Viscous Fan's ?????

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A

andy

Guest
Hi all,

The Viscous unit for my 90 2.5TD is knackered. Does anybody know if it
is possible to get these reconditioned, or where to buy reconditioned
units????

I have had some bad luck with second hand ones, and a new one is in the
region of £55.00.

Cheers,

Andy

 

"andy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Hi all,

The Viscous unit for my 90 2.5TD is knackered. Does anybody know if it
is possible to get these reconditioned, or where to buy reconditioned
units????

I have had some bad luck with second hand ones, and a new one is in the
region of £55.00.


Sorry, I don't think they can be reconditioned. In all honesty, they are
very reliable bits of kit, I happily remove electric kits and fit viscous
fans back on, they keep the engine more stable, thermally, than any electric
does. Fit a new one, it'll probably outlast the engine and chassis.
Badger.


 
On Mon, 5 Sep 2005 11:37:53 +0000 (UTC), "Badger"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"andy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>Hi all,
>
>The Viscous unit for my 90 2.5TD is knackered. Does anybody know if it
>is possible to get these reconditioned, or where to buy reconditioned
>units????
>
>I have had some bad luck with second hand ones, and a new one is in the
>region of £55.00.
>
>
>Sorry, I don't think they can be reconditioned. In all honesty, they are
>very reliable bits of kit, I happily remove electric kits and fit viscous
>fans back on, they keep the engine more stable, thermally, than any electric
>does. Fit a new one, it'll probably outlast the engine and chassis.
>Badger.
>
I agree with Badger, replace it with another.

That said, how do you know its broken? Is it in pieces or are you
assuming its broken because you can still spin it freely when the
engine is at running temp (In the UK this is normal behaviour as they
tend not to run hot enough to solidify (for the want of a better word)
the viscous fluid? When the engine is first started from cold it
should blow a gale over the engine and then 30s or a minute later you
should feel the air flow reduce. If it behaves like that when cold, I
believe it should be OK.

Jon

 
i take it that its knackered, as when i start the engine from cold, or
the engine is at normal running temeperature, and idling or fast
running, i canot feel any air being pulled from the fan, and you can
see the fan spinning, but very slowly.

i have fitted the blades to an old seized viscouse i hapened to have
laying around, and i have "a gale" blowing over the engine.

Andy

 
Defo change for another then... Or save £60 and use the seized one as
a permenant fixture... I would. A permenent fan is much better than
no fan, any performance loss / reduction in mpg is bugger all and
should not be noticable.

Jon

On 5 Sep 2005 05:09:13 -0700, "andy" <[email protected]> wrote:

>i take it that its knackered, as when i start the engine from cold, or
>the engine is at normal running temeperature, and idling or fast
>running, i canot feel any air being pulled from the fan, and you can
>see the fan spinning, but very slowly.
>
>i have fitted the blades to an old seized viscouse i hapened to have
>laying around, and i have "a gale" blowing over the engine.
>
>Andy

 
i would be happy to leave the seized one on long term, but it looks to
have a slight bend in the coupling, and viscous bit is all
damaged/dented. after the hastle i have had recently with the water
pump and other bits, i don't want to risk shagging the new pump i have
just fitted.

that said, i suppose £60 spent now on a new one, will be better than
knackering the new pump and having to replace and still need a fan??

Cheers anyhow.

Andy

 

"Jon" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Defo change for another then... Or save £60 and use the seized one as
> a permenant fixture... I would. A permenent fan is much better than
> no fan, any performance loss / reduction in mpg is bugger all and
> should not be noticable.
>

A fixed fan could be using about 6hp at anything over 2500 erpm. A
disengaged viscous unit will only use about 1hp. That 5hp has to come from
fuel.

Huw


 

"andy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>i take it that its knackered, as when i start the engine from cold, or
> the engine is at normal running temeperature, and idling or fast
> running, i canot feel any air being pulled from the fan, and you can
> see the fan spinning, but very slowly.
>
> i have fitted the blades to an old seized viscouse i hapened to have
> laying around, and i have "a gale" blowing over the engine.
>
> Andy
>

Which sounds about right. The viscous fan should however engage fully in hot
weather, as we have had recently, if the engine has been working hard. It
could occasionally engage also during prolonged town use but it would likely
cycle itself more often.

It is surprising that viscous fans do not engage more often than they do in
general.

Huw


 
i don't think i explained too well, the fan seem to not be pulling any
air through, what ever the temperature of the engine or amount of revs.

 

"andy" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>i don't think i explained too well, the fan seem to not be pulling any
> air through, what ever the temperature of the engine or amount of revs.
>

If the instrument panel water temperature gauge does not venture above about
the 3/4 mark then what's the problem?
If it hits red or the water boils over, *then* you have a problem and not
really before.

Huw


 
> >i don't think i explained too well, the fan seem to not be pulling any
> > air through, what ever the temperature of the engine or amount of revs.
> >
>
> If the instrument panel water temperature gauge does not venture above
about
> the 3/4 mark then what's the problem?
> If it hits red or the water boils over, *then* you have a problem and not
> really before.

Mine's the same. I think yours is normal and I would leave well alone,
taking note of the post above mine.
TonyB


 
yes now i have the fixed/seized fan on, it sits happily (as huw stsded)
at around the 3/4 mark, with the other fan on, up to, and into the red
:-(

Andy

 
On Monday 05 September 2005 13:09, andy([email protected]) wrote in
message <[email protected]>

> i take it that its knackered, as when i start the engine from cold, or
> the engine is at normal running temeperature, and idling or fast
> running, i canot feel any air being pulled from the fan, and you can
> see the fan spinning, but very slowly.
>
> i have fitted the blades to an old seized viscouse i hapened to have
> laying around, and i have "a gale" blowing over the engine.

That's the whole point of a viscous fan, isn't it?
ie: it shouldn't be blowing air until the engine gets hot.

I was helping a friend fit a 2.8 Daihatsu engine to his IIa Land Rover and
got to playing with the viscous unit as I'd never seen one up close.
It turned stiffly against the shaft for several turns then quickly loosened
off until it seemed to be mounted on bearings with no viscosity at all.
That, he assured me, was the correct action.

--
2001 FZS600 - Silver/Black
1974 SIII Land Rover - Hardtop 2.25 Petrol, Green
1954 Ford 100E Prefect - Black
 
On or around Mon, 5 Sep 2005 20:16:07 +0100, "Huw"
<hedydd[nospam]@tiscali.co.uk> enlightened us thusly:

>Which sounds about right. The viscous fan should however engage fully in hot
>weather, as we have had recently, if the engine has been working hard. It
>could occasionally engage also during prolonged town use but it would likely
>cycle itself more often.
>
>It is surprising that viscous fans do not engage more often than they do in
>general.

normally, I guess there's enough airflow and/or cooling. I've almost never
had a correctly-working viscous fan cut in in normal use - I've known the
one on the sierra do so when tuning the gas system, which involves running
it at 3000 rpm with the vehicle stationary.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"Chuck didn't reply, so George swung round in his saddle. He could just
see Chuck's face, a white oval turned toward the sky.
'Look,' whispered Chuck, and George lifted his eyes to heaven.
(There is always a last time for everything.)
Overhead, without any fuss, the stars were going out"
Arthur C. Clarke, "The 9 billion names of God"
 
On or around 5 Sep 2005 14:30:02 -0700, "andy" <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>yes now i have the fixed/seized fan on, it sits happily (as huw stsded)
>at around the 3/4 mark, with the other fan on, up to, and into the red
>:-(
>
>Andy

chances are your rad is knackered. On the 110 with the V8 in it, I
perpetually overheated when running slowly or under heavy load even with a
fixed fan or running electric fan, until I gave up and replaced the rad, it
then sat at half-gauge under almost any provocation.

I've never yet succeeded in unblocking a buggered rad, either - problem is
that you can't shift enough water through it to clear all the tubes - once
about a couple of dozen tubes are clear, the water flow through them and not
the blocked ones. Anything violent enough to do the job chemically would
probably eat the rad as well...

Edward II has similar trouble - rad looks iffy, so replacing it is on the
to-do list.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
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In article <[email protected]>, Badger
<[email protected]> writes
> I happily remove electric kits and fit viscous
>fans back on, they keep the engine more stable, thermally, than any electric
>does.

That's not the viscous thing per se, but poor control of the electric
ones. They ought to be continuously variable speed, not just on-off (
which would indeed cause the thermal 'wobble' you mention).

Incidentally, the engine is more efficient at higher temperatures, so
over-cooling is inefficient. Also the mechanical belt coupling to the
fan soaks up a lot of power, which the electric ones don't.

I'm not saying I know for certain, but I don't think it's at all as
clear cut as you're suggesting.


Regards,

Simonm.

--
simonm|at|muircom|dot|demon|.|c|oh|dot|u|kay
SIMON MUIR, UK INDEPENDENCE PARTY, BRISTOL www.ukip.org
EUROPEANS AGAINST THE EU www.members.aol.com/eurofaq
GT250A'76 R80/RT'86 110CSW TD'88 www.kc3ltd.co.uk/profile/eurofollie/
 

"SpamTrapSeeSig" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, Badger
> <[email protected]> writes
>> I happily remove electric kits and fit viscous
>>fans back on, they keep the engine more stable, thermally, than any
>>electric
>>does.
>
> That's not the viscous thing per se, but poor control of the electric
> ones. They ought to be continuously variable speed, not just on-off (
> which would indeed cause the thermal 'wobble' you mention).

True, but AFAIK none of the readily available electric kits have variable
speed control, only some seriously overpriced motorsport stuff.

> Incidentally, the engine is more efficient at higher temperatures, so
> over-cooling is inefficient. Also the mechanical belt coupling to the fan
> soaks up a lot of power, which the electric ones don't.

But the extra load on the significantly more thermally inefficient
alternator soaks up the same or more power via its drive belt, so that
doesn't really come into it.

> I'm not saying I know for certain, but I don't think it's at all as clear
> cut as you're suggesting.

The whole point is, the energy for the fan must come from somewhere, and
whatever way you choose to do it, it comes from burning fuel in the engine,
so cut out as many energy conversion processes as possible and reduce the
ammount of energy lost at each process. This is a perfectly valid argument
for a correctly operating viscous fan hub, when it is in unlocked
(freewheel) mode, the power drain on the engine is next to nothing.
Badger.



 
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