Squealing 300tdi

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M

McBad

Guest
Hi, my 300tdi is squealing from somewhere in the area of the belt that runs
round the fan and water pump and alternator, etc. It's been doing it for a
couple of months and it doesn't seem to be getting much worse, but all the
same it's a vile noise.

Should I worry? Any way to fix it? I'm wondering if it could be the belt
itself and am tempted to run water onto the running belt and see if that
changes the noise...

Thanks for any advice.

Cheers,

M.


 
"McBad" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Hi, my 300tdi is squealing from somewhere in the area of the belt that
> runs round the fan and water pump and alternator, etc. It's been
> doing it for a couple of months and it doesn't seem to be getting much
> worse, but all the same it's a vile noise.
>
> Should I worry? Any way to fix it? I'm wondering if it could be the
> belt itself and am tempted to run water onto the running belt and see
> if that changes the noise...
>
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Cheers,
>
> M.
>
>
>

This one is a hardy perennial. Do a Google -- then take your choice.
Suggested solutions (if a dash of water removes the squeal) range from
roughing up the tensioner wheel with a bit of emery paper to replacing the
engine.

Have fun!<g>

Derry
(Who has developed occupational deafness)
 
Short term, buy stop stop squeak belt spray.
Long term, get the tensioner wheel changed.
Regards
S
"McBad" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi, my 300tdi is squealing from somewhere in the area of the belt that
> runs
> round the fan and water pump and alternator, etc. It's been doing it for
> a
> couple of months and it doesn't seem to be getting much worse, but all the
> same it's a vile noise.
>
> Should I worry? Any way to fix it? I'm wondering if it could be the belt
> itself and am tempted to run water onto the running belt and see if that
> changes the noise...
>
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Cheers,
>
> M.
>
>


 

"McBad" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi, my 300tdi is squealing from somewhere in the area of the belt that
runs
> round the fan and water pump and alternator, etc. It's been doing it for
a
> couple of months and it doesn't seem to be getting much worse, but all the
> same it's a vile noise.
>
> Should I worry? Any way to fix it? I'm wondering if it could be the belt
> itself and am tempted to run water onto the running belt and see if that
> changes the noise...
>
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Cheers,
>
> M.
>
>

Give the belt a quick squirt of WD40 or similar, if the squeal stops it's
the belt. If it doesn't then it's something being turned by the belt. I've
seen a belt tensioner bearing collapse completely after the squealing has
been ignored for a few months!

Andy Fox
110 V8

 
Pardon the intrusion, but I would use a drop of water; does same job and
does not rot the belt ( WD40 is a solvent)



> Give the belt a quick squirt of WD40 or similar, if the squeal stops it's
> the belt. If it doesn't then it's something being turned by the belt. I've
> seen a belt tensioner bearing collapse completely after the squealing has
> been ignored for a few months!


 

"Hirsty's" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Pardon the intrusion, but I would use a drop of water; does same job and
> does not rot the belt ( WD40 is a solvent)
>
>
>
> > Give the belt a quick squirt of WD40 or similar, if the squeal stops
it's
> > the belt. If it doesn't then it's something being turned by the belt.
I've
> > seen a belt tensioner bearing collapse completely after the squealing
has
> > been ignored for a few months!
>


I've never had any problems with WD40 (well, Castrol DWF actually), only a
short blast and if it stops the noise it soon comes back as the spray dries
off.

It's not a fix, just a means of locaating the fault.

If I've refilled a motor with water and spilt any on the belts it normally
makes them squeal until they've dried out - never tried a drop though. The
other problem with WD40 and similar is a fire risk if you squirt the hot
exhaust, so water is probably a better idea!

Andy

 
Very Very common problem with the 300TDi

The tensioner part no ERR4708 has a very small plastic bush/collar between
the two halves that over time begins to wear uneavenly due to the pressure
exerted by the belt. This allows the two halves to no longer run parrallel
allowing the belt to slightly track out. Once this begins to happen the belt
and pully begin to act like a stylus and record cuasing the squeal. This is
why short term fixes like water, wd40, changing belt direction or replacing
the belt only last for a short period.

Very badly worn tensioners will allow the plastic collar/bush to split and
stick out like fine hairs at the top side of the tensioner.

Swap it, It will cure the problem.

Alternativly by ear muffs.........


Brian Tonks
Tonks4x4
27-29 Main Street
Huthwaite
Sutton-In-Ashfield
Nottinghamshire
NG17 2LD
01623 452885

http://www.tonks4x4.com



 
On or around Wed, 31 Aug 2005 07:12:01 GMT, "Brian Tonks"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Very Very common problem with the 300TDi
>
>The tensioner part no ERR4708 has a very small plastic bush/collar between
>the two halves that over time begins to wear uneavenly due to the pressure
>exerted by the belt. This allows the two halves to no longer run parrallel
>allowing the belt to slightly track out. Once this begins to happen the belt
>and pully begin to act like a stylus and record cuasing the squeal. This is
>why short term fixes like water, wd40, changing belt direction or replacing
>the belt only last for a short period.

however, ours squeaks despite a new tensioner. Tensioner bearings can also
fail, as happened to ours. The squeak on this one is provisionally defined
as being down to a non-genuine belt. At some point, we'll try a genuine
belt on it.

>Swap it, It will cure the problem.

see above...:-/
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"My centre is giving way, my right is in retreat; situation excellent.
I shall attack. - Marshal Foch (1851 - 1929)
 

"Brian Tonks" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Very Very common problem with the 300TDi
>
> The tensioner part no ERR4708 has a very small plastic bush/collar between
> the two halves that over time begins to wear uneavenly due to the pressure
> exerted by the belt. This allows the two halves to no longer run parrallel
> allowing the belt to slightly track out. Once this begins to happen the
> belt
> and pully begin to act like a stylus and record cuasing the squeal. This
> is
> why short term fixes like water, wd40, changing belt direction or
> replacing
> the belt only last for a short period.
>
> Very badly worn tensioners will allow the plastic collar/bush to split and
> stick out like fine hairs at the top side of the tensioner.
>
> Swap it, It will cure the problem.
>
> Alternativly by ear muffs.........

The squeel on mine was from the air con belt being pulled over the idler
which had collapsed its bearings and siezed. New idler and belt cured this
one.

Peter.


 
Thanks all.

I've just been outside with the watering can, and dribbling it onto the
running belt brought instant silence. Wonderful. However, a couple of
minutes later when the water had dried off the noise returned.

I'm going to cross my fingers on this one and hope it will last another
couple of thousand miles; off up to Scotland on Friday and I haven't got
time to do much about it before then. Will have a look at it when we're
back - pretty sure I saw an article in LROI about how to change that
tensioner about a year ago and it didn't look like too bad a job... I'll go
through my back issues...

thanks again,

M.


 

"McBad" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Thanks all.
>
> I've just been outside with the watering can, and dribbling it onto the
> running belt brought instant silence. Wonderful. However, a couple of
> minutes later when the water had dried off the noise returned.
>
> I'm going to cross my fingers on this one and hope it will last another
> couple of thousand miles; off up to Scotland on Friday and I haven't got
> time to do much about it before then. Will have a look at it when we're
> back - pretty sure I saw an article in LROI about how to change that
> tensioner about a year ago and it didn't look like too bad a job... I'll
> go
> through my back issues...
>
> thanks again,
>
> M.
>
>
It's easy to change, just one bolt and it comes off. Just make sure the
tension is off it beforehand, it has one mean spring.

Peter.


 
so Pete S was, like...
> "McBad" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> > It's easy to change, just one bolt and it comes off. Just make sure
> the tension is off it beforehand, it has one mean spring.
>
> Peter.

Related question:

I recently did the cambelt and changed the serp belt as a precaution (it
wasn't squeaking, more a mechanical-sounding chatter from the front of the
engine). While it was off I noticed the tensioner was running out of
parallel as Brian describes above, so I ordered a new one of those as well.
The noise has gone, but the new belt (<2000 miles) has started to
deteriorate, with black rubber bits that you can rub off with a finger (on
the flat side of the belt) and the white fibres starting to show through.
Nothing obvious to cause it - everything seems to be running in line and the
tensioner and idler wheel are smooth. Funny thing is, the original belt was
in perfect nick when I took it off. It's now in the back as a spare, which
I feel I may need fairly soon! The belt was a Britpart. Has anyone else
had this? Any ideas?

And yes, the tensioner is a piece of cake to change, once the belt's off.
And the belt's easy to get off once you've got a 15mm socket and a long bar
to release the tensioner.


--
Rich
==============================
Disco 300 Tdi auto
S2a 88" SW
Tiggrr (V8 trialler)


 
"Pete S" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

>> The tensioner part no ERR4708 has a very small plastic bush/collar
>> between the two halves that over time begins to wear uneavenly due to
>> the pressure exerted by the belt. This allows the two halves to no
>> longer run parrallel allowing the belt to slightly track out. Once
>> this begins to happen the belt
>> and pully begin to act like a stylus and record cuasing the squeal.

That sounds logical. The most acceptable explanation (to me) for the squeal
is that it is caused by vibration. Like that produced by the bow across the
strings of the violin. This suggestion was given to me by a technician
working for a large belt manufacturer who likened it to a finger being
drawn down a damp window pane.

If belt and tensioner are slightly out of alignment due to wear in that
plastic bush/collar you mention, the belt could be sliding sideways (to a
very small degree) across the tensioner as it rotates as it is not ribbed
like the other pulleys to keep it in line. Have I got that right?

But does that mean the tensioner is about to fail? I would have thought the
bearing would still be good for many thousands of miles as the squeal does
not originate from the bearing but from the infinitesimal sideways movement
of belt across the surface of the tensioner. Indeed, the squeal seems to be
a characteristic of nearly all 300Tdi's I have listened to and most owners
just ignore it (as I have done on mine for the last 12,000 miles) without
any problems.

So, where exactly does the squeak originate from (on most 300's)? Belt on
tensioner or from the tensioner bearing itself? My money is on the first in
which case there is little danger of the tensioner failing.

Derry
 
McBad wrote:
> Thanks all.
>
> I've just been outside with the watering can, and dribbling it onto the
> running belt brought instant silence. Wonderful. However, a couple of
> minutes later when the water had dried off the noise returned.
>
>

Try a can of "belt dressing" - works on the steering pump belt on my 101.

Steve
 

"Derry Argue" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Pete S" <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
> >> The tensioner part no ERR4708 has a very small plastic bush/collar
> >> between the two halves that over time begins to wear uneavenly due to
> >> the pressure exerted by the belt. This allows the two halves to no
> >> longer run parrallel allowing the belt to slightly track out. Once
> >> this begins to happen the belt
> >> and pully begin to act like a stylus and record cuasing the squeal.
>
> That sounds logical. The most acceptable explanation (to me) for the
squeal
> is that it is caused by vibration. Like that produced by the bow across
the
> strings of the violin. This suggestion was given to me by a technician
> working for a large belt manufacturer who likened it to a finger being
> drawn down a damp window pane.
>
> If belt and tensioner are slightly out of alignment due to wear in that
> plastic bush/collar you mention, the belt could be sliding sideways (to a
> very small degree) across the tensioner as it rotates as it is not ribbed
> like the other pulleys to keep it in line. Have I got that right?
>
> But does that mean the tensioner is about to fail? I would have thought
the
> bearing would still be good for many thousands of miles as the squeal does
> not originate from the bearing but from the infinitesimal sideways
movement
> of belt across the surface of the tensioner. Indeed, the squeal seems to
be
> a characteristic of nearly all 300Tdi's I have listened to and most owners
> just ignore it (as I have done on mine for the last 12,000 miles) without
> any problems.
>
> So, where exactly does the squeak originate from (on most 300's)? Belt on
> tensioner or from the tensioner bearing itself? My money is on the first
in
> which case there is little danger of the tensioner failing.
>
> Derry

Seeing pouring water onto the belt caused my squeal to instantly vanish my
money is with yours, on the belt / tensioner interface rather than on the
tensioner bearing.

Cheers,

M.


 
On or around 31 Aug 2005 22:22:17 GMT, Derry Argue <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>So, where exactly does the squeak originate from (on most 300's)? Belt on
>tensioner or from the tensioner bearing itself? My money is on the first in
>which case there is little danger of the tensioner failing.

we had a tensioner bearing fail, which makes a different noise. Meanwhile,
ours didn't squeak until the belt was replaced with a non-genuine one. Yet
to try a genuine belt to see if that makes it quieter.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"Nessun maggior dolore che ricordarsi del tempo felice nella miseria"
- Dante Alighieri (1265 - 1321) from Divina Commedia 'Inferno'
 
"Nessun maggior dolore che ricordarsi del tempo felice nella miseria."

There is no greater sorrow than to recall happy times in the midst of
misery.

Jeez Austin, that's depressing!

DaveP

 

>
> I recently did the cambelt and changed the serp belt as a precaution
(it
> wasn't squeaking, more a mechanical-sounding chatter from the front
of the
> engine). While it was off I noticed the tensioner was running out
of
> parallel as Brian describes above, so I ordered a new one of those
as well.
> The noise has gone, but the new belt (<2000 miles) has started to
> deteriorate, with black rubber bits that you can rub off with a
finger (on
> the flat side of the belt) and the white fibres starting to show
through.
> Nothing obvious to cause it - everything seems to be running in line
and the
> tensioner and idler wheel are smooth. Funny thing is, the original
belt was
> in perfect nick when I took it off. It's now in the back as a
spare, which
> I feel I may need fairly soon! The belt was a Britpart. Has anyone
else
> had this? Any ideas?

Yes, I had a belt stripping fibres from the radiator edge which I also
chose to ignore, after
around eight hundred miles some sections of the top layer of fabric
detached shortly followed by the
first/outer groove of the belt which whipped around the engine bay
shredding the soundproofing
and puncturing an oil cooler feed pipe but did stop it squeaking for
the next 50 miles until
it finished emptying the sump !
This was a new belt (Dayco ?) lasted about 3 weeks, looks like the
tensioner bearing had collapsed
at the radiator end. Fixed with new tensioner, new belt but same old
squeak.

ChrisG
Def 110 300tdi '96




>
> And yes, the tensioner is a piece of cake to change, once the belt's
off.
> And the belt's easy to get off once you've got a 15mm socket and a
long bar
> to release the tensioner.
>
>
> --
> Rich
> ==============================
> Disco 300 Tdi auto
> S2a 88" SW
> Tiggrr (V8 trialler)
>
>



 
so ChrisG was, like...
>> I recently did the cambelt and changed the serp belt as a precaution
>> (it wasn't squeaking, more a mechanical-sounding chatter from the
>> front of the engine). While it was off I noticed the tensioner was
>> running out of parallel as Brian describes above, so I ordered a new
>> one of those as well. The noise has gone, but the new belt (<2000
>> miles) has started to deteriorate, with black rubber bits that you
>> can rub off with a finger (on the flat side of the belt) and the
>> white fibres starting to show through. Nothing obvious to cause it -
>> everything seems to be running in line and the tensioner and idler
>> wheel are smooth. Funny thing is, the original belt was in perfect
>> nick when I took it off. It's now in the back as a spare, which I
>> feel I may need fairly soon! The belt was a Britpart. Has anyone
>> else had this? Any ideas?
>
> Yes, I had a belt stripping fibres from the radiator edge which I also
> chose to ignore, after
> around eight hundred miles some sections of the top layer of fabric
> detached shortly followed by the
> first/outer groove of the belt which whipped around the engine bay
> shredding the soundproofing
> and puncturing an oil cooler feed pipe but did stop it squeaking for
> the next 50 miles until
> it finished emptying the sump !
> This was a new belt (Dayco ?) lasted about 3 weeks, looks like the
> tensioner bearing had collapsed
> at the radiator end. Fixed with new tensioner, new belt but same old
> squeak.
>
> ChrisG
> Def 110 300tdi '96

Beamends supplied the belt, and Richard is sending me another one as he
reckons the Britpart one is faulty - he's never heard of it happening
before. We shall see...

Thanks Richard, BTW.


--
Rich
==============================
Disco 300 Tdi auto
S2a 88" SW
Tiggrr (V8 trialler)


 
Another instance of belts tracking out. I came accross a gentleman broke
down at the end of a dual carriage way near Rainworth. I stopped to see if I
could lend a hand to find that the belt had tracked out and gone behind his
water pump pulley.

Results were that it ripped the water pump pulley and spindle out of the
front of the water pump.

I have also seen similar situations but with the power steering pump.

Brian Tonks



"Richard Brookman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> so ChrisG was, like...
> >> I recently did the cambelt and changed the serp belt as a precaution
> >> (it wasn't squeaking, more a mechanical-sounding chatter from the
> >> front of the engine). While it was off I noticed the tensioner was
> >> running out of parallel as Brian describes above, so I ordered a new
> >> one of those as well. The noise has gone, but the new belt (<2000
> >> miles) has started to deteriorate, with black rubber bits that you
> >> can rub off with a finger (on the flat side of the belt) and the
> >> white fibres starting to show through. Nothing obvious to cause it -
> >> everything seems to be running in line and the tensioner and idler
> >> wheel are smooth. Funny thing is, the original belt was in perfect
> >> nick when I took it off. It's now in the back as a spare, which I
> >> feel I may need fairly soon! The belt was a Britpart. Has anyone
> >> else had this? Any ideas?
> >
> > Yes, I had a belt stripping fibres from the radiator edge which I also
> > chose to ignore, after
> > around eight hundred miles some sections of the top layer of fabric
> > detached shortly followed by the
> > first/outer groove of the belt which whipped around the engine bay
> > shredding the soundproofing
> > and puncturing an oil cooler feed pipe but did stop it squeaking for
> > the next 50 miles until
> > it finished emptying the sump !
> > This was a new belt (Dayco ?) lasted about 3 weeks, looks like the
> > tensioner bearing had collapsed
> > at the radiator end. Fixed with new tensioner, new belt but same old
> > squeak.
> >
> > ChrisG
> > Def 110 300tdi '96
>
> Beamends supplied the belt, and Richard is sending me another one as he
> reckons the Britpart one is faulty - he's never heard of it happening
> before. We shall see...
>
> Thanks Richard, BTW.
>
>
> --
> Rich
> ==============================
> Disco 300 Tdi auto
> S2a 88" SW
> Tiggrr (V8 trialler)
>
>


 
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