110CSW clutch problems

I have looked through past postings and found a number of clutch
related problems, that are similar, but not quite the same as the one
that I have.

This is a diesel (19J) 110CSW 1990.

Earlier on this week I had a phone call from my wife (who was about to
drive the car), who said that there was no clutch action and described
the clutch pedal action as "floppy".

That evening I checked the fluid (very low) and topped it up. Now the
the clutch "bite" position has returned but has moved to just off the
floor!

I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks. None obvious.
I have checked the piping (including the flexible pipe) all sound and
no ballooning. I have bled it through and there is no air. (Mind you
when releasing the bleed nipple on the slave, with no pressure on the
pedal the fluid pours out!)

There is no evidence of clutch slip.

I assume that a seal has gone? Probably in the slave cylinder?

Or have I got it totally wrong?

Any thoughts/suggestions.

Cheers

Peter

>I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks

How did you check the slave cylinder for leaks? Did you take it out?

The only real way to tell is to remove the cylinder from the bell
housing, unless the leak is so back that it is pooring out the wading
plug hole.

--
Marc Draper

Marc Draper wrote:
> >I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks
>
> How did you check the slave cylinder for leaks? Did you take it out?
>
> The only real way to tell is to remove the cylinder from the bell
> housing, unless the leak is so back that it is pooring out the wading
> plug hole.
>
> --
> Marc Draper
No, I only looked at the pipework/bleed nipple area.

What's involved in removing it and what spares should I have to hand?
(To reduce the time its off the road to as short as possible) Are
there items that should be replaced anyway?

I remember reading in a previous thread that getting the operating
shaft back in again can be fun! Is that right, or am I confusing this
with something else?

Cheers

Peter

In message <[email protected]>
"puffernutter" <[email protected]> wrote:

> I have looked through past postings and found a number of clutch
> related problems, that are similar, but not quite the same as the one
> that I have.
>
> This is a diesel (19J) 110CSW 1990.
>
> Earlier on this week I had a phone call from my wife (who was about to
> drive the car), who said that there was no clutch action and described
> the clutch pedal action as "floppy".
>
> That evening I checked the fluid (very low) and topped it up. Now the
> the clutch "bite" position has returned but has moved to just off the
> floor!
>
> I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks. None obvious.
> I have checked the piping (including the flexible pipe) all sound and
> no ballooning. I have bled it through and there is no air. (Mind you
> when releasing the bleed nipple on the slave, with no pressure on the
> pedal the fluid pours out!)
>
> There is no evidence of clutch slip.
>
> I assume that a seal has gone? Probably in the slave cylinder?
>
> Or have I got it totally wrong?
>
> Any thoughts/suggestions.
>
> Cheers
>
> Peter
>

It sounds as though you ran out of fluid and have now got air in the
system as you have surmised - is the bleed nipple on the top of the
slave cyclinder, or the bottom. Some fit it with the nipple at the
bottom as "it's easier to bleed" - but it isn't, is practically
impossible!

If the clutch works ok, but the bite is near floor as you describe
then it most likely that there is still air in there rather than anything
having failed - does it "pump up"?

If you are really sure there is no air, then the next likely suspect
is that the slave cyclinder seal has failed - but you'd expect the
inside of the boot to be "wet".

Richard
--
www.beamends-lrspares.co.uk [email protected]
Running a business in a Microsoft free environment - it can be done
Powered by Risc-OS - you won't get a virus from us!!
Boycott the Yorkshire Dales - No Play, No Pay

On or around 2 Feb 2006 01:05:12 -0800, "puffernutter"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>I have looked through past postings and found a number of clutch
>related problems, that are similar, but not quite the same as the one
>that I have.
>
>This is a diesel (19J) 110CSW 1990.
>
>Earlier on this week I had a phone call from my wife (who was about to
>drive the car), who said that there was no clutch action and described
>the clutch pedal action as "floppy".
>
>That evening I checked the fluid (very low) and topped it up. Now the
>the clutch "bite" position has returned but has moved to just off the
>floor!
>
>I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks. None obvious.
> I have checked the piping (including the flexible pipe) all sound and
>no ballooning. I have bled it through and there is no air. (Mind you
>when releasing the bleed nipple on the slave, with no pressure on the
>pedal the fluid pours out!)

ISTR that they can be a bastard to bleed. pressure bleed works better than
gravity or pumping it.
--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that
"'Tis a mad world, my masters" John Taylor (1580-1633) Western Voyage, 1

In message <[email protected]>,
puffernutter <[email protected]> writes
>
>Marc Draper wrote:
>> >I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks
>>
>> How did you check the slave cylinder for leaks? Did you take it out?
>>
>> The only real way to tell is to remove the cylinder from the bell
>> housing, unless the leak is so back that it is pooring out the wading
>> plug hole.
>>
>> --
>> Marc Draper
>No, I only looked at the pipework/bleed nipple area.
>
>What's involved in removing it and what spares should I have to hand?
>(To reduce the time its off the road to as short as possible) Are
>there items that should be replaced anyway?
>
>I remember reading in a previous thread that getting the operating
>shaft back in again can be fun! Is that right, or am I confusing this
>with something else?
>
>Cheers
>
>Peter
>


All pretty straight forward 2 bolts to remove cylinder. Although it is
just above the exhaust pipe on your model which makes it slightly
harder.

Re positioning of rod should never be hard even if the clip is broken,
some people just make a meal of it.
--
Marc Draper

"Marc Draper" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In message <[email protected]>,
> puffernutter <[email protected]> writes
>>
>>Marc Draper wrote:
>>> >I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks
>>>
>>> How did you check the slave cylinder for leaks? Did you take it out?
>>>
>>> The only real way to tell is to remove the cylinder from the bell
>>> housing, unless the leak is so back that it is pooring out the wading
>>> plug hole.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Marc Draper
>>No, I only looked at the pipework/bleed nipple area.
>>
>>What's involved in removing it and what spares should I have to hand?
>>(To reduce the time its off the road to as short as possible) Are
>>there items that should be replaced anyway?
>>
>>I remember reading in a previous thread that getting the operating
>>shaft back in again can be fun! Is that right, or am I confusing this
>>with something else?
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>Peter
>>
>
>
> All pretty straight forward 2 bolts to remove cylinder. Although it is
> just above the exhaust pipe on your model which makes it slightly harder.
>
> Re positioning of rod should never be hard even if the clip is broken,
> some people just make a meal of it.
> --
> Marc Draper

But do remember to put the new one in with the bleed nipple pointing
skywards ;-)

FWIW, every time this happened to me (on 3), the main cylinder failed
shortly afterwards, so if I ever have to do it again, I'll just replace both
at the same time and save all the faffing around bleeding the bleeding
things!

Rob wrote:

> FWIW, every time this happened to me (on 3), the main cylinder failed
> shortly afterwards, so if I ever have to do it again, I'll just replace both
> at the same time and save all the faffing around bleeding the bleeding
> things!

Unless a customer is dead broke I always replace both as a matter of
course - there seems to me to be little point in putting a brand new
slave cylinder onto a master cylinfer that's full of assorted detritus
that's worn off the seals in the now defunct old slave cylinder.


--
EMB

"MVP" <mr.nice@*nospam*softhome.net> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On 2 Feb 2006 01:05:12 -0800, "puffernutter"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I have looked through past postings and found a number of clutch
>>related problems, that are similar, but not quite the same as the one
>>that I have.
>>
>>This is a diesel (19J) 110CSW 1990.
>>
>>Earlier on this week I had a phone call from my wife (who was about to
>>drive the car), who said that there was no clutch action and described
>>the clutch pedal action as "floppy".
>>
>>That evening I checked the fluid (very low) and topped it up. Now the
>>the clutch "bite" position has returned but has moved to just off the
>>floor!
>>
>>I have checked the master and slave cylinders for leaks. None obvious.
>> I have checked the piping (including the flexible pipe) all sound and
>>no ballooning. I have bled it through and there is no air. (Mind you
>>when releasing the bleed nipple on the slave, with no pressure on the
>>pedal the fluid pours out!)
>>
>>There is no evidence of clutch slip.
>>
>>I assume that a seal has gone? Probably in the slave cylinder?
>>
>>Or have I got it totally wrong?
>>
>>Any thoughts/suggestions.
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>Peter
>
> As others have said, you've lost fluid somewhere and now have air in
> the system. If you can's see any leaks it's likely the seals in the
> slave that have leaked.
> if i recall correctly replacing the clutch slave is easy enough.
> remove hydrolic line,
> undo 2 bolts (or was it nuts?)
> remove old slave,
> insert new slave with rod going through the hole into the cylinder.
> fit with bleed nipple uppermost.
> tighten bolts (nuts?)
> fit and tighten hydrolic line.
>
> easiest to bleed with a pressure system (if you happen to be in east
> cornwall youcan borrom mine).
>
> if the exhaust is in the same place as on the 12J do it with the
> engine cold as your wrists will be meeting the exhaust pipe, not good
> if it's hot.
>
> --
> Mark.

The clutch slave cylinder failed completely on my 110 turbo while I was at
work and it was spending the day in the car park. No previous sign of any
trouble but while standing it just dumped the fluid into the bell housing.
Access is very tight by the exhaust pipe - which did make me wonder if the
proximity to all that heat might have had something to do with it.

Nick Webster