H

HAD51

New Member
I have a 1999 DHSE with 93k on the clock. I have just had it serviced and all seemed in order with just minor faults.
The problem I am having is before I arrived at the garage my Rangie was taking forever to start...you guessed it arrived at the garage everything was ok:D ...picked it up everything seemed fine and yet again, guess what?:mad: ...a couple of days later the problem reared its ugly head again!
It has been mentioned by a couple of others that I may have a battery or starter motor problem but I cant see this being the case as my Rangie does turn over without hesitation, it just seems to take for ages!
I suspect it may be a fuel pump problem...Can anyone shed any light on this matter:confused: ...I would be grateful for any suggestions, all the best!
 
From what you've described the problem is most likely to be the glow plugs. Get a decent set and changing them shouldn't take more than 30-40 mins.

You didn't mention if it was a hot/cold starting problem, or if it makes any difference how long you've left the car between starts. Sometimes the injectors leak on these bmw engines and can cause starting problems, but would need to know more info from you first.

Matt.
 
Cheers Matt for getting in touch.

I have recently had a major service carried out by a trusted Independent specialist who I did make aware of the problem but as I stated earlier he checked for faults on testbook and none were apparent.

I turned my Rangie over whilst at the garage and she seemed fine, as soon as I left...yep, you guessed it!

With regards to starting problems hot or cold, it does`nt matter. She is taking around 30 secs or so regardless, even when I nip in the shops for a loaf of bread!

I dont have to jump start her and know of no faults being displayed on the instrument panel.

I hope this helps Matt and would like to take this oppurtunity for your help, thanks.

Daz.
 
Hiya all, just for reference...I have just tested my battery with a voltmeter and it`s registering at 12.8v which leads me to assume that the battery is not causing me this problem, therefore if the battery is at a charged state I can only also assume the alternator is operating as it should?
 
Yes, I'd assume your charging system is fine. The message display tells you if there is a fault with the alternator circuit.

I'd say it was most likely one or more your glow plugs have died, or not working very well. It is quite common.

Matt
 
Sounds like it might be worth replacing the leak off pipes,the little braided rubber pipes that run between the injectors and then back to the top of the injector pump.When they get old,they perish and crack - allowing air to be drawn back into the pump.They rarely leak much fuel,they just are moist to the touch.Find another Independant - looking for a poor starting fault on a diagnostic computer is a waste of time,and probably your money.The Bosch Edc Ecu is very good for fault codes for running faults or non start issues,but not overly clever for poor starting.Basic legwork watching for bubbles in the pump feed pipe from the filterhead,proper diagnosis of the glowplugs and cranking speed etc are much more likely to sort your problem.Trouble is there are lots of people buying diagnostic kit thinking that what it tells them is the answer to all their problems - it is not !!
 
Cheers eightinavee!...As always everyones suggestions help!

I think I have made some progress as to diagnosing this problem?

I have tested the battery, alternator and glow plugs and all seem in order.

There is one thing after all the testing, fiddling and soul searching that I have noticed this morning...Having only had the vehicle for a matter of weeks I have just been to fuel her up and blimey!, she turned over and started instantly and continues to do so (Fingers crossed!).

As eightinavee has stated I am swayed towards his theory that this problem can only be something to do with the fuel system, as to why this is happening...I have no idea, so if anyone else out there has encountered this same fault please let me know.

As always you have all been a great help and I more than appreciate it... thankyou.
 
I had a similar fault on a BMW 525TDS (same engine) it was a leaking injector. The symptoms of that are that if the engine has been left for a while it takes sometimes ages to build up the fuel pressure, but will start ok if it has only been left for an hour or so - you don't mention whether that is a symptom or not. It also depended on whether the car was pointing up or downhill! If it was pointing up hill I could rarely get it to start, if it was pointing downhill it would start better! I know others with the same problem who have experienced this also!

Like eight says, the pipes are also prone to leaking and can cause similar problems, but are a lot cheaper to replace than an injector so might be worth doing them first!

Otherwise, if you find it works better with a full tank than an empty tank it could be your fuel pump.

Matt.
 
Cheers Matt,

Gonna have to get the beers in for this one!

I first suspected the fuel system and after checking everything else I feel I am left without any other diagnosis than just that.

Regarding your comment about whether this happens when the vehicle has been left standing for some time, it was a dog to get going all of the time (Hot and cold) but as I have stated now the fuel tank is full it starts with ease first time, every time (Keep going back to check...probably end up with a flat battery after all!).

I will check all the pipes and check the fuel set up in general and hopefully by replacing the relevant parts I will rectify what the problem is. I will let you know how I get on...as always, thanks.

Daz.
 
HAD51 said:
Cheers Matt,

Gonna have to get the beers in for this one!

I first suspected the fuel system and after checking everything else I feel I am left without any other diagnosis than just that.

Regarding your comment about whether this happens when the vehicle has been left standing for some time, it was a dog to get going all of the time (Hot and cold) but as I have stated now the fuel tank is full it starts with ease first time, every time (Keep going back to check...probably end up with a flat battery after all!).

I will check all the pipes and check the fuel set up in general and hopefully by replacing the relevant parts I will rectify what the problem is. I will let you know how I get on...as always, thanks.

Daz.
Click to expand...
You just reminded me what caused this on a dse a couple of yrs ago,the car had a pin hole in the top of the in tank pump.when the fuel level was low the injector pump would pull a tiny amount of air in.Poor starting and gutless ! I repaired it with a soldering iron no problem.Remember the electric pump in the tank only runs when cranking with a coolant temp less than 60c.If you can see any bubbles at all in that clear bit of pipe between the filterhead and the injector pump then you will have trouble.
 
Thanks eight,

Spoken to a mate of mine today and he has also suggested the same fault (In tank fuel pump).

Gonna sort it out as soon as possible, I will let you know how it goes.

Daz.
 
Hi folks...just been calling various parts companies etc, for my required in tank fuel pump/sender unit...£150-£160. Surely someone must know where I can obtain this item a few quid cheaper?...Thanks.
 
Try Island 4x4 (01795 580 332), they are normally pretty good, but I know that this part is not cheap!

Matt.
 
Hi Daz, been reading all about your problem. I've experienced exactly the same for the past week. I've got a P38 1997 with 150,000 miles. The problem originally started in Italy in November 05. It started up with a slight miss, then corrected itself.......until last week. It would run the battery down to its last ounce before it would start. The fuel was running back and you could see air bubbles in the pipe between the filter head and the pump. I removed the black plastic covers from top of engine and the injectors were slightly damp, more noticeable on no. 4. Replaced all the leak off pipes and it improved it slightly. Washed it off with a degreaser and pressure washer, ran it around for about 6 miles, looked in the top again, no.4 was wet. It is a sensor injector with electric wires going into it and a bit of plastic on it. Luckily for me we have Key Diesels in Burton upon Trent (good friend:D ). Borrowed special socket to remove that injector, tested it with pressure kit, and hey presto a leak between the plastic and the metal. Fitted new injector, all problems cured :D Double check yours before you lash out on a new pump and going to the trouble of taking tank off. Good luck, Phil
 
Hello phil, ive got the exact same problem as you had. Ive changed the leak off pipes, checked for split/leaks in the fuel lines,change fuel filter etc...
Mine is a bastard to start in the morning, wont even fire with easy start...then the battery runs down, leave it for 30 mins to allow the battery to recover and then it will start but only after its wound its self over.
Everyone tells me to fit a non return valve in the fuel line, but even after the engine has been running/warmed up its still not a very good starter and i cant see how the fuel can run back with 5-10 mins after switch off.
Can you tell me if it helped having a non return valve fitted?
dave.
 
HAD51 said:
Cheers Matt,

Gonna have to get the beers in for this one!

I first suspected the fuel system and after checking everything else I feel I am left without any other diagnosis than just that.

Regarding your comment about whether this happens when the vehicle has been left standing for some time, it was a dog to get going all of the time (Hot and cold) but as I have stated now the fuel tank is full it starts with ease first time, every time (Keep going back to check...probably end up with a flat battery after all!).

I will check all the pipes and check the fuel set up in general and hopefully by replacing the relevant parts I will rectify what the problem is. I will let you know how I get on...as always, thanks.

Daz.
Click to expand...


You've just stated what happens when your in-tank fuel pump starts to pack up.

If you've got more than about a quarter of a tankful the pressure from the weight of the fuel pushes it up the line to the injector pump and away you go. With little fuel on board, and a weak pump, you're having to wait for fuel to be drawn from the tank to get the engine started.

See if there's fuel being pumped up the line whilst cranking.
 
HAD51 said:
Hi folks...just been calling various parts companies etc, for my required in tank fuel pump/sender unit...£150-£160. Surely someone must know where I can obtain this item a few quid cheaper?...Thanks.
Click to expand...

Island 4x4 - just short of £50 + postage. Canyon did a post with photos on cutting a hatch to access the pump to save removing the tank. My 1999 DHSE is the same and I think I am going to go thro the floor rather than take the tank out.
 
Last edited:
DaveGil said:
Hello phil, ive got the exact same problem as you had. Ive changed the leak off pipes, checked for split/leaks in the fuel lines,change fuel filter etc...
Mine is a bastard to start in the morning, wont even fire with easy start...then the battery runs down, leave it for 30 mins to allow the battery to recover and then it will start but only after its wound its self over.
Everyone tells me to fit a non return valve in the fuel line, but even after the engine has been running/warmed up its still not a very good starter and i cant see how the fuel can run back with 5-10 mins after switch off.
Can you tell me if it helped having a non return valve fitted?
dave.
Click to expand...

Worth checking the glowplugs before you go too far down the road with the pump. You can check the in tank pump by dropping the filter or removing the inlet pipe, and with a suitable container to hand, get someone to turn on the ignition, you should get a burst of fuel.:D
 
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