[mjltigger]

yeah that'll be the way.. unless the old bill take measurements at the scene (which they wont do unless there is someone hurt enough to potentially be a death) there is no way that speed can be proven in court.. therefore the insurance co will stick speed up as the reason for the accident but only to get the other insurance company to agree to 50/50.. it'd never go to court.. it's a bugger but it's not about right or wrong any more it's about what the cost benefits of fighting the claim are.. most of the insurance companies costs aren't reclaimable from the other side so they will calculate that it is cheaper to pay 1/2 the claim than to fight your corner.

You could try employing your own solicitor to represent you and force the insurance company to fight it but you probably wont get those costs back either even if you win.. and proving speed after the vehicles have been moved is impossible.. meaning you might not even win...

i had a similar thing when i was hit by a taxi driver probably doing 50mph+ in a 30 zone.. I was in the middle of the road turning right but he claimed i pulled out from the side of the road... I even had the police statement o say where the vehicles ended up but because they didn't measure up none of it was useful and it was my word against his...

in the end my insurance company settled with me for negligence (because they forgot to tell me about a court date that I was supposed to attend) after they settled with the other insurer 50/50.. but it took over 2 years and was a headache I could have done without.. all the while I was paying higher insurance anyway because the accident was on record and I didn't get any of that back...

My advice is to let your own insurance company deal with it and put up with what they say.. it smarts but it's the least stressful way round it and you wont get any more by fighting unfortunately.. the other driver also wont get punished any more by a full fault than a 50/50 so nothing to be gained..

 

[lil-landy]

The point is though, with me only being 17. My insurance premiums are high enough as it is! A 50/50 punishes me even more!

 

[mjltigger]

ouch.. in that case you need to push your insurance company a bit harder then.. tough call that because believe me you DO NOT need the stress of having to fight an insurance company.. they make the rules up as they go along and then change them if you find a way round it.. and because of the relationships they have with the courts when it comes to deciding liability they pretty much write all the case law...

 

[boydy1989]

you should be able to persuade your insurers to take hers to court - take measurements on the road of the oil stains if nothing else, get everyone who saw it, even the kiddies nicking the sweets outta the dash to write down what they think happened.

my dad had a crash a few years ago, drove into the back of someone (long story but ti wasn't his fault)

18 months later, he insisted on it not being his fault, and it went to court. He won, got his money back.

Who you insured with?

 

[lil-landy]

Insured with Norwich Union, soon to be Aviva of course

Insurance says that the oil stains won't stand up in a court of law.

 

[mjltigger]

Insured with Norwich Union, soon to be Aviva of course

there's your first mistake..

Insurance says that the oil stains won't stand up in a court of law.

too late for you.. but for anyone else.. stay in your car, wait for the police, get an ambulance.. the more hurt you seem the more likely the police are to take measurements.. this is NOT about scamming for injuries you don't have it is about the police measuring up for speed calculations which can ONLY be done with the cars in place... and nobody else can or will do them.. certainly don't exchange details or discuss anything with the other driver until the police arrive.

have your insurers said they will push for 50:50 or are they suggesting they will take the hit?

Don't forget that even if you did force it to go to court (and I think that is unlikely) there is a chance that the judge will say it is partly your fault for pulling out.. regardless of the speed of the other driver.. in my case I was turning right, indicating and braking.. the guy ignored my indicators and came past me as I started my turn.. my solicitor (not the insurance company) told me that the judge would likely apportion between 10 and 20% of the blame to me for not seeing him make the move... regardless of his speed and the fact that I was completely within my rights to turn.. had I spotted him being a burk I could have prevented his stupidity from causing an accident... now if you are 10% to blame, you still have an at fault accident on your record and you will still lose your no claims unless you pay back the 10% of the total claim (both vehicles and all injuries, ambulance costs and the council's charges for putting the road back)

unless you can get the police on your side at the scene and get the insurance company to request a police report very very soon you wont get anywhere.. and unless the police report states the other driver was probably speeding then it's not going to get you anywhere..

sorry if my own bitter experience is shining through here but having been through it myself and fought a losing battle for 2 years you need to make sure you are prepared for what a fight will take out of you.

 

[lil-landy]

Hmm, I'm trying to figure out whether it will affect insurance too much. Seeing as being 17 I have no NCB anyway.

I think I'm just gonna let it ride out, the situations screwed up enough as it is. Me being blamed for something even the insurers are saying isn't my fault, but we just can't proove it.

 

[mjltigger]

like I said.. it isn't (unfortunately) about right or wrong.. it's about what you can and can't prove.. she can prove you went past a give way sign, you can't prove she was going too fast.. it's a bitch and someone needs to come up with a better solution but I aint got a clue what that is.. unless we all have black box recording in our motors.. and i don't like the idea of that

 

[lil-landy]

Ahh a lot of people would be very annoyed at black box recording. Wouldn't bother me Don't like speeding myself, too easy for me to get my license taken off me for the next 2 years as it is anyway, without pushing the envelope.

And I didn't go past a give way sign, there were none at the junction. its an implied give way.

 

[Dirty Gertie]

Well, we've seen the damage to your Landy; what about the Corsa? Surely the amount of damage to it will allude (at least partially) to what kind of speed was involved: What was the speed limit? Bearing in mind that you say it was coming out of school time, lots of kids about etc, this could very easily have been a multiple fatality; push the plod to make some kind of statement to your insurance about the speed the Corsa driver was doing and dig in your heels!!!!

 

[mjltigger]

If you had the police to the scene and the copper was seeming to be 'on your side' then go back to him / her and ask for help, they are pretty good about it but only if you are quick.. also ask your insurance company to get a statement through official channels if poss.. they wont do it off their own back because police accident reports (if they ever get filed) in cases like this are very slim on detail..

by the way this is how I go the money out of my own insurers.... they didn't do that even though in my statement on the claim I mentioned that the pc at the scene had indicated fault lay clearly with the other driver due to the road position of the vehicles - mine was in the middle of the road and his was 100 odd yards down the road across a high kerb and buried in a lamp post... which it had hit hard enough to knock over...

 

[lil-landy]

Didn't say it was near school time did I? It was 1050 on a Sunday morning!

And theres no way to proove they were speeding, so no chance of prooving it to the other insurance company. Thats why they're trying to get a 50/50.

 

[mad mechanic]

push the insuance company mate..they will do as little as possible i had a similar accident when was 17 in my dads granada..a guy hit me at what the plod estimated was 60mph in a 30 zone in wombwell but as it was raining they couldnt measure it..they wrote his sierra off and my dads granny was repaired by me..it took me 3 years to clear y name and i got all my excess insurance payments back and the guy who was driving the sierra had already been banned by the time it came to court..i used one of those solicitor companies that fight on your behalf and he insuarance company have to pay them by law..they also get you a courtesy car which makes the insurance company hurry up as at around 30 quid a day for a hire car it soon adds up..btw i still suffer with aching limbs..and mine was 20 years ago..lol

 

[oil dripper]

corsa drivers am all blind bastids,fooker hit me in the side awhile back while i was parked up at the time,mine come out of it better than yours thou,his corsa was fooked

 

[Dirty Gertie]

Didn't say it was near school time did I? It was 1050 on a Sunday morning!

And theres no way to proove they were speeding, so no chance of prooving it to the other insurance company. Thats why they're trying to get a 50/50.

Ah, sorry, you just said lots of kids around, same diff; good enough reason for the plod to pursue the other driver for excess speed.
There may be no way to 'prove' speeding, but you did state that she approached very fast; the damage to both vehicles WILL indicate the speed at the time of impact, as I said before, get the plod to make a declaration as to their opinion of this, as it will carry more weight than your opinion.
Rememember the balance of probability does not require absolute 'proof'

 

[lil-landy]

Got myself a bit o good news today!

Loss adjusters been around, and he said he stopped counting repair damage at somewhere around £30,000 (stealership prices, eh?) and asked me what I paid for it.

Me being me, decided to say £18,000 (thats what I insured it for). He says that thats the kind of price you'd pay for one with 30,000 miles according to his books, but because its got 37,700 I should be looking at around £16,000.

How 7,700 miles knocks £2,000 off I don't know. But, £16,000 is still nearly 3 times what I paid for the lady. Hell, I might get an off-roader and an on-road landy with this and still have money for insurance left over!

Unfortunately, the car is whats known as a category C or something, I can't buy it back, a salvage dealer can't buy it. Apparently its at the stage where it has to be crushed. Sorry guys.

 

[Optimus Prime]

Category A
A vehicle which should have been totally crushed, including all its spare parts.

Category B
A vehicle from which spare parts may be salvaged, but the bodyshell should have been crushed and the car should never return to the road.

Category C
An extensively damaged vehicle which the insurer has decided not to repair, but which could be repaired and returned to the road.

Category D
A damaged vehicle which the insurer has decided not to repair, but which could be repaired and returned to the road.

Category F
A vehicle damaged by fire, which the insurer has decided not to repair.

Theft
These vehicles have not been recovered and ownership rests with the insurer who made the total loss payment. They are able to repossess the car as soon as it is identified, even if it has been bought innocently.

Vehicles categorised as A, B or C require a VIC test before the DVLA will issue a new registration document. This will then be noted on the V5C.

 

[iannotts]

yes you can buy it back!!! mine was a cat b and still got it back

 

[Optimus Prime]

Got myself a bit o good news today!

Loss adjusters been around, and he said he stopped counting repair damage at somewhere around £30,000 (stealership prices, eh?) and asked me what I paid for it.

Me being me, decided to say £18,000 (thats what I insured it for). He says that thats the kind of price you'd pay for one with 30,000 miles according to his books, but because its got 37,700 I should be looking at around £16,000.

How 7,700 miles knocks £2,000 off I don't know. But, £16,000 is still nearly 3 times what I paid for the lady. Hell, I might get an off-roader and an on-road landy with this and still have money for insurance left over!

Unfortunately, the car is whats known as a category C or something, I can't buy it back, a salvage dealer can't buy it. Apparently its at the stage where it has to be crushed. Sorry guys.

You need to scour land rover dealer websites, ebay, auto trader, exchange and mart, local rags etc to find vehicles advertised which support your claim for the higher figure. Ignore the ones that are lower, just concentrate on those above the figure you are looking for. Don't accept their offer, just because it's way above what you paid for it. They happily took your money on the basis it was £18k's worth of land rover !

And how were you lucky enough to get the land rover for such a low sum in the first place ?

 

[iannotts]

oh and only paid £25 for it