Advice on buying and owning Series II (Tax Exempt) Land Rover

Hi,
I am considering buying a Series II Landrover. It has been a wish of
mine for some time, and I am now in a position to start looking for one. I
have seen a petrol one for sale. It looks in good condition, and has had
quite a bit of work done to her. I would like to use her for day to day use,
and as such would appreciate anyone giving me some advice on such matters.
Can she be used for daily commute (50 mile round trip). Also as she is
petrol - is it possible to convert her to LPG without spoiling her in any
way? Or would I be better off looking for a diesel engine? If it is possible
to convert to LPG - is it a costly alteration or one that most garages can
do. If it is not possible to convert her - what MPG should I expect. Also I
would appreciate any advice on what to ask/look for when going to see her.
Basically any advice anyone could give me. Thanks in advance for anyone's
advice - I was an owner of a Defender 90 for years but ignorant in all
matters Series II.

Cymro Gwirion wrote:

> Hi,
> I am considering buying a Series II Landrover. It has been a wish of
> mine for some time, and I am now in a position to start looking for one. I
> have seen a petrol one for sale. It looks in good condition, and has had
> quite a bit of work done to her. I would like to use her for day to day
> use, and as such would appreciate anyone giving me some advice on such
> matters. Can she be used for daily commute (50 mile round trip). Also as
> she is
> petrol - is it possible to convert her to LPG without spoiling her in any
> way? Or would I be better off looking for a diesel engine? If it is
> possible to convert to LPG - is it a costly alteration or one that most
> garages can do. If it is not possible to convert her - what MPG should I
> expect. Also I would appreciate any advice on what to ask/look for when
> going to see her. Basically any advice anyone could give me. Thanks in
> advance for anyone's advice - I was an owner of a Defender 90 for years
> but ignorant in all matters Series II.

Series 2/2a can be converted to LPG, but this is fairly expensive for any
car. There is nothing special about the conversion compared to other cars.
The diesel is less compatible with modern traffic, due to low power.

There is no reason why you can't commute in a 2/2a in good condition,
especially if it is a short wheelbase, which I assume you are talking
about. The only likely problem is that they only have synchromesh on 3&4,
but double declutching is easy to learn (I learned it when I was twelve).

A series 2/2a is at least 35 years old (could be nearly fifty), and you need
to make sure that it IS in good condition - there are a lot of dogs about.
Biggest 'gotcha' is likely to be chassis and bulkhead rust, but in any
case, even if you can't find any problems before buying it, make sure you
allow funds for the problems you find after you buy it. Fortunately
virtually all parts are readily available and cheap, and if at all
mechanically minded, you can do most work yourself. But even so, if it is
in bad shape it will still cost a fortune to rebuild, and you can't sell it
for anything like what it will cost (so buy someone else's money pit after
they have spent most of the money needed - which sounds a bit like what you
are looking at)
JD

P.S. If you are not aware - Series 2 1958-61, Series 2a to 71, the
significant change was the diesel going from 2 to 2.25, but there are much
larger changes during 2a production than the change 2 to 2a. Later models
(chassis suffix G on are generally preferred for a variety of reasons, but
in my view any 2/2a is preferable to a 3)

On or around Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:49:59 +0100, Cymro Gwirion
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Hi,
> I am considering buying a Series II Landrover. It has been a wish of
>mine for some time, and I am now in a position to start looking for one. I
>have seen a petrol one for sale. It looks in good condition, and has had
>quite a bit of work done to her. I would like to use her for day to day use,
>and as such would appreciate anyone giving me some advice on such matters.
>Can she be used for daily commute (50 mile round trip).

yes.

>Also as she is
>petrol - is it possible to convert her to LPG without spoiling her in any
>way? Or would I be better off looking for a diesel engine? If it is possible
>to convert to LPG - is it a costly alteration or one that most garages can
>do.

yes but on a SWB you'll have to have the tank inside the back. On LWBs it's
possible to get them underneath, I think. You can get a DIY kit to install
if you're mechanically competent to do so. One such from
http://www.chrisperfect.com/.

>If it is not possible to convert her - what MPG should I expect.

Driven tidily, up to 20 mpg for a good 2¼ petrol. You can improve it
slightly by fitting overdrive and free-wheeling front hubs, but there are
caveats attached to the latter - using them disengaged long-term will starve
the upper swivel bearing of oil. This is not a reason not to have them, but
you need to run some of the time with the hubs locked, so as to splash the
oil around a bit.

>Also I
>would appreciate any advice on what to ask/look for when going to see her.

whereabouts are you?

>Basically any advice anyone could give me. Thanks in advance for anyone's
>advice - I was an owner of a Defender 90 for years but ignorant in all
>matters Series II.

Chassis and Bulkhead, as has been said. Personally, I'd not have a 2¼
diesel, they're very slow and noisy. The 2¼ petrol engine is a good lump
and lasts for ages, even with limited maintenance - it does prefer 20W50 oil
though so don't put thin modern stuff in it.

all the mechanical stuff is not too bad to fix. check for stupid amounts of
smoke from the engine, any knocking is bad, the transmission is noisy on all
of them by modern standards but rattles and clonks are not good. Brakes
should be good but need a firm right boot. You're talking about non-servo
drum brakes, after all. The standard brakes on my SIII LWB are nonservo
drums and provided you put in the effort to maintain them are pretty good.

On the chassis: rear crossmember, outriggers and front spring mount under
the bumper are points to study closely. Main frame tubes are usually OK, if
they're not then you're talking *much* less money - complete chassis are
available as replacements but it's a labour of love to swap everything over
and you need one that's mechanically sound to even think about it.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"The breezy call of incense-breathing Morn, The swallow twittering
from the strawbuilt shed, The cock's shrill clarion, or the echoing
horn, No more shall rouse them from their lowly bed."
Thomas Gray, Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard.

On Fri, 11 Aug 2006 17:49:59 +0100, Cymro Gwirion
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Hi,
> I am considering buying a Series II Landrover. It has been a wish of
>mine for some time, and I am now in a position to start looking for one. I
>have seen a petrol one for sale. It looks in good condition, and has had
>quite a bit of work done to her. I would like to use her for day to day use,
>and as such would appreciate anyone giving me some advice on such matters.
>Can she be used for daily commute (50 mile round trip). Also as she is
>petrol - is it possible to convert her to LPG without spoiling her in any
>way? Or would I be better off looking for a diesel engine? If it is possible
>to convert to LPG - is it a costly alteration or one that most garages can
>do. If it is not possible to convert her - what MPG should I expect. Also I
>would appreciate any advice on what to ask/look for when going to see her.
>Basically any advice anyone could give me. Thanks in advance for anyone's
>advice - I was an owner of a Defender 90 for years but ignorant in all
>matters Series II.

I drive a 1965 IIa SWB as daily transport, and whilst I like it, I
cannot honestly reccomend it. It will be much like commuting in your
90, only slower, noiser and damper (in the rain) However, a
well-maintained one will quite happily do the commute you require, but
don't expect fuel consumption to be any better than 20mpg on petrol.
Probably nearer 17 on town work. Original SII/IIa diesels you will
find a bit of a trial on a daily commute, they're noiser, harsher and
slower. A LPG conversion will cost you, perhaps not the most reliable
of engines to convert, either. If you want to save money on fuel you'd
be better off looking for a Series II that has had a 2.5D or 2.5TD
engine in it.

Alex

On or around Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:34:00 +0100, Alex
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>A LPG conversion will cost you, perhaps not the most reliable
>of engines to convert, either.

the 2¼ petrol is not bad on gas. If thrashed I think you can get valve seat
problems but the usual advice is to suck it and see. The main problem is
low compression which limits the power - fitting a modified head to get more
compression would improve things.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"The great masses of the people ... will more easily fall victims to
a great lie than to a small one" Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
from Mein Kampf, Ch 10

On Sat, 12 Aug 2006 23:33:58 +0100, Austin Shackles
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On or around Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:34:00 +0100, Alex
><[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>>A LPG conversion will cost you, perhaps not the most reliable
>>of engines to convert, either.
>
>the 2¼ petrol is not bad on gas. If thrashed I think you can get valve seat
>problems but the usual advice is to suck it and see. The main problem is
>low compression which limits the power - fitting a modified head to get more
>compression would improve things.

Mm, but if you factor in the cost of a 9:1 flowed head, it becomes an
expensive way of saving fuel.

Alex

"Alex" <[email protected]> wrote in message :-

If you want to save money on fuel you'd
> be better off looking for a Series II that has had a 2.5D or 2.5TD
> engine in it.
>
> Alex

Those engines are nothing but trouble, you would be better off using the
older 5 bearing 2 1/4 diesel or stick with the petrol for short journey
commuting.

Martin

On or around Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:08:24 +0100, Alex
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>On Sat, 12 Aug 2006 23:33:58 +0100, Austin Shackles
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>On or around Sat, 12 Aug 2006 22:34:00 +0100, Alex
>><[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>
>>>A LPG conversion will cost you, perhaps not the most reliable
>>>of engines to convert, either.
>>
>>the 2¼ petrol is not bad on gas. If thrashed I think you can get valve seat
>>problems but the usual advice is to suck it and see. The main problem is
>>low compression which limits the power - fitting a modified head to get more
>>compression would improve things.
>
>Mm, but if you factor in the cost of a 9:1 flowed head, it becomes an
>expensive way of saving fuel.

but you get a fun series, especially if it's a soft top SWB.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
If all be true that I do think, There are five reasons we should drink;
Good wine, a friend, or being dry, Or lest we should be by and by;
Or any other reason why. - Henry Aldrich (1647 - 1710)

On or around Sun, 13 Aug 2006 11:52:36 +0100, "Oily"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>
>"Alex" <[email protected]> wrote in message :-
>
> If you want to save money on fuel you'd
>> be better off looking for a Series II that has had a 2.5D or 2.5TD
>> engine in it.
>>
>> Alex
>
>Those engines are nothing but trouble, you would be better off using the
>older 5 bearing 2 1/4 diesel or stick with the petrol for short journey
>commuting.

I'd agree about the 2.5 turbo. the 2.5 nonturbo isn't so bad, but it's also
not much more powerful than the 2¼. There are better engines out there...
if looking for an engine top put in a SWB series I'd rate the transit TDi.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Soon shall thy arm, unconquered steam! afar Drag the slow barge, or
drive the rapid car; Or on wide-waving wings expanded bear the
flying chariot through the field of air.- Erasmus Darwin (1731-1802)

> >
> > If you want to save money on fuel you'd
> >> be better off looking for a Series II that has had a 2.5D or 2.5TD
> >> engine in it.
> >>
> >> Alex
> >
> >Those engines are nothing but trouble, you would be better off using the
> >older 5 bearing 2 1/4 diesel or stick with the petrol for short journey
> >commuting.
>
> I'd agree about the 2.5 turbo. the 2.5 nonturbo isn't so bad, but it's
also
> not much more powerful than the 2¼. There are better engines out there...
> if looking for an engine top put in a SWB series I'd rate the transit TDi.
>

Sorry Austin, I have to disagree there. The 2.5 NA is the *worst* of the
two, the pistons are so much weaker than the TurboD and break up quite
easily if they are thrashed, the only engine I would consider to upgrade a
Series motor would be Landrovers own 200 Tdi, twice as much power and half
as many more miles to the gallon. I wouldn't consider the Transit Tdi, too
noisy and you can get them down to 12 mpg if using them hard. And you need
to make a conversion plate and all the other bits.

Martin.

Martin

On Sun, 13 Aug 2006 20:25:55 +0100, Austin Shackles
<[email protected]> wrote:

>>>
>>>>A LPG conversion will cost you, perhaps not the most reliable
>>>>of engines to convert, either.
>>>
>>>the 2¼ petrol is not bad on gas. If thrashed I think you can get valve seat
>>>problems but the usual advice is to suck it and see. The main problem is
>>>low compression which limits the power - fitting a modified head to get more
>>>compression would improve things.
>>
>>Mm, but if you factor in the cost of a 9:1 flowed head, it becomes an
>>expensive way of saving fuel.
>
>but you get a fun series, especially if it's a soft top SWB.

Don't remind me. My IIa swb needs a new head and i can't afford a
normal one, let alone the 9:1 Lead-free one i'd like to fit.

Alex

On or around Sun, 13 Aug 2006 22:36:13 +0100, "Oily"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>
>Sorry Austin, I have to disagree there. The 2.5 NA is the *worst* of the
>two, the pistons are so much weaker than the TurboD and break up quite
>easily if they are thrashed, the only engine I would consider to upgrade a
>Series motor would be Landrovers own 200 Tdi, twice as much power and half
>as many more miles to the gallon. I wouldn't consider the Transit Tdi, too
>noisy and you can get them down to 12 mpg if using them hard. And you need
>to make a conversion plate and all the other bits.

you can get the conversion, I think. or used to be able to. The transit
TDi I have in a transit does about 31 mpg in normal use, although it drinks
diesel if you really floor it. good long-lived engine though. and I reckon
pretty much any engine will drink diesel if really thrashed, or towing heavy
loads or something. I once got well under 25 mpg from a 300 TDi disco by
nailing it up the motorway at about 90 - about 450 miles from a tank whereas
it more commonly does nearer 600.


--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Beyond the horizon of the place we lived when we were young / In a world
of magnets and miracles / Our thoughts strayed constantly and without
boundary / The ringing of the Division bell had begun. Pink Floyd (1994)

"Austin Shackles" <[email protected]> wrote in message

>
> you can get the conversion, I think. or used to be able to. The transit
> TDi I have in a transit does about 31 mpg in normal use, although it
drinks
> diesel if you really floor it. good long-lived engine though. and I
reckon
> pretty much any engine will drink diesel if really thrashed, or towing
heavy
> loads or something.

I wasn't knocking the Transit engine and I agree with all of that, it's a
bulletproof engine but a bit noisy for me.

Can't see why they didn't put the 200 Tdi in the 400 Series Sherpa though
instead of the Transit engine, it's like admitting they can't build a decent
engine of their own.

Martin