1985-Ninety Front Brake question

Morning folks

At Malvern the weekend I was lucky to drop on a set of front discs / hubs etc and a pair of calipers. All about 6 months old & in great condition. Unfortunately they are for a 1986 on Ninety, mine is a 1985 and the calipers are certainly different but I don’t know about the hubs, discs, bearings etc which was all included.

My question is will any of it fit?

It looks like the very early 1983-85 stuff is all different. If it will fit am I going to get brake pressure issues as I seem to think the master cylinders are different on the 1986 on models?

Thanks all, John

Post a photo of the callipers.
There are not many changes to the brake system for them years

What Phil says, post photos of what you got and what you brought at Malvern

there are differences and master cylinder and calipers need to be matched but it isn’t difficult to match up the right parts.

As you suspect, the early stuff - callipers, master cylinders and servo are different. I had difficulty getting hold of a pair of fronts for my 1985 90" a few year ago - and they were expensive when I finally succeeded! You might need to hubs to suit, I'll be interested to see if the newer callipers bolt onto the older hub - good luck.

zeaphod said:

As you suspect, the early stuff - callipers, master cylinders and servo are different. I had difficulty getting hold of a pair of fronts for my 1985 90" a few year ago - and they were expensive when I finally succeeded! You might need to hubs to suit, I'll be interested to see if the newer callipers bolt onto the older hub - good luck.

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they do, I had the same issue as you and eventually went for the later calipers and discs and changed the MC to suit aswell

kept my old calipers and had them media blasted and refurbed the old mc to

I thought early callipers were off RRC?

]Hi everyone & thanks for your replies.
Just a bit of history regarding the brake issue. The Landy is a 1985 90 bought 12 months ago as a project to finish off what the previous owner had started. A load of work had been done but nothing to brakes which is what I am working on now. Rear brakes all done with new drums; cylinders, shoes etc. Working on the front now, the discs are down to 10mm thick so need replacing so will do calipers as well.
Photos below of stuff bought at Malvern & what's on vehicle. Obviously very different, new pads / calipers are pins through the pad. On vehicle pins over the top. Should have took some photos to take with me !!
Anyway hopefully they will help answer the question. Incidentally, owner did fit a new servo, looks like the old MC so I suppose I could change the MC.
Cheers John

Those calipers you want fit are the later versions (were originally 110 only but later fitted to 90’s as well to ratify parts) that’s what I fitted. I had to change the MC aswell, will look up the part number in my records tomorrow, but essentially you want to fit a 110mc . The brake pipes on the calipers are different to, I just made up new ones from the flexi to the caliper using cupro nickle and a flare kit.

I can’t remember what I did with mounting the bigger calipers but I am pretty sure that they bolted up to the existing bracket.

the disc’s will fit fine

Then are 110 fronts

Here is how I made the pipes to connect them, they fitted fine

click on the little up arrow in quote to go to the thread (I think) and see the photos

flat said:

Made my own brake lines chap in my local motor factors lent me the stuff and showed me how

Also fitted some better gauges to keep an eye on the tdi.

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Hi all & thanks for the info, I think that's answered the question apart from one point. Flat - you mentioned that the discs will fit ok, but as you can see they came as a complete assembly with hub / bearings / seals etc. Can I just drop the whole lot on? or should I remove the new discs and fit to the old hubs etc if they are different?

Cheers John

Turn the old disks over(onto the large nut/flange ) & see the bolts in the disk. These need removing.
To help removal,attach it back onto a wheel. & lay it on the floor

If you're buying new discs, have a look at the grooved/drilled options. IIRC they weren't much more expensive than the standard. I can't say for certain how much better than new standard discs they will be, but they certainly look good when you're "down there" lol.

johnmm51 said:

Hi all & thanks for the info, I think that's answered the question apart from one point. Flat - you mentioned that the discs will fit ok, but as you can see they came as a complete assembly with hub / bearings / seals etc. Can I just drop the whole lot on? or should I remove the new discs and fit to the old hubs etc if they are different?

Cheers John

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If they are in good order and then they would fit On just fine, either the discs themselves or the whole lot. If it was me I would fit new bearings and seals on anyway tbh. The hubs on your vehicle will be the same as these ones pictured

Those hubs pictured look different from standard because the drive flanges are aftermarket "heavy duty "items. They may be 24 spline and not suit your axle shaft's Not a problem as your original flanges will fit. If mine I would clean out the hub and bearings of all old oil and grease keeping the bearings with the position they come from pop back in dry and rotate with your fingers. If smooth reuse, taper roller bearings are by design adjustable. Fit new seals, Cortico are good.

Thanks everyone, I think I know where I am going with this lot now.
Just the issue with the MC now. Your recommendation was to change it for a 110 MC , is it NRC 8690 pre TDI up to 1991 110 MC ?
Out of interest how would the brakes perform if I didn't change the MC?
Can I keep the old (but brand new) servo replaced by previous owner.?
Sorry for all the questions, I'me OK with straight forward stuff but when it comes to swapping components I get bit lost. I had the same issue when restoring an old Triumph bike. It was a bit of a bitsa with all sorts of stuff fitted !!
Cheers John

johnmm51 said:

Thanks everyone, I think I know where I am going with this lot now.
Just the issue with the MC now. Your recommendation was to change it for a 110 MC , is it NRC 8690 pre TDI up to 1991 110 MC ?
Out of interest how would the brakes perform if I didn't change the MC?
Can I keep the old (but brand new) servo replaced by previous owner.?
Sorry for all the questions, I'me OK with straight forward stuff but when it comes to swapping components I get bit lost. I had the same issue when restoring an old Triumph bike. It was a bit of a bitsa with all sorts of stuff fitted !!
Cheers John

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the servo you can keep, the mc will just come off of it and the new MC will bolt up fine.
I had the original ‘90’ spec MC with the 110 brakes and it worked, except pedal travel was excessive and brake modulation quite poor - they were quite binary. With the larger 110mc they felt much better.
I will go upstairs and look out the part number I fitted to mine, hold fire.

Quick Q @flat
How do you now find the brakes with large callipers & drums?
(Only asking for knowlage)

I can’t find the part number but that one (nrc8690) looks like the one I fitted. I recall ordering a later one and it was very different, like much shorter.

Hicap phill said:

Quick Q @flat
How do you now find the brakes with large callipers & drums?
(Only asking for knowlage)

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seems fine tbh, i fitted them in 2016 and have had no issues since. I generally avoid situations where I have to emergency stop but they are certainly good enough to do so.

TBH the whole thing was a mistake because I ordered the wrong calipers to start with and then, I didn’t completely like how the 90 master cylinder felt with 110 calipers but luckily for me it started leaking so I swapped it out for a 110 version. And has been fine since.

I can’t remember if I had to redo any lines to go into the MC, I don’t recall doing so but will look under the bonnet tomorrow