300 Tdi Disco Tachometer

P

Paul - xxx

Guest

• May 5, 2006

• #1

Hi all,

'96/'97 Disco 300 Tdi manual, Tachometer needle is a little erratic, well,
very erratic, especially at low to medium revs. ISTR there was a simple fix
for this but googling doesn't seem to reveal it, or maybe my searching
doesn't ...

Anyone any clues?

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

 

A

Austin Shackles

Guest

• May 5, 2006

• #2

On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 09:00:02 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Hi all,
>
>'96/'97 Disco 300 Tdi manual, Tachometer needle is a little erratic, well,
>very erratic, especially at low to medium revs. ISTR there was a simple fix
>for this but googling doesn't seem to reveal it, or maybe my searching
>doesn't ...
>
>Anyone any clues?

loose connection to the W terminal on the alternator, and/or alternator
going flaky.

On a 200 TDi, it can be alternator drive belt slack, but on a 300 TDi the
serpentine belt mostly either runs or doesn't.

195 quid plus vat for a replacement alternator here, the other weekend -
front-end bearing had seized and collapsed, taking the casing with it. Parts
supplier kindly took the surcharge off, too - I was expecting to have to pay
that, 'cos I doubt there's much salvageable on the old unit.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Confidence: Before important work meetings, boost your confidence by
reading a few pages from "The Tibetan Book of the Dead"
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.

 

P

Paul - xxx

Guest

• May 5, 2006

• #3

Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 09:00:02 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> '96/'97 Disco 300 Tdi manual, Tachometer needle is a little erratic,
>> well, very erratic, especially at low to medium revs. ISTR there was a
>> simple fix for this but googling doesn't seem to reveal it, or maybe my
>> searching doesn't ...
>>
>> Anyone any clues?
>
> loose connection to the W terminal on the alternator, and/or alternator
> going flaky.
>
> On a 200 TDi, it can be alternator drive belt slack, but on a 300 TDi the
> serpentine belt mostly either runs or doesn't.
>
> 195 quid plus vat for a replacement alternator here, the other weekend -
> front-end bearing had seized and collapsed, taking the casing with it.
> Parts supplier kindly took the surcharge off, too - I was expecting to
> have to pay that, 'cos I doubt there's much salvageable on the old unit.

Cheers Austin. I'll have a look later, when I get a o tuit.

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

 

G

Graham Carter

Guest

• May 5, 2006

• #4

Hi Paul,

Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it - they were
just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they crimped a new spade
clip on.

Cheers!
Graham Carter
Harare
Zimbabwe

"Paul - xxx" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> > On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 09:00:02 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> > <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> '96/'97 Disco 300 Tdi manual, Tachometer needle is a little erratic,
> >> well, very erratic, especially at low to medium revs. ISTR there was a
> >> simple fix for this but googling doesn't seem to reveal it, or maybe my
> >> searching doesn't ...
> >>
> >> Anyone any clues?
> >
> > loose connection to the W terminal on the alternator, and/or alternator
> > going flaky.
> >
> > On a 200 TDi, it can be alternator drive belt slack, but on a 300 TDi
the
> > serpentine belt mostly either runs or doesn't.
> >
> > 195 quid plus vat for a replacement alternator here, the other weekend -
> > front-end bearing had seized and collapsed, taking the casing with it.
> > Parts supplier kindly took the surcharge off, too - I was expecting to
> > have to pay that, 'cos I doubt there's much salvageable on the old unit.
>
> Cheers Austin. I'll have a look later, when I get a o tuit.
>
> --
> Paul ...
> (8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!
>
>

 

A

Austin Shackles

Guest

• May 6, 2006

• #5

On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Hi Paul,
>
>Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it - they were
>just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they crimped a new spade
>clip on.

seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector, except
perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires wrong way
round. The one I've just put on the tranny has captive-nut things like the
disco has on the D+ terminal, for both of them.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
Confidence: Before important work meetings, boost your confidence by
reading a few pages from "The Tibetan Book of the Dead"
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.

 

P

Paul - xxx

Guest

• May 9, 2006

• #6

Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>> Hi Paul,
>>
>> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it - they
>> were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they crimped a new
>> spade clip on.
>
> seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector, except
> perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires wrong way
> round. The one I've just put on the tranny has captive-nut things like
> the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both of them.

You were both right.

The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach proving I
had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner had it working
better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a good look at the
connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the spade was well attached,
and in the end soldered [1] the spade to the wire. The bugger won't come
loose again in a hurry

Many thanks.

[1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature solder and
iron, so it _should_ be OK.

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

 

D

David G. Bell

Guest

• May 9, 2006

• #7

On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
[email protected] "Paul - xxx" wrote:

> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> > On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
> > <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >
> >> Hi Paul,
> >>
> >> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it - they
> >> were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they crimped a new
> >> spade clip on.
> >
> > seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector, except
> > perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires wrong way
> > round. The one I've just put on the tranny has captive-nut things like
> > the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both of them.
>
> You were both right.
>
> The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach proving I
> had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner had it working
> better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a good look at the
> connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the spade was well attached,
> and in the end soldered [1] the spade to the wire. The bugger won't come
> loose again in a hurry
>
> Many thanks.
>
> [1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature solder and
> iron, so it _should_ be OK.

There can be problems with a soldered joint, rather than using a
properly crimped connector. I gather it's a side effect of the solder
wicking up with wire, and leading the the wired being differently
strained when it flexes. If you think about it, one of your models has
an incredibly short operating life, compared to a car.

But I know the temptation of a hot soldering iron.




--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"I am Number Two," said Penfold. "You are Number Six."

 

G

GbH

Guest

• May 9, 2006

• #8

"David G. Bell" wrote:
> On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
> [email protected] "Paul - xxx" wrote:
>
>> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
>>> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
>>> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>>
>>>> Hi Paul,
>>>>
>>>> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it -
>>>> they were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they
>>>> crimped a new spade clip on.
>>>
>>> seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector,
>>> except perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires
>>> wrong way round. The one I've just put on the tranny has
>>> captive-nut things like the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both
>>> of them.
>>
>> You were both right.
>>
>> The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach
>> proving I had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner
>> had it working better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a
>> good look at the connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the
>> spade was well attached, and in the end soldered [1] the spade to
>> the wire. The bugger won't come loose again in a hurry
>>
>> Many thanks.
>>
>> [1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature
>> solder and iron, so it _should_ be OK.
>
> There can be problems with a soldered joint, rather than using a
> properly crimped connector. I gather it's a side effect of the solder
> wicking up with wire, and leading the the wired being differently
> strained when it flexes. If you think about it, one of your models has
> an incredibly short operating life, compared to a car.
>
> But I know the temptation of a hot soldering iron.

I think the damage is maybe due to flux residue rather than the solder

--
"He who says it cannot be done would be well advised not to interrupt
her doing it."

The fiend of my fiend is my enema!

 

A

Austin Shackles

Guest

• May 9, 2006

• #9

On or around Tue, 09 May 2006 11:34:07 GMT, "GbH"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>"David G. Bell" wrote:
>> On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
>> [email protected] "Paul - xxx" wrote:
>>
>>> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
>>>> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
>>>> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Paul,
>>>>>
>>>>> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it -
>>>>> they were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they
>>>>> crimped a new spade clip on.
>>>>
>>>> seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector,
>>>> except perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires
>>>> wrong way round. The one I've just put on the tranny has
>>>> captive-nut things like the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both
>>>> of them.
>>>
>>> You were both right.
>>>
>>> The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach
>>> proving I had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner
>>> had it working better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a
>>> good look at the connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the
>>> spade was well attached, and in the end soldered [1] the spade to
>>> the wire. The bugger won't come loose again in a hurry
>>>
>>> Many thanks.
>>>
>>> [1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature
>>> solder and iron, so it _should_ be OK.
>>
>> There can be problems with a soldered joint, rather than using a
>> properly crimped connector. I gather it's a side effect of the solder
>> wicking up with wire, and leading the the wired being differently
>> strained when it flexes. If you think about it, one of your models has
>> an incredibly short operating life, compared to a car.
>>
>> But I know the temptation of a hot soldering iron.
>
>I think the damage is maybe due to flux residue rather than the solder

I thought it was that the heat alters the properties of the copper. But
there is also a question of strain relief and vibration. By soldering, you
generally end up with a short rigid section of wire, and the flex point
moves to the end of that. On a crimped terminal, there's usually some kind
of strain relief in the bit that grips the outer casing of the wire.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"There are three sorts of people in the world - those who can count,
and those who can't" (Anon)

 

P

Paul - xxx

Guest

• May 9, 2006

• #10

Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> On or around Tue, 09 May 2006 11:34:07 GMT, "GbH"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>> "David G. Bell" wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
>>> [email protected] "Paul - xxx" wrote:
>>>
>>>> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
>>>>> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
>>>>> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Paul,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it -
>>>>>> they were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they
>>>>>> crimped a new spade clip on.
>>>>>
>>>>> seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector,
>>>>> except perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires
>>>>> wrong way round. The one I've just put on the tranny has
>>>>> captive-nut things like the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both
>>>>> of them.
>>>>
>>>> You were both right.
>>>>
>>>> The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach
>>>> proving I had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner
>>>> had it working better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a
>>>> good look at the connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the
>>>> spade was well attached, and in the end soldered [1] the spade to
>>>> the wire. The bugger won't come loose again in a hurry
>>>>
>>>> Many thanks.
>>>>
>>>> [1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature
>>>> solder and iron, so it _should_ be OK.
>>>
>>> There can be problems with a soldered joint, rather than using a
>>> properly crimped connector. I gather it's a side effect of the solder
>>> wicking up with wire, and leading the the wired being differently
>>> strained when it flexes. If you think about it, one of your models has
>>> an incredibly short operating life, compared to a car.
>>>
>>> But I know the temptation of a hot soldering iron.
>>
>> I think the damage is maybe due to flux residue rather than the solder
>
> I thought it was that the heat alters the properties of the copper. But
> there is also a question of strain relief and vibration. By soldering,
> you generally end up with a short rigid section of wire, and the flex
> point moves to the end of that. On a crimped terminal, there's usually
> some kind of strain relief in the bit that grips the outer casing of the
> wire.

Hence why I mentioned my hobby ... I've soldered only where the connection
would be crimped, a very quick job, a very short solder section and little
to no wicking, but an extremely solid joint, finished with a short length of
heat-shrink wrap.

I'm happy it'll last.


--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

 

B

beamendsltd

Guest

• May 10, 2006

• #11

In message <[email protected]>
"Paul - xxx" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> > On or around Tue, 09 May 2006 11:34:07 GMT, "GbH"
> > <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >
> >> "David G. Bell" wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, in article <[email protected]>
> >>> [email protected] "Paul - xxx" wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Austin Shackles came up with the following;:
> >>>>> On or around Fri, 5 May 2006 19:21:29 +0200, "Graham Carter"
> >>>>> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi Paul,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Mine was the W connector - took dealer here 4 efforts to fix it -
> >>>>>> they were just cleaning the conector - only got fixed when they
> >>>>>> crimped a new spade clip on.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> seen the same on a couple of 'em. Dunno why the spade connector,
> >>>>> except perhaps that it makes it more difficult to connect the wires
> >>>>> wrong way round. The one I've just put on the tranny has
> >>>>> captive-nut things like the disco has on the D+ terminal, for both
> >>>>> of them.
> >>>>
> >>>> You were both right.
> >>>>
> >>>> The connector came off wayyyy too easily, a completely dead tach
> >>>> proving I had the right wire, and a quick spray of contact cleaner
> >>>> had it working better but still intermittently hiccuping. After a
> >>>> good look at the connector I decided, as you say, to make sure the
> >>>> spade was well attached, and in the end soldered [1] the spade to
> >>>> the wire. The bugger won't come loose again in a hurry
> >>>>
> >>>> Many thanks.
> >>>>
> >>>> [1] I race electric model cars and used a very high temperature
> >>>> solder and iron, so it _should_ be OK.
> >>>
> >>> There can be problems with a soldered joint, rather than using a
> >>> properly crimped connector. I gather it's a side effect of the solder
> >>> wicking up with wire, and leading the the wired being differently
> >>> strained when it flexes. If you think about it, one of your models has
> >>> an incredibly short operating life, compared to a car.
> >>>
> >>> But I know the temptation of a hot soldering iron.
> >>
> >> I think the damage is maybe due to flux residue rather than the solder
> >
> > I thought it was that the heat alters the properties of the copper. But
> > there is also a question of strain relief and vibration. By soldering,
> > you generally end up with a short rigid section of wire, and the flex
> > point moves to the end of that. On a crimped terminal, there's usually
> > some kind of strain relief in the bit that grips the outer casing of the
> > wire.
>
> Hence why I mentioned my hobby ... I've soldered only where the connection
> would be crimped, a very quick job, a very short solder section and little
> to no wicking, but an extremely solid joint, finished with a short length of
> heat-shrink wrap.
>
> I'm happy it'll last.
>
>

Putting my ex-Wireman hat on - crimped joints should *never* [1]
be soldered, a crimp is a flexible joint (the the individual wires
in the cable are free to move a bit), wheras soldering will
make it rigid, effectively turning cabe into a single wire
which will shear when bent (flexed), as in almost all automtive
applications.

Richard

[1] there are exceptions, mostly heavy current applications like
car battery leads and electrical supply, but only where the
joint has been designed that way.
--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
RISC-OS - Where have all the good guys gone?
Boycott the Yorkshire Dales - No Play, No Pay

 

N

Nigel Hewitt

Guest

• May 10, 2006

• #12

beamendsltd <[email protected]> wrote:

> Putting my ex-Wireman hat on - crimped joints should *never* [1]
> be soldered, a crimp is a flexible joint (the the individual wires
> in the cable are free to move a bit), wheras soldering will
> make it rigid, effectively turning cabe into a single wire
> which will shear when bent (flexed), as in almost all automtive
> applications.

I confess to a modified trick on that.

I crimp the wire grip and quick solder it.
Quick as in not melting the insulation.
Hence I have a waterproof bond between the metals.
Cool it, normally by 'fizzing' in on the soldering iron
sponge then crimp the grip on the insulation so I still
have the slight flex as a strain relief. Then silicon
grease, then a rubber (not solid plastic) shroud. I've
never had to go back and rework a connection I did like
that and that's on boats.

I think the problem with soldering a crimp is that you
destroy all the give in the insulation crimp and throw
the flex onto the metal-to-metal join. Going to sea
everything flexes.

nigelH



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