Water in Sump...

Hi,

After a reasonably trouble free day at the Thames Valley 4x4 club's off road track yesterday, I managed to get my series stuck in a rather deep bomb hole, which was full of water...

When we got it out again (thanks to the marshalls) about 10 mins later it wouldn't stay running, on further investigation it looks like the sump is completely full of water - it's about 4 inches over the top of the dipstick with grey emulsion...

Any ideas how the hell it all got in there? The only place I can see it would get in is through the bottom of the dipstick tube - but I think there's a good couple of litres in there and I wouldn't have thought that much would get in that quick... Is there anywhere else I should be looking at to seal up to stop it happening again?

Cheers

Jon

=jon= said:

Any ideas how the hell it all got in there? The only place I can see it would get in is through the bottom of the dipstick tube - but I think there's a good couple of litres in there and I wouldn't have thought that much would get in that quick... Is there anywhere else I should be looking at to seal up to stop it happening again?

Cheers

Jon

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So it was not running in the deep water then?

As for stopping it from happening again I find wellies and a long stick works very well

It was running while I was trying to extract myself from said bomb hole, then ticking over OK while I was waiting. I think the fan sprayed water over the electrics (it's a petrol BTW), then it died and it wouldn't start again... The water wasn't deep enough for it to have got into the intake - I ended up at about 45degrees nose down into the bombhole, water level was about from the bottom of the headlights back to just below the door sills.

As for wellies and a long stick - I sent my better half to go see how deep it was. She said not that deep... Next time I think I'm going to send her in with waders on to check properly

about this deep...

=jon= said:

It was running while I was trying to extract myself from said bomb hole, then ticking over OK while I was waiting. I think the fan sprayed water over the electrics (it's a petrol BTW), then it died and it wouldn't start again... The water wasn't deep enough for it to have got into the intake - .

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Wasn't sure if it had died in the water and got water back up the exhaust but nose down and engine running that wouldn't happen.

=jon= said:

I ended up at about 45degrees nose down into the bombhole, water level was about from the bottom of the headlights back to just below the door sills.
As for wellies and a long stick - I sent my better half to go see how deep it was. She said not that deep... Next time I think I'm going to send her in with waders on to check properly

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Hmm not that deep then really.........

The fan spraying water everywhere wouldn't help as you say.

=jon= said:

Any ideas how the hell it all got in there? The only place I can see it would get in is through the bottom of the dipstick tube - but I think there's a good couple of litres in there and I wouldn't have thought that much would get in that quick... Is there anywhere else I should be looking at to seal up to stop it happening again?

Cheers

Jon

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I would think if there was a vacuum in your sump, it would suck in water very quickly through your dipstick tube. But dont know for sure how likely that is

I'll double check the seal on the dipstick tube when I have a look at it later on...

Well, looks like it's not got in through the dipstick, but the front crank seal looks to be weeping - as suggested the only thing we can think of is that there's been a vacuum in the sump and it's pulled water past the seal.

Drained approx 12 litres of sludge out, filled it back up with oil and got it running again, but it doesn't look like I've got any oil pressure and it really doesn't sound healthy - it's knocking very loudly on anything other than tickover...

I'll whip the sump off tomorrow and check the damage in more detail, but I think it's time to look for a second hand engine

=jon= said:

Well, looks like it's not got in through the dipstick, but the front crank seal looks to be weeping - as suggested the only thing we can think of is that there's been a vacuum in the sump and it's pulled water past the seal.

Drained approx 12 litres of sludge out, filled it back up with oil and got it running again, but it doesn't look like I've got any oil pressure and it really doesn't sound healthy - it's knocking very loudly on anything other than tickover...

I'll whip the sump off tomorrow and check the damage in more detail, but I think it's time to look for a second hand engine

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Trouble is you will possibly have water in the oil ways, not sure how best to get rid of it but possibly a flush and a couple of oil changes ( an I dont mean 6000 miles apart either ) may help.

Bromsgrove Defender said:

Trouble is you will possibly have water in the oil ways, not sure how best to get rid of it but possibly a flush and a couple of oil changes ( an I dont mean 6000 miles apart either ) may help.

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I think it's a bit more terminal than that The filter was full of emulsion too, so it's definitely been pumped round the system - and from the sounds of the knocking I'd say it's dropped more than a couple of bearings

If the old engine requires any sort of machine work (crank polish etc) it's going to get more expensive than a second hand engine from ebay, so I think that's the best way...

I just have to resist the urge to v8 it now

bit odd this....int that deep......have you got a modded engine breather pipe or something?

Sorry to hear about the engine....but all might not be lost, if you still got a fair amount of sludge in it will sound like a bag of bolts.
Did you use flushing oil?.......several times?

blue beasty said:

bit odd this....int that deep......have you got a modded engine breather pipe or something?

Sorry to hear about the engine....but all might not be lost, if you still got a fair amount of sludge in it will sound like a bag of bolts.
Did you use flushing oil?.......several times?

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I've just drained the oil, flushed it through with some white spirit and refilled - main problem I can see is that as there doesn't appear to be any oil pressure the oil's not getting round to clean the crap out (and lube stuff that needs to be). I might try starting it up again in a bit see if it's any better after the oil pickup being soaked in oil for a day or so...

As far as I can tell the engine's standard, but I've not owned it long and I'm still working out what's what to be honest (Sunday was my first day out in it offoad :doh - but it looks to have had a bit of a chequered past - there's been a lot of bodging done on it... The breather goes from the top of the rocker cover to the air inlet as expected...

Hi jon

with a snorkel fitted i have had my s11a swb when fitted with a 2.25p engine up to the steering wheel in water with no probs, it sounds like most of the seals and gaskets on your engine have allowed water in and won't do the engine any good as it may need a full strip down to at least clean it out.

=jon= said:

I've just drained the oil, flushed it through with some white spirit and refilled - main problem I can see is that as there doesn't appear to be any oil pressure the oil's not getting round to clean the crap out (and lube stuff that needs to be). I might try starting it up again in a bit see if it's any better after the oil pickup being soaked in oil for a day or so...

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Personally i would remove the sump, rocker cover and oil filter to clean every thing and blow an air line down the oilways. Then fill with thin oil to run it for a few miles then drain it out and replace with fresh oil. Good luck!

might be worth taking the opil pressure switch off which could be clogged and giving it a clean , if you take the sump off then you can look at the big end and main bearings easily