Can’t think of another word for it so ‘shuddering’

We were pottering along yesterday, just got some oil for todays oil change actually, and out of the blue she suddenly felt a bit jittery, like when you leave it late to change down. I eased up and was sorely tempted to head straight to a workshop I know. It was a very busy road with nowhere to stop so I crossed everything and carried on taking care with gear changes and throttling up. She seemed to settle but it was tense and I am certain I picked up the whiff of hot metal. When I got back I could find no leaks, nothing was loose and nothing was particularly hot, (bearing housings for example). The clutch is fine.
I did the oil change this morning and thankfully there was nothing in it but it was a bit overdue. I am perplexed but could it be nothing or is a bit of shuddering, albeit in very short bursts, a sign of even more money going out?

Any kind of vibration or noise, first step is always check UJs

Handbrake rubbing.?

Kev12 said:

Any kind of vibration or noise, first step is always check UJs

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Good point. From my experience, when a UJ is worn, you can feel vibration in the gear lever when gently accelerating, that goes away when you lift off.

Thanks already. I rummaged around as best I could whilst the oil was draining out and could not see/feel or bounce on anything out of order. Are UJ’s meant to be rock solid or is there a little give? Driving around the block is not helping as I cannot replicate the same conditions so we are off for a spin on a couple of local B roads tomorrow. I am going to try the handbrake idea out a few times along the way and focus on the UJ’s as when I reverted to coaxing rather than driving her ‘the fear’ subsided.

Obviously I didn’t mean rock solid as in immovable. I am guessing there has to be a little bit of sideways play as in my experience, nothing too detailed of course, landrover technology did not work to micro millimetres. I suppose the test would be sufficient sideways play to make it rattle?

There shouldn't be any play in the ujs really. Same with the sliding joint. Having said that, they need to be quite bad to feel juddering, a small amount just ads to the play in the gearboxes and axle and makes the drivetrain clunk as you're on and off the throttle.

I'd give the handbrake drum a good waggle with the brake off, I've often found them loose on new to me landies. No chance it's got into 4wd?

You can remove a prop to check it properly even with no play I’ve had a tight notchy spot that caused a not of noise/ vibration, the high friction could warm it a bit too, and with it off can see how it drives, then swap over.

Just to add to the UJ free play (or lack of it) comments: when a UJ wears (usually ingress of dirt) what usually happens is that the cruciform part in the centre, that acts as the inner race of the bearing, gets grooved. The needle bearings don't fully rotate of course, they just go back and forth a smaller or larger amount dependent on the angle that the joint is working at. This translates as a vibration that can be felt in the gear lever (on manual boxes anyway). The vibration happens when accelerating but stops when coasting.

Thanks for all the tips. I’ll be looking for a notch spot later. I will also get the chance to do a bit of coasting down a couple of long drags so hopefully I’ll have nobody right up my rear end expecting me to speed up. Here we go then………..

Had this once on the M5 going on my hols in Cornwall anyway coming off mway at services came out of o/d and the gearbox sounded like it had exploded anyway inspected everything to find oil spewing out of o/d and transfer box empty main gear box was fine so drained o/d and refilled both o/d and transfer box then found out my speedo was out by 10mph thought i was doing 65 mph when i was doing 75 mph so kept speed down and never had the problem again, this was in my last S2a as i have higher gearing in this one

It took a little while to get out of Exeter today but up and down the gears, stop, start and walking pace in queues seemed fine. However after seven uninterrupted miles some horrible clunking noises came from below which eased a bit when I slowed down to about 25 from 30, not much at all. For about ten seconds the clunking got really loud, enough to distract a pedestrian and I have to confess I was a bit spooked. I was all set to pull into a driveway but it suddenly stopped and she was purring like a kitten. I had to take a couple of roundabouts and an underpass which went smoothly enough and then a long gradient in third before I could safely stop. Nothing obvious down below and she was ticking over nicely so I pushed on to a three mile hill and coasted all the way down the other side. No vibrations, no clunking, brakes were fine, steering was fine. On the way back, same route, she had a couple of climbs, third to second then back, and that was fine but again out of the blue a couple of clunks and the whiff of hot metal which quickly dispersed. I think third to fourth clunked a bit but I was a nervous wreck by now. We got back going steady all the way and got stuck in traffic again which meant lots of gear changes and accelerating/slowing down. No clunking, no drips. I took every opportunity to test vibrations through the gear stick and checked the hand brake, 4WD, and going through the gears and overdrive. Have to say I felt like the loud clunking episode was going to be terminal but post clunking trauma episode she was fine, mind you we are looking a very steady 30mph tops.
Would a UJ readjust itself?

If it was a tight notchy uj a good workout might loosen it up
I have one of these makes things a bit easier getting it off

Thanks for this. For my own piece of mind, so long as I can get the bits from Brookwells, I might get stuck into this over the weekend. I’ll hold fire for a bit though in case the forum guys have a diagnosis.

Take the rear prop shaft off and drive it in 4wd on the front prop to see if problem goes.

Stages of usual UJ fail.
1. A journal gets a bit tight and there is a bit of vibration
2. Journal gets notchy, more vibration.
3. Starts seize, gets hot as you drive. A brownish discolouring often seen on affected journal. More vibe the further you drive. The sound of a Canary chirping underneath can be a giveaway.
4. At this point they sometimes go solid and there will be a hell of vibration but more likely it will wear rapidly and go quiet with little vibration leading driver to think problem has sorted itself.
5. More wear and the little roller pins fall out, the journal end now rattles in the cap like a barsteward.
6. Terminal fail, journal wears through cap and even some of the yolk and prop comes apart.

Thanks Tottot. I have a horrible feeling we are at stage 4. There is no discolouring, as far as I can see even with a torch gripped between my teeth. The canary chirping, nice analogy, might have happened yesterday so it’s probably best I sort it.
Thanks everybody, it’s been a learning curve. I only have a service lane to work in and I would quite like to tackle this one so I had best sweet talk the neighbours for an undisturbed half day.

A complete replacement propshaft is not that expensive. It will also be fully balanced. if the UJs and sliding splines are regularly greased it should last for years.

I replaced both when I rebuilt my Series. I found that the bearing cups were loose in the yoke bores at one end of the first old shaft I stripped, so decided to buy new.

They are very easy to install with the special socket posted further up the page, it's only four bolts at each end holding it on.

You can also strip and the old one and rebuild it with new UJs as a spare if it is good enough to re-use.

Thanks for that. Logistically it would be easier to replace the whole unit and refurb the existing one at my leisure. I have been the custodian for nearly twenty years and have only ever greased and cleaned the UJ’s so they have done a shift. I seem to have so little down time these days and definitely no space with two more adults and a grandson still here as their new build is waiting for bricks. However looking up UJ options there are seven providers including GKN, Hardy Spicer and the usual suspects, likely more, with prices ranging from 12 to fifty quid. Any makes to avoid?

Un named very cheap.