike. That was when
> I though the engine was sound :-(
>
> I'm definitely thinking V8s though. V8 on LPG, then replace the
> gasket on this one, with a head-skim if needed, and flog it. The
> parts already got for this one will fit a replacement vehicle, if the
> replacement is properly chosen.

Chill dude! ;-) Could be just one of those things, had it on my VM twice
(18000 miles), didn't make it a bad motor. The second time I rebuilt the
engine a little more with new Pistons, big ends, Turbo recon ect etc.

If it happended again then dump it but you could get another 50,000 miles
out of it once done again.. other than time it'll probably cost less than
fetching an unknown flee-bay item in fuel.

Lee D


 
On or around Tue, 1 Aug 2006 11:29:37 +0100, "Lee_D"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Austin Shackles <[email protected]> uttered summat worrerz
>funny about:
>> Yeah, but that's more than we want to spend. This has thrown
>> something of a spanner into the works - the plan was to do this one
>> up and make it tidy mechanically, and so forth, and do up the body
>> and put new rubber mats in and new steps and suchlike. That was when
>> I though the engine was sound :-(
>>
>> I'm definitely thinking V8s though. V8 on LPG, then replace the
>> gasket on this one, with a head-skim if needed, and flog it. The
>> parts already got for this one will fit a replacement vehicle, if the
>> replacement is properly chosen.
>
>Chill dude! ;-) Could be just one of those things, had it on my VM twice
>(18000 miles), didn't make it a bad motor. The second time I rebuilt the
>engine a little more with new Pistons, big ends, Turbo recon ect etc.

Yeah, but for the cost of doing a full rebuild we can switch to a V8 on
LPG... counting the value of the existing 300 once I replace the head gasket
and get it running tidy again.




>
>If it happended again then dump it but you could get another 50,000 miles
>out of it once done again.. other than time it'll probably cost less than
>fetching an unknown flee-bay item in fuel.
>
>Lee D
>
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Satisfying: Satisfy your inner child by eating ten tubes of Smarties
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.
 
Austin Shackles wrote:

> Yeah, but for the cost of doing a full rebuild we can switch to a V8 on
> LPG... counting the value of the existing 300 once I replace the head gasket
> and get it running tidy again.

I have a mint 200Tdi that I bought last year,
Any use ? Its just sitting here waiting for fuel prices to rise at the
moment.

Steve
 
On or around Tue, 01 Aug 2006 13:41:18 +0100, Steve Taylor
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Austin Shackles wrote:
>
>> Yeah, but for the cost of doing a full rebuild we can switch to a V8 on
>> LPG... counting the value of the existing 300 once I replace the head gasket
>> and get it running tidy again.
>
>I have a mint 200Tdi that I bought last year,
>Any use ? Its just sitting here waiting for fuel prices to rise at the
>moment.

I thought you were putting that in the 101? or do you mean a complete
disco?

TBH, I fancy having a V8 again. Lot more fun...

if it's a complete car, then how much?
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"Ask yourself whether you are happy, and you cease to be so."
John Stuart Mill (1806 - 1873)
 
Austin Shackles wrote:

> I thought you were putting that in the 101? or do you mean a complete
> disco?

No, I've got two, the rebuild from the Corpse, and one I picked up for
silly money just before Christmas, a rainy day engine. Like I said, that
one can be had for a few quid and swapsies.

Steve
 
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