[B16FUN]

Morning all,
Yesterday I replaced the pressure head seal, mid section seal and top cover seal on my wife's P38 diesel's FIP.
Built it all back up and it refuses to start.
So my first thought was that whilst I was doing the pressure head seal the shim has dropped so I need to remove the fip to sort it out and as such I've ordered the special tool for removing it.
I thought as it's a dry day today I'd get it stripped ready for the tool arriving but at first I thought I'd just make sure the pump was bled up.
Took the return pipe off the pump, switched on the ignition and.... nothing.
Took the feed pipe off from the inlet side of the pump, turned the ignition on and.... nothing.
Tried turning the engine over as well and still no fuel.
I've checked and everything is connected as it should be, there are no warnings on the dash, so I'm a bit lost.
The car was running fine apart from the leak from the FIP so I find it a bit strange if the in tank pump has decided its had enough with no warnings or tell tale signs that it was on it's way out.
Is there something I'm missing?
Cheers,
Andy.

 

[wammers]

Lift pump will only run when glow lamp is lit. To check lift pump remove relay 12 and push a wire into terminal 5, the one that is opposite in orientation to the other three. Touch other end of wire to positive battery terminal, pump should run. Did you follow the correct procedure for replacing the pressure head seal. Setting pump on full cam first? Before releasing bolts just enough to replace O'ring. You cannot just take off centre section of pump and slap it back on. It has to be precisely placed. Put back exactly where it came from. When you have fuel and have bled injectors slacken centre section slightly and tap it for and aft until engine starts. Then tap it fore and aft until you get a rock steady 750 RPM at idle. Then torque up. It may take some time to get right.

 

[B16FUN]

Morning Wammers, thanks for your reply and in answer, yes, I followed the procedure for doing the pressure head seal by putting the pump on full cam lift before loosening the bolts just enough to gain access to the o-ring. I have also replaced the centre section seal and the top cover seal in the past so I know about setting the idle and the take off speed (for want of a better description). However, it's the lack of fuel at all at the moment that is throwing me. I will test the in tank pump using the method you have described and go from there. Thanks for your reply, Andy.

 

[wammers]

Morning Wammers, thanks for your reply and in answer, yes, I followed the procedure for doing the pressure head seal by putting the pump on full cam lift before loosening the bolts just enough to gain access to the o-ring. I have also replaced the centre section seal and the top cover seal in the past so I know about setting the idle and the take off speed (for want of a better description). However, it's the lack of fuel at all at the moment that is throwing me. I will test the in tank pump using the method you have described and go from there. Thanks for your reply, Andy.

You can use the wire from positive to terminal 5 trick to run the pump whilst cranking and you have injectors cracked to bleed them. Makes life a bit easier if you do it that way, so you don't have to keep recycling the glow lamp to get it running. If the lift pump is working and you still get no fuel at injectors maybe it has for some reason gone out of sync. If ECU and BECM have lost sync you can crank it until Christmas and it won't start.

 

[B16FUN]

Cheers for that Wammers. I tried the live to terminal 5 of relay 12 and nothing. So, I've just pulled the tank out, removed the in tank pump and put a live a neutral to the two pins on the pump itself (purple and brown wires) and.... nothing.
So I'm going to order an in tank pump.
It's just weird that it had no problems up until I parked the car two weeks ago when I started with the fip seals.
Ah well, the joys of P38 ownership, nothing should surprise me any more with this thing with all the work I've done.
Engine transplant from a BMW 325 tds, BECM replaced, ABS pump and solenoid block replaced, EAS pump replaced, all air bags replaced, dampers replaced, full polybush kit, front axle replaced, front calipers replaced, gearbox and torque converter full fluid and filter change, injectors reconditioned, brand new electronic injector, new oil cooler, retrimmed head lining, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on! I'm either mad or stupid!

 

[wammers]

Cheers for that Wammers. I tried the live to terminal 5 of relay 12 and nothing. So, I've just pulled the tank out, removed the in tank pump and put a live a neutral to the two pins on the pump itself (purple and brown wires) and.... nothing.
So I'm going to order an in tank pump.
It's just weird that it had no problems up until I parked the car two weeks ago when I started with the fip seals.
Ah well, the joys of P38 ownership, nothing should surprise me any more with this thing with all the work I've done.
Engine transplant from a BMW 325 tds, BECM replaced, ABS pump and solenoid block replaced, EAS pump replaced, all air bags replaced, dampers replaced, full polybush kit, front axle replaced, front calipers replaced, gearbox and torque converter full fluid and filter change, injectors reconditioned, brand new electronic injector, new oil cooler, retrimmed head lining, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on! I'm either mad or stupid!

Car will run without lift pump providing injection pump has fuel. When you get a new one in you may notice it has a bit more go. Specially on hills.

 

[Bix]

I noticed when my intank pump died it gace no warnings or hints. It was only when I dropped below a quater of a tank it started sucking air and instantly cut out.

Damn Land Rover and their silly designs.

 

[B16FUN]

With me having drained the FIP in order to do the seals I have nothing to be able to crank with. I'll keep the thread updated when I get the replacement.
Cheers,
Andy.

 

[B16FUN]

Well, new in tank pump done, fuel to the FIP, tried to start and it eventually fired. It was hunting like a bar steward and loads of black smoke so I thought I had put the top half of the pump back in the wrong position.
Backed it off and the car refused to start. Moved it to be in between the two positions I'd tried and it still refuses to start.
If the shim has dropped out whilst I was doing the pressure head seal I know the engine won't start, but will it start if the pump top half is adjusted to it's max and run the way mine did before?
If so I think I'll have to pull the pump off, joy.
Cheers,
Andy.

 

[Grrrrrr]

If the pump is tired and the top has been off it can be a sod. On my old one I eventually left the bolts not quite tight and tapped it minutely back and forth until I got 750 rpm.

 

[B16FUN]

I currently have nothing, it won't start.

 

[Grrrrrr]

If it won't start in the original position and there is fuel reaching it I don't like the sound of that.

 

[B16FUN]

Thats what makes me wonder if the shim has dropped out whilst doing the pressure head seal.

 

[wammers]

Thats what makes me wonder if the shim has dropped out whilst doing the pressure head seal.

Or you have not got the servo spigot back in the control collar.

 

[Grrrrrr]

Sorry. Beyond my ken. Dammers might have an idea. Sure you got the peg through the hole on the square thing when you put the pump top back?

 

[Grrrrrr]

Beat me to it.

 

[B16FUN]

Yep because when it first started but was hunting and black smoking it would rev up, just too eagerly, if that makes sense. It was like the pump was too far advanced so I backed it off, then got nothing so brought it back the other way a bit and again, nothing.

 

[wammers]

Yep because when it first started but was hunting and black smoking it would rev up, just too eagerly, if that makes sense. It was like the pump was too far advanced so I backed it off, then got nothing so brought it back the other way a bit and again, nothing.

The quantity servo has nothing to do with timing it controls the fuel injected. You need to move the centre section back and forth very small amounts until you get it running. Then very small amounts tapping back and forth until you get a rock steady 750 RPM. Or of course you could take the pump and get it calibrated.

 

[B16FUN]

Well, I know I got the peg in the hole originally. I'll be giving it another go next weekend. My main question was will the car run at all if the shim drops out whilst I was doing the pressure head seal? Specifically with the way it was doing for me earlier?
Cheers,
Andy.

 

[wammers]

Well, I know I got the peg in the hole originally. I'll be giving it another go next weekend. My main question was will the car run at all if the shim drops out whilst I was doing the pressure head seal? Specifically with the way it was doing for me earlier?
Cheers,
Andy.

The shim cannot drop out if you had the pump on full cam and did not let the pressure head come out any further than so you can just remove the O'ring, i would seriously doubt the engine would run if it was not there. The pump would be injecting well after TDC.