Range Rover fuel pipe renewal help

Has anybody replaced the long rigid fuel pipes along the chassis (1988
lucas 4cu efi flapper type) if so What do you need to know, LR repair
manual has diagram of fuel lines running along top of right hand chassis
rails and sod all else, they look pretty hard to get at and no mention
of any bits of body etc which might need removing first to gain access.
Some other part of the manual says to drop fuel tank to get pipes off
from fuel pump, but I have heard it suggested it is easier to cut a hole
in the load bay floor, but again the manual fails to even notice the
existance of a load bay floor, and what a surprise Haynes follows suit.

I was thinking of getting one of the aftermarket copper pipe kits, did
this for the brakes and it was pretty damn good, so with main fuel pipes
leaking, only a bit of a wet patch so far, I need to replace, I have
noticed that dealer/garage repairs generally use stiff but flexible
plastic pipe as a replacement tie wrapped to chassis, is that because
replacing with an OEM rigid metal one is too damn difficult?

thanks for any help or info

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"Warwick Barnes" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Has anybody replaced the long rigid fuel pipes along the chassis (1988
> lucas 4cu efi flapper type) if so What do you need to know, LR repair
> manual has diagram of fuel lines running along top of right hand chassis
> rails and sod all else, they look pretty hard to get at and no mention
> of any bits of body etc which might need removing first to gain access.
> Some other part of the manual says to drop fuel tank to get pipes off
> from fuel pump, but I have heard it suggested it is easier to cut a hole
> in the load bay floor, but again the manual fails to even notice the
> existance of a load bay floor, and what a surprise Haynes follows suit.

Dunno if it will help but a 1990 Diesel Rangie has a access pannel to get to
the pipes at the top of the tank. Just lift the carpet by remobing the tabs
on the tailgate. The remove the carpet and then roll away the rubber
undermat. It it's there then bobs your uncle.. May be simpler to buy some P
clips and relocate the new pipe work.

Lee D

Warwick Barnes wrote:
> Has anybody replaced the long rigid fuel pipes along the chassis (1988
> lucas 4cu efi flapper type) if so What do you need to know, LR repair
> manual has diagram of fuel lines running along top of right hand chassis
> rails and sod all else, they look pretty hard to get at and no mention
> of any bits of body etc which might need removing first to gain access.
> Some other part of the manual says to drop fuel tank to get pipes off
> from fuel pump, but I have heard it suggested it is easier to cut a hole
> in the load bay floor, but again the manual fails to even notice the
> existance of a load bay floor, and what a surprise Haynes follows suit.
>
> I was thinking of getting one of the aftermarket copper pipe kits, did
> this for the brakes and it was pretty damn good, so with main fuel pipes
> leaking, only a bit of a wet patch so far, I need to replace, I have
> noticed that dealer/garage repairs generally use stiff but flexible
> plastic pipe as a replacement tie wrapped to chassis, is that because
> replacing with an OEM rigid metal one is too damn difficult?
>
> thanks for any help or info
>

The rigid fuel lines on my 1988 RRC are looking a little flakey too. I
was wondering about stainless steel braid protected flexible fuel lines
as an easy replacement.

Fuel tank is (relatively) easy to remove:

(In no particular order)

Drain as much fuel as poss via the drain plug - towards the front IIRC.

Disconnect a rats nest of pipes - rigid to flexible joined by rusted
solid Jubilee clips. And the fuel filter.

Disconect fuel filler pipe.

Lower ARB if fitted.

Disconnect (or break) fuel sender plug and split fuel pump loom connector.

The tank is held in by 2 nuts on a pair of captive bolts by the bumper
and two larger rubber buffer nuts/bolts at the front edge.

I persuaded my brother to lie under the tank and support it with his
hands and chest. It's not too heavy!

Undo the 4 nuts and bolts and drop, sorry lower, tank onto brother.

Do your worst and reverse everything you did to get it out. Replace all
the pipe connectors with proper fuel line clamps of teh right size and
consider, unlike me, replacing any rigid pipework to the fuel pump.
I've no idea why it is not all flexible pipe.

BOL Richard







--


Reply to RJSavage at Bigfoot dot com

When the rigid steel lines on my '87 RR fell apart I went to B&Q and bought
a roll of central heating 'microbore'? copper pipe. It's the same OD as the
steel lines. After removing the rotten steel lines, I fed the copper in
from the front - 'cos it's quite bendy, I was able to bend it around the
various contortions without problem. At the rear, I just connected the feed
line to the outlet of the fuel filter with a length of rubbery fuel tube
and two jubilee clips. The return line was connected to the tank in a
similar manner. At the front, I did the same to the pipes that run up the
bulkhead (These bits of the steel pipes were in good nick (Presumably due
to the engine heat preventing rot). IIRC the whole thing cost less than £20
and took an afternoon to do.

I've heard (can't remember where) that you shouldn't use copper for fuel
lines, 'cos petrol can leach things that become deposits in the fuel
system. All I can say is that It's been on for over three years and I've
not had a problem...

I reused some of the original fuel line clips, and for those that broke, I
used cable ties to secure the pipes.

It's also passed 3 MOT's without comment. (From a garage that knows LR
vehicles well).

If you were to try to replace the lines with the formed steel ones - good
luck! I think they were attached to the chassis *before* the body was
fitted.

For me, it's bendy copper, all the way!

Regards,

Horse

The message <[email protected]>
from horse <[email protected]> contains these words:

>.....
> I've heard (can't remember where) that you shouldn't use copper for fuel
> lines, 'cos petrol can leach things that become deposits in the fuel
> system. All I can say is that It's been on for over three years and I've
> not had a problem...
.....
> I reused some of the original fuel line clips, and for those that broke, I
> used cable ties to secure the pipes.

....
> If you were to try to replace the lines with the formed steel ones - good
> luck! I think they were attached to the chassis *before* the body was
> fitted.

> For me, it's bendy copper, all the way!

Thanks for info.

We just got the kit from Automec on an overnight, 3 copper pipes 3
metres of rubber pipe and 20 stainless jubelee clips, so I guess copper
is O.K. We reckoned the same as you, removing the body is likely to be
the only way to fit OEM.
Usefull tip on microbore anyway, and a hell of a lot cheaper, but we had
good results with their brake pipe kit so heres hoping.

--
If you received this through the miracle of modern technology then all
is well; if not then situation normal.
Chris father of ( also at [email protected] )
www.users.zetnet.co.uk/barnes_firsnorton

In news:[email protected],
Warwick Barnes <[email protected]> blithered:
> The message <[email protected]>
> from horse <[email protected]> contains these words:
>
>> .....
>> I've heard (can't remember where) that you shouldn't use copper for
>> fuel lines, 'cos petrol can leach things that become deposits in the
>> fuel system. All I can say is that It's been on for over three years
>> and I've not had a problem...
> ....
>> I reused some of the original fuel line clips, and for those that
>> broke, I used cable ties to secure the pipes.
>
> ...
>> If you were to try to replace the lines with the formed steel ones -
>> good luck! I think they were attached to the chassis *before* the
>> body was fitted.
>
>> For me, it's bendy copper, all the way!
>
> Thanks for info.
>
> We just got the kit from Automec on an overnight, 3 copper pipes 3
> metres of rubber pipe and 20 stainless jubelee clips, so I guess
> copper is O.K. We reckoned the same as you, removing the body is
> likely to be the only way to fit OEM.
> Usefull tip on microbore anyway, and a hell of a lot cheaper, but we
> had good results with their brake pipe kit so heres hoping.

You are totally sure it is copper pipe and not copper plated steel pipe?

--
UR SHGb02+14 &ICMFP
If at first you don't succeed,
maybe skydiving's not for you!

On or around Thu, 16 Sep 2004 18:39:19 +0100, Warwick Barnes
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>The message <[email protected]>
>from horse <[email protected]> contains these words:

>> For me, it's bendy copper, all the way!
>
>Thanks for info.
>


local Citroen bloke supplies replacement suspension pipes using cunifer
rather than steel as the steel ones are next-to-impossible to fit.

beware of vibration in copper work-hardening it, also try not to bend it too
much for the same reason. I susepct this is why most places don't use plain
copper for brake pipes any more.

The message <[email protected]>
from "GbH" <[email protected]> contains these words:


> >
> > We just got the kit from Automec on an overnight, 3 copper pipes 3
> > metres of rubber pipe and 20 stainless jubelee clips, so I guess
> > copper is O.K. We reckoned the same as you, removing the body is
> > likely to be the only way to fit OEM.
> > Usefull tip on microbore anyway, and a hell of a lot cheaper, but we
> > had good results with their brake pipe kit so heres hoping.

> You are totally sure it is copper pipe and not copper plated steel pipe?

well it certainly looks like copper, and we could bend it by hand with a
bit of effort. It came fitted with nicely made ends for the rubber hose
but all the pipes were too long. the ones from the engine along the
chassis to the tank were about 6 to 10 inches too long and losing this
excess was a real pain, turned a relatively easy job into a bit of a
nightmare. Over the phone, when ordering, we were assured of only one
size for late eighties RRs, but the manual shows clearly different
routing for efi and carburettor models, efi run along the drivers side
chassis (UK RHD) whilst carburettor models run along the near side (left
side of the vehicle). We are now wondering if this is where the extra
pipe is needed. The alternative was to cut a lump off but having paid
quite a lot for pipes with formed ends we were reluctant to do this
especially as you then wonder how well the rubber connnecting pipe will
hang on there.

Anyway we got them in, and the engine sounds really good so we reckon
there has been pressure loss for some time. There were 3 leaks in the
send pipe and 2 in the return when we got them out although all we tiny
no spray of fuel just a gentle ooze!

Final points we took the rear floor pan out in the end, as we had
noticed some rot, 38 pop rivets to drill out after lifting the carpets
and removing the sealer strips -more pop rivets.
The cross struts (like series top hat sections under buck) needed
attention so we cleaned and cure rusted these, have temporarilly bolted
floor pan back in with 4 SS bolts so we can get it out to paint it. We
do not even want to contemplate doing the job without removing the floor
pan and losing the extra pipe by means of a few pig tail bends would
have been nigh on impossible from underneath.

BUT the engine positively purrs!

--
If you received this through the miracle of modern technology then all
is well; if not then situation normal.
Chris father of ( also at [email protected] )
www.users.zetnet.co.uk/barnes_firsnorton