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Freelander 1 2004 TD4 auto - vibration 3rd gear

Discussion in 'Land Rover Freelander' started by traffic0703, Aug 2, 2018.

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  1. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    My TD4 Auto (covered 89,500 miles) has developed a medium vibration through car when takes 3rd gear. Slight noise as well.
    Happens if engine speed around 1500 to 1800 rpm.
    If you keep accelerating it seems to clear.
    Worse if you are on gentle, constant power holding the rpm around the above speeds.
    Also, I can hear a noise on over run if road noise is low - seems to be coming from gearbox area. It is like a fluttering noise, difficult to describe. Not sure what gear it is in when this happens.
    All other gears feel fine and up to 60/70 mph in higher gears all fine.

    Any advice please?
    Many thanks
     
  2. teddywood1

    teddywood1 Well-Known Member

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    put it into sports so you can use the gear stick then you can at least see what gear it is in where about are you I know of a garage that only repairs auto gearboxes and has done for the last 40 years
     
  3. Skinny Mike

    Skinny Mike Well-Known Member

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    The auto box on the Freelander is a funny old thing to say the least. So options;

    Are you sure it's not the prop shaft bearings giving up? They make a funny fluttering sound at certain speeds when the start to fail.

    When was the auto fluid last replaced, it's gets thin over time.

    There's a breather on the top back of the box, a funny black rubber stump, is it blocked?

    You say they cars done 85000 miles, strangely the whole car changes nature as you approach 100000 miles, the engine alters(for the better) therefore the gearbox does odd things as you get to this distance.

    Have you tried doing what @teddywood1 suggests, put it in sport or tiptronic and see if the noise happens at other times when under more load.

    Do you have access to an auto electrician who can scan the box? It needs to be a top fight scanner to read the Jacto Fault codes, cheap ones will ignore it or report false codes.

    Have you got something wrapped around a drive or prop shaft?

    There's plenty of us on here with the auto, so more opinions will follow.
    Mike
     
  4. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    Thanks for the replies.
    I have now done as suggested and put the box into manual mode.
    I then found that the same symptoms develop in 2nd gear but at around 2200 to 2400 rpm.
    Again if you accelerate out of that zone it clears (or you are below that rpm).
    1st gear seemed fine.
    The symptoms are worse in both 2nd and 3rd gear if you are on a steady, low throttle. If you accelerate more firmly, vibration seems to clear.
    Vibration is mild to moderate and seems to be quite general through the car.

    Last week the two centre prop shaft bearings were changed - the 3rd gear vibration was already present but I don't think the fluttering sound on over run was present. Reason for the bearing change - on firm acceleration, a loud fluttering was heard under the car in their location. On inspection both casings of the bearings were in a bad way. After this job that particular symptom is gone. The mechanic has said the shafts were all marked up so they went back in exactly same positions.

    My mechanic has suggested I speak to local gearbox specialist.

    We are located in Rotherham, South Yorks area.

    Does the 2nd gear symptoms help at all?

    Thanks
     
  5. Skinny Mike

    Skinny Mike Well-Known Member

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    So your not far from me then!
    Either talk to Mr Gearbox in Attercliffe, I've used these when things were a bit too complicated for me. Nice bloke , reasonable price.
    Or
    M&T transmissions, Bradway, just past Low Edges in Sheffield, next to the Sainsbury's Local. Used these for work, nice people and professional.

    That's if you want to jump straight into spending money.

    But when was the auto fluid last changed? Or have you never had it done?
    Mike
     
  6. Nodge68

    Nodge68 Well-Known Member

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    There's a whole load of stuff to check before blaming the box. Fluid is the blood of an automatic gearbox, so it's as important to the boxes good health as blood is to an animal.

    You could also have a softened lower tie bar bush. This will allow the power unit to flop about uncontrolled, especially in lower gears where wheel torque is highest.
     
  7. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    Thanks - although the car is well serviced in every other respect, the auto box oil has not been changed.
    As it has gone on so long I was concerned that by disturbing it a problem may be caused which otherwise would not have happened (if you see what I mean). The box changes gear very smoothly throughout and has always done so.

    From the symptoms described, is this pointing to gearbox?
     
  8. Nodge68

    Nodge68 Well-Known Member

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    Your box fluid is currently not doing what it's designed to do, so will be slowly destroying the box. I'd change it as soon as possible, then drive it 1,000 miles and change it again. I give an auto box that's been neglected 3 fluid changes at 1,000 mile intervals. If you're lucky, the new fluid will correct the problem and it'll perform correctly again.
     
  9. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    Thanks for your help. Any other things worth checking out as well?
     
  10. Hippo

    Hippo Lord Hippo

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    Before I says it... It's not a good idea to drive an auto int neural and coast.

    This ere fault of vibrations in certain gears at certain engine revs... What happens if yer on yer private country estate and yer drive normally up to 50mph, then ease oft, then put it into neutral (keep engine running to keep power steering/brake assistance going) and let it slow down naturally?

    Does it vibrate when in neutral at any perticular speed when slowing down naturally?
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2021
  11. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    ok, not ever done that to an auto before.
    So once up to say 50mph move box to neutral and let it coast.
    Do I need to stop before re-engaging drive? Will it harm it to move to drive on the move?
     
  12. Hippo

    Hippo Lord Hippo

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    Personally, I always engage drive when stationary. It is the betterer thing to do.
     
  13. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    ok thanks - I need to drive it again as this has got me thinking - Once it drops into 3rd and the vibration starts I am wondering what happens if you let go of power - what would it indicate if the vibration stays the same or it stops?
     
  14. Hippo

    Hippo Lord Hippo

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    I'm wondering if the fault is related to vehicle speed, with or without it being propelled by the engine/gearbox or not. It's not easy to push it fast enough to tell, so slowing down in neutral from speed is an easier self test.

    It's ilegal to coast on the public highway so yer need to do it on yer private country estate.

    Previously I have towed one from stationary while accelerating to prove if it's movement related or not.

    It's hard to speculate what the problem is. If you choose to follow this route of testing, then let us know the result. The test isn't perfect but may reduce the factors possible causing yer problem.

    There are many vibrations and harmonics generated in a car. They travel about anorl. Simple eggsample is if a fault is speed related or engine rev's related.
     
  15. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    ok some more tests run.

    Drift down from 40 mph to stop in "drive" - no vibration but can hear slight fluttering noise.

    Drift down from 40mph to stop in "neutral" - no vibration and same fluttering noise - so neutral made no difference to noise.

    3rd gear - 1500 to 1800 rpm - light throttle - vibration kicks in and fluttering noise - vibration clears if lift power off and also clears if you accelerate firmly. Vibration is through car generally.

    2nd gear - 2000 to 2300 rpm - same as above in 3rd.

    On motorway I think I could also feel the vibration in 4th - but again only on a light throttle input.

    Once you have the vibration there - if you keep power the same the vibration and noise remains constant.

    The problem seems to be to do with light throttle input as if you lift off the power and it's gone.

    Does all this help?

    Many thanks
     
  16. Nodge68

    Nodge68 Well-Known Member

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    I think I'd be checking the lower engine tie bar bush. If it's very soft, then it could allow the power unit to flop about uncontrolled. If you increase the throttle, then the load on the bush increases, reducing the amount of flop as the bush is under compression.
    Just a thought anyway.
     
  17. Hippo

    Hippo Lord Hippo

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    I would look at the tie bar bush anorl. Vibration seems to be related to power applied like accelleration. But only certain revs depending on gear. Easy to take oft and have a look at to rule it out.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=DptYakVvGqc
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2021
  18. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    Thanks. I will be getting someone to check things for me.
    Any other possible things to check at same time?
     
  19. Nodge68

    Nodge68 Well-Known Member

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    The front drive shaft in board joints are another cause of vibration while accelerating. These stiffen as the joint wears, which results in power unit shake while accelerating. This can often be exaggerated by a soft lower tie bar bush.
     
  20. traffic0703

    traffic0703 Member

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    ok thanks for your help. I don't think the fluttering type noise was there before the central prop shaft bearings were changed. (vibration was). I will be getting someone to drive it for me and see. I don't know any actual Freelander or Land Rover specialists in Rotherham/Sheffield area - can anyone assist there?
     
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