P38A Fixed the sub woofer now need door speaker help please

Following on from my non working subwoofer, now fixed and working, I've moved on to fixing the no sound from 2nd row door speakers.
I have the HK system and now know that I have amps in each door and 3 speakers, tweeter and one big speaker(bass?) and a smaller speaker(mid range?, please correct me if I'm wrong!)
The mid range speakers all work but poor sound as the paper is torn. Both rear bass speakers have excellent cones but the coils are duff testing with a 9v battery. All the amps are good, I've spent all morning swopping bits between all 4 doors and the results are I need
2 off bass speakers and
4 off mid range speakers.
I can't find the post now but I read someone fitting aftermarket door speakers, whether that was just the large bass speakers or the mid range or even both.

This is what I've got, factory head unit too.

I am sure you have already done it but I had major issues with my HK door stuff, although I had cut and soldered the larger white connector behind the LH kick panel I hadn't done the smaller one which feeds the outstation. After soldering all was a-ok

cornishboater said:

I am sure you have already done it but I had major issues with my HK door stuff, although I had cut and soldered the larger white connector behind the LH kick panel I hadn't done the smaller one which feeds the outstation. After soldering all was a-ok

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Yes, done all them. I've got one door where everything worked so I just used those known good speakers and fitted them in each door in turn.
Every door worked great so I know the wiring and amps are fine in every door and it's just the speakers I need to replace.
Testing the coils on the bass speakers confirmed 2 are dead and 2 are good. All 4 midrange speakers work but the membranes are split and ripped.

I'm really surprised the coils are dead.. maybe crap hardware to start with

Good info here: https://www.stockholmviews.com/p38/index.html#audio

I need to do the tweeters in mine as well !!

pwood999 said:

Good info here: https://www.stockholmviews.com/p38/index.html#audio

I need to do the tweeters in mine as well !!

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I can't do links but I've been looking at 'p38 range rover speaker upgrade' comes up on a goggle search.
Apparently visaton frs7 full range 4 ohms mid range speakers are the ones he used and pleased with them too. Involves making a tin adapter plate, easy enough but added faff, to mount them. Forget how much £5 odd each if you buy 4 plus vat, £9.99 p&p, all comes to £38.82. Found new membranes (63mm) for the mids but from China, no UK stock that I can find, forget how much they were, 4 quid each rings a bell, free p&p but no glue with them. Looks fiddly but doable.

@pwood999 found the thread mentioning door speakers which I thought in my foggy memory was someone using the cheap amazon sub speakers in their doors. Turned out it was you lol!
What bass door speakers did you go with? Are they the same as the sub woofer speakers? Pyle PLG 64 is what mountiemike fitted in his sub.

kermit_rr said:

I'm really surprised the coils are dead.. maybe crap hardware to start with

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Wonder if I manual lift the coil up (with something) it'll free off? I could easily lift the centre cone on the sub speakers but these are solid.

In a working speaker you should be able to gently press the cone in and out will spring back..
It could be corroded inside.. i thought you meant the actual coil was open loop

No, I've got circa 4 ohms resistance but no movement when flashing it with a 9v battery. Can't push the cone down on the 2 duff ones but can on the 2 good ones.

In that case, either the magnet is corroded and locking the cone in place, or the coil varnish is cooked (too much excessive volume) and binding in the magnet.

Best thing is to bite the bullet and replace with modern poly cone speakers. They are also more tolerant to damp, unlike the old paper cones.

Just replace the speakers with new ones of the same ohms value and same diameter, they are cheap enough so not worth messing round IMO.

I'm happy to buy new ones I just need an adult to point me in the right direction of which ones to buy .
I 'think' they are 4 ohms, no idea of watts and whatnot . Nervous of getting some that are under powered or too deep to fit or some other woe

Flossie said:

I'm happy to buy new ones I just need an adult to point me in the right direction of which ones to buy .
I 'think' they are 4 ohms, no idea of watts and whatnot . Nervous of getting some that are under powered or too deep to fit or some other woe

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Speakers usually have the power handling (watts) marked on them but, if not you'll need to find out the amps output in rms watts, forget maximum power of the speakers, that bears no resemblance to the rms figure which will need to matched as close as possible to the amps output but, Not under a bit over is fine, the impedance (ohms) bit you already know.
How are the existing speakers fitted in the mountings? if you can get some the same size you should be able to mount them ok in the housings (mountings), depth of the new speakers is important too, you don't want them to foul on anything in the door HTH.

You can use pretty much any 6.5" bass drivers for the doors. I used these Pyle bass drivers in mine.

For the midrange, something like these coaxial (if your ears are old),, or these non coaxial. The yellow ones will be louder for the same audio level at 88db/W versus 83db/W for the coaxial unit.

The coaxial tweeter will help clarifty in the rear doors. They will also be fine for the fronts.

aj1954 said:

Speakers usually have the power handling (watts) marked on them but, if not you'll need to find out the amps output in rms watts, forget maximum power of the speakers, that bears no resemblance to the rms figure which will need to matched as close as possible to the amps output but, Not under a bit over is fine, the impedance (ohms) bit you already know.
How are the existing speakers fitted in the mountings? if you can get some the same size you should be able to mount them ok in the housings (mountings), depth of the new speakers is important too, you don't want them to foul on anything in the door HTH.

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Yeah..I sort of get all that, that's why I'm asking the question, there are no markings on any of the original speakers and I can't find the spec of these HK speakers anywhere. I have found ......- HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!!. PWOOD999 has replied whilst I was typing and showing the world, or the landyzone world anyway, my extreme lack of ice knowledge .
And he's put pics and stuff to save my sanity hopefully. Off to read the post , back in a bit...

pwood999 said:

You can use pretty much any 6.5" bass drivers for the doors. I used these Pyle bass drivers in mine.

For the midrange, something like these coaxial (if your ears are old),, or these non coaxial. The yellow ones will be louder for the same audio level at 88db/W versus 83db/W for the coaxial unit.

The coaxial tweeter will help clarifty in the rear doors. They will also be fine for the fronts.

View attachment 314400View attachment 314399

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Brilliant! Thanks.
That's the 2 bass ones sorted!
I have fitting concerns about the mid range ones you've linked to though. Have you actually fitted those mid range ones to yours or is it the output spec etc is suitable?
One is 3 1/2" the other is 4", the original is only 2 1/2". Pic of the door card below showing no way to easily mount those larger ones unless I glue them in or something?

Hopefully I've done a link?
This guy has used 2 1/2" visaton FRS7 for his midrange, they are slightly smaller in the frame mounting so some simple adapter plates need knocking up, that's not a problem, means the speaker grill can be reused and even the terminal configuration is the same.
Farnalls do them at a good price so unless someone slaps me I'll ring them tomorrow to check stock and availability and if OK will buy 4 of them and 2 of the Pyle for the bass.
Fit the 2 Pyle in the front doors, original in the rear doors and replace all 4 midrange with the visaton. Leave the tweeters original as they all work for now.

Whatever fits will be fine. As far as power handling, most modern 4ohm speakers will work.

You can pretty much ignore the advertised 300W type ratings, because (1) they would probably melt with that much real power, and (2) the HK amps are probably 25W RMS anyway !!

For the geeks, the amps run on 12V. The output could either be regular Class-A, B or C, or possibly bridge amps. For regular class A, B & C the maximum peak-peak swing will be about 10.5V, which gives 10.5x10.5/4 = 27Watts (peak not RMS). If they are bridge amp design, then it's potentially possible to get around 20V swing or 100W peak power, which implies 4 times the power but it would only be a small bit louder !!