P38A 2.5 diesel starter motor

wammers said:

Why is that?

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Does the solenoid not move and pull in a switch to pull in the high current side or something? So if reversed won't it stay where it is and all that current will just heat it up until it fries?

Grrrrrr said:

Does the solenoid not move and pull in a switch to pull in the high current side or something? So if reversed won't it stay where it is and all that current will just heat it up until it fries?

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Depends on the type of starter. On old Bendix types, the solenoid simply presses a bar across a pair of contact studs to supply power to the motor. No newer pre engagement geared types , it also levers the drive gear into engagement with the ring gear.

Grrrrrr said:

Does the solenoid not move and pull in a switch to pull in the high current side or something? So if reversed won't it stay where it is and all that current will just heat it up until it fries?

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The solenoid would still be pulled but the motor would spin in reverse.

wammers said:

The solenoid would still be pulled but the motor would spin in reverse.

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Just realised, mine was still on the car and 2 of the 3 wires were correct before my little helper fitted the third one wrong and fried my starter.

Grrrrrr said:

Does the solenoid not move and pull in a switch to pull in the high current side or something? So if reversed won't it stay where it is and all that current will just heat it up until it fries?

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Pulled it apart (again) but solenoid was fused couldnt get it open. Other parts still worn but with a few 10mm-nut spacers with the snapped comm springs it should work, but it doesn’t Can’t get power to it, no solenoid click nothing. Try jumping terminals hardly any current goes through it. Fuses are okay , don’t know how to check the relay but don’t smell burnt.
@kds


Battery seems to light everything up So hoping that’s okay. Fingers crossed. Looks like crystals in there but still a green light

Then I saw this...

so went and had a lie down (maybe a bit of a cry but don’t tell boys). Then got a sweet old lady up the road to give me a lift to the scrap yard.
Scrappy couldn’t understand how I’ve got a BMW in a RR usual. only BM ones he had were 1.6/8 petrol or Rover V8 (looks fitment but its tiny). Merc CD one looks right but solenoids on wrong side. Went home

Had a good look online, mainly really bad examples @ £60, then saw one off a 2001 DSE - looks recently renewed before vehicle scrapped - looks an authentic LR one nearly new! £40 score
Take few days to deliver so I’ve ordered new glow plug to replace the one I epoxy’d on previously while manifolds off. Chance to clean it all up a little before all goes back on.

RangeRoller dt said:

Pulled it apart (again) but solenoid was fused couldnt get it open. Other parts still worn but with a few 10mm-nut spacers with the snapped comm springs it should work, but it doesn’t Can’t get power to it, no solenoid click nothing. Try jumping terminals hardly any current goes through it. Fuses are okay , don’t know how to check the relay but don’t smell burnt.
@kds
View attachment 183169 View attachment 183170 View attachment 183171

Battery seems to light everything up So hoping that’s okay. Fingers crossed. Looks like crystals in there but still a green light

Then I saw this...View attachment 183172

so went and had a lie down (maybe a bit of a cry but don’t tell boys). Then got a sweet old lady up the road to give me a lift to the scrap yard.
Scrappy couldn’t understand how I’ve got a BMW in a RR usual. only BM ones he had were 1.6/8 petrol or Rover V8 (looks fitment but its tiny). Merc CD one looks right but solenoids on wrong side. Went home

Had a good look online, mainly really bad examples @ £60, then saw one off a 2001 DSE - looks recently renewed before vehicle scrapped - looks an authentic LR one nearly new! £40 score
Take few days to deliver so I’ve ordered new glow plug to replace the one I epoxy’d on previously while manifolds off. Chance to clean it all up a little before all goes back on.

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Look at Island 4X4 for VDO lift pump. https://www.island-4x4.co.uk/fuel-pump-esr1111g-p-7733.html Diesel Jones Manchester for injection pump. Around £600.00 exchange.

When you test your new starter you connect the red positive to the free terminal at back of solenoid. The one that is NOT cabled into the motor. You connect negative black to the starter body. You then touch the small Lucar connector on solenoid with a positive fly lead. Solenoid should be pulled and motor should run. If you connect negative to starter motor body and touch left hand solenoid terminal (cabled into motor) with positive. Motor should run but solenoid will not be pulled.

£600 will be acceptable when it comes to it. only matter of time til she starts cutting out turning wheel on tickover. Just need more time - itl go to the PO for its MOT so he should notice a significant improvement. As it was, if they get it up to heat for emissions then turn it off - itl be stuck there for 6hrs cooling down

Il put new starter straight on - no ****ing about this time still good to have it spelled out for me there’s always a next time

Dont tell him to test it @wammers look what happened last time ! Think replacement best option now looking at those pics, in other news I hear the price of scrap is up so weigh the old one.

He knows once he corrects me I do actually
Listen , to him anyway.

It’s had atleast 3lives and done fair service to me.
+1 for BMW 525 starter motors, but JLR if your pockets are insanely deep.

RangeRoller dt said:

He knows once he corrects me I do actually
Listen , to him anyway.

It’s had atleast 3lives and done fair service to me.
+1 for BMW 525 starter motors, but JLR if your pockets are insanely deep.

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Second hand ones are cheap on the Bay. £30 delivered. Stay away from classic-rides-north-wales.

RangeRoller dt said:

£600 will be acceptable when it comes to it. only matter of time til she starts cutting out turning wheel on tickover. Just need more time - itl go to the PO for its MOT so he should notice a significant improvement. As it was, if they get it up to heat for emissions then turn it off - itl be stuck there for 6hrs cooling down

Il put new starter straight on - no ****ing about this time still good to have it spelled out for me there’s always a next time

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I find it odd that you are thinking of spending £600 on a re-con FIP but are reluctant to spend a few quid doing the in tank pump.

Grrrrrr said:

Second hand ones are cheap on the Bay. £30 delivered. Stay away from classic-rides-north-wales.

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Stay away from N.Wales period, full of g*gs
The majority of what’s available is £50 for junk, think I’ve got a nearly new JLR/Hella one for £40. See when it gets here

@Datatek I’m reluctant to spend anything just my nature
plan is ....
Static timing, lift pump, exhaust, MOT in that order.

FIP in next years budget if MOT goes okay - £600 and no daily driver for while will require more planning is why it’s on my mind now,
Also am paying slowly towards a set of wheels with slightly smaller, more road applicable tyres.

Also two other factors.
1) I will be moving before long and will not have a place to store/strip my vehicle so lift pump needs to be done soon while I have secure room.
2) skills - lift pump is something that I am not familiar with. I will battle through it but something PO said makes me think I will find problems there. He knows what I am like and warned me to leave tank and don’t let it go down.

I also brimmed the tank before I parked it up as this usually helps so will have to run it down before I do the work

RangeRoller dt said:

Stay away from N.Wales period, full of g*gs
The majority of what’s available is £50 for junk, think I’ve got a nearly new JLR/Hella one for £40. See when it gets here

@Datatek I’m reluctant to spend anything just my nature
plan is ....
Static timing, lift pump, exhaust, MOT in that order.

FIP in next years budget if MOT goes okay - £600 and no daily driver for while will require more planning is why it’s on my mind now,
Also am paying slowly towards a set of wheels with slightly smaller, more road applicable tyres.

Also two other factors.
1) I will be moving before long and will not have a place to store/strip my vehicle so lift pump needs to be done soon while I have secure room.
2) skills - lift pump is something that I am not familiar with. I will battle through it but something PO said makes me think I will find problems there. He knows what I am like and warned me to leave tank and don’t let it go down.

I also brimmed the tank before I parked it up as this usually helps so will have to run it down before I do the work

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In the tech section there is info on how to cut an access panel in the floor to change the lift pump. Job can then be done with a full tank

Good point, Think it’s best if I wait then drop tank.
Me cutting up my P38 won’t end well

Good thing is I am back on the road
This is what I got - came 2days early, was vacuum sealed and wrapped beyond belief, looks like it’s had little use - £40 I am over the moon!

Had bolts with it so now have two sets if anyone is stuck? They seem shorter then mine but the 5series one I had (sprayed blue) was not exact fit like this one.
It cleaned up easy plus I’ve tidied up bay while waiting.

Glow plug hasn’t arrived yet so il leave it til next time.

Datatek said:

In the tech section there is info on how to cut an access panel in the floor to change the lift pump. Job can then be done with a full tank

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I followed this way and was very simple and easy . Used holts metal putty from Wilko (few quid) to repair where I had cut

RangeRoller dt said:

Good point, Think it’s best if I wait then drop tank.
Me cutting up my P38 won’t end well

Good thing is I am back on the road
This is what I got - came 2days early, was vacuum sealed and wrapped beyond belief, looks like it’s had little use - £40 I am over the moon!
View attachment 183302
Had bolts with it so now have two sets if anyone is stuck? They seem shorter then mine but the 5series one I had (sprayed blue) was not exact fit like this one.
It cleaned up easy plus I’ve tidied up bay while waiting.

Glow plug hasn’t arrived yet so il leave it til next time.

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The studs on mine are short and only just long enough really.

The bottom one with the bracket is only just, top one is longer. These spares are both shorter one.