thebiglad
Well-Known Member
To be honest I can't see the point in a gutless 4.0ltr petrol that consumes juice at an absurd level like 12mpg - that's just daft!!
I've had BM V8's, not bad; Jaguar V8's, brilliant (25 to 33mpg!!! & 300bhp) - but the Rover dinosaur V8? Just rubbish. And yes I have driven one on and off-road and my various TD5's would beat it hollow. And deliver 30mpg.
You only have to look at the torque figures and where peak torque occurs to see that it is completely unsuitable for off-road work.
And if anyone starts on about modifying V8's to create a sensible amount of power, what about modifying TD5's, they are much easier and cheaper to get an extra chunk of thrust.
In a road car give me a V8 any time, in a 4x4 2.3ton lugger, I don't think so.
Dave
I've had BM V8's, not bad; Jaguar V8's, brilliant (25 to 33mpg!!! & 300bhp) - but the Rover dinosaur V8? Just rubbish. And yes I have driven one on and off-road and my various TD5's would beat it hollow. And deliver 30mpg.
You only have to look at the torque figures and where peak torque occurs to see that it is completely unsuitable for off-road work.
And if anyone starts on about modifying V8's to create a sensible amount of power, what about modifying TD5's, they are much easier and cheaper to get an extra chunk of thrust.
In a road car give me a V8 any time, in a 4x4 2.3ton lugger, I don't think so.
Dave
thebiglad
Well-Known Member
I have a 92 3.5 v8 manual, heavily modified, heavy aswell!
However my 350 mile weekend just gone averaged 11mpg, theirs 25 ish no doubt.
The MAIN DECIDING FACTOR is the cost. All the other reasons are just reasons but your wallet will not be told otherwise.
I just put £200 of fuel in my car and in jerry cans and used it all in a 2 day/350 mile laning weekend.
If you can't afford that sort of cash then avoid v8. There is the LPG option but IMO #### that **** it's not my scene.
If you don't use the car much like me and can justify the cost every once in a while then you have to consider the other options and decide what's best for you.
Petrol only runs on petrol out the pump. At pump prices.
Diesel runs on pump fuel, cherry, chip fat, engine oil, you name it itll burn it if you refine your fuels sufficiently. And that's VERY cheap motoring.
As a v8 lover my advice would be this.
And this is NOT GUESSWORK, this is advice from someone who has BEEN THERE.
Either get an early 94/95 low spec 300tdi diesel and forget about the v8 thing.
Or get a 90/91/92 disco 3.5 manual. You do not want a post 92 vehicle as then you have to have cats. You want an EFi disco not a carb motor.
on either vehicle you will need to sort out quite serious rust problems.
On the petrol, YOU THEN FIT MEGASQUIRT.
It's that simple. You will spend hours trying to get the stupid ####ing dizzy set up correctly, just get rid of it in the first place.
Trust me on this if I did it all again it would be my first mod.
The amount of money you save buying a v8 car in the first place pretty much covers the MS cost anyway.
And then you have the overall best setup with which to start your project on.
As long as you can afford the fuel
Mr Noisy, what an excellent, well-balanced and informed comment. Right on the money.
Dave
twinkal
New Member
I have a 92 3.5 v8 manual, heavily modified, heavy aswell!
Recently converted to Megasquirt, that's a god send, engine could do with a little bit more torque really considering the weight of the vehicle as it stands now (LOTS of off road kit, HD bumpers etc, spares and tools) but basically it does alright.
On a laning weekend with a load of diesels I find that I am noticeably slower than the diesels I I keep the revs low, mine makes no power to speak of under 2500rpm whereas theirs are running out at 2.5k
If I operate a gear lower than them then during the road section between lanes I am all over their arses and easily have the power to accelerate past, that's a 2.6 ton disco vs under 2 ton 90.
However my 350 mile weekend just gone averaged 11mpg, theirs 25 ish no doubt.
The v8 has lots of drama, lots of occasion, noise, power, drive ability, the want to be flat out, but it also has many worries, not once am I off the hook thinking is this going to explode, overheat, break down etc and that's running megadquirt, the dizzy engines are even more worrying, nevermind off road troubles with water which gets very annoying!
Needless to say the reliable (usually) diesel just plods, good power, solid tickover, never misfiring, nothing. The v8 might have a little slow tickover, a little fast, a little miss, a little flat spot, anything can happen, the diesel just put put puts forever and a day, rain, shine, wet, dry, hot, cold.
The thing that keeps me in v8 is that this is a play motor for me and diesel is not enough fun for play.
Diesel is for the everyday man (nobody can justify v8 everyday lets be honest!) or for the man who needs to be underwater, although mine is now waterproof running Megasquirt so it's not a problem anymore, whereas petrol is for the competition man who needs the power or the playtime guy who wants the noise and the drama.
The MAIN DECIDING FACTOR is the cost. All the other reasons are just reasons but your wallet will not be told otherwise.
I just put £200 of fuel in my car and in jerry cans and used it all in a 2 day/350 mile laning weekend.
If you can't afford that sort of cash then avoid v8. There is the LPG option but IMO #### that **** it's not my scene.
If you don't use the car much like me and can justify the cost every once in a while then you have to consider the other options and decide what's best for you.
Petrol only runs on petrol out the pump. At pump prices.
Diesel runs on pump fuel, cherry, chip fat, engine oil, you name it itll burn it if you refine your fuels sufficiently. And that's VERY cheap motoring.
As a v8 lover my advice would be this.
And this is NOT GUESSWORK, this is advice from someone who has BEEN THERE.
Either get an early 94/95 low spec 300tdi diesel and forget about the v8 thing.
Or get a 90/91/92 disco 3.5 manual. You do not want a post 92 vehicle as then you have to have cats. You want an EFi disco not a carb motor.
on either vehicle you will need to sort out quite serious rust problems.
On the petrol, YOU THEN FIT MEGASQUIRT.
It's that simple. You will spend hours trying to get the stupid ####ing dizzy set up correctly, just get rid of it in the first place.
Trust me on this if I did it all again it would be my first mod.
The amount of money you save buying a v8 car in the first place pretty much covers the MS cost anyway.
And then you have the overall best setup with which to start your project on.
As long as you can afford the fuel
Did you fit your own Megasquirt or get someone to fit it? How much would I be looking at for a Megasquirt kit?
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
Dave, you are right, it has to be said, td5 is the beast in the land rover armoury, much more power out of the box than a v8 and good economy too.
I would love a td5 90, that would be superb on and off road.
It still doesn't get around the problem that no matter how **** the v8s are, and trust me I tell people how **** they are, it's still not a v8 motor, and only the v8 engine solves that problem.
Td5 engine is an absolute beauty, and oh, tuned up, MATRON!
That does come at substantial cost though, the td5 is not a particularly low cost option but by Jove the performance makes it worthwhile.
I think it comes down to the fact that if you have that v8 affliction then you make do with the economy and awful awful awful bhp/litre figures simply be used it is what it is and no matter what anyone says you're always the coolest guy in the bunch when you rumble past another set of Landys on a lane when everyone else rattles past, and that is an undeniable pleasure!
If you don't suffer from the v8 illness then I think the td5 is the peak of the land rover diesels purely because of the way it goes!
I would love a td5 90, that would be superb on and off road.
It still doesn't get around the problem that no matter how **** the v8s are, and trust me I tell people how **** they are, it's still not a v8 motor, and only the v8 engine solves that problem.
Td5 engine is an absolute beauty, and oh, tuned up, MATRON!
That does come at substantial cost though, the td5 is not a particularly low cost option but by Jove the performance makes it worthwhile.
I think it comes down to the fact that if you have that v8 affliction then you make do with the economy and awful awful awful bhp/litre figures simply be used it is what it is and no matter what anyone says you're always the coolest guy in the bunch when you rumble past another set of Landys on a lane when everyone else rattles past, and that is an undeniable pleasure!
If you don't suffer from the v8 illness then I think the td5 is the peak of the land rover diesels purely because of the way it goes!
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
Hi dude
Have a look on Megasquirt for V8 engines - Welcome
Also have a look on LR4x4 in the Megasquirt section, I've got a HUGE thread on there which is pretty much a step by step guide from when I built my MS kit.
Which answers the next bit, yes I did fit it myself.
I'm a bit of a wiring boffin tbh and didn't find that part hard. In fact tbh the whole thing wasn't hard and you can follow my thread plus all the info Nige supplies and the immense help on LR4x4 MS forum.
If you are a wiring spaz and I know some guys just can't figure it out then you need to get a keen pal who can read a wiring diagram and make him your best buddy to help you with the job.
This will cost you lots of beer and pizza!
Kit price is around £900 but I managed to spend £1200 with various extras and add ons, but that was the most complete kit you could buy really, which made sense to me.
And don't get me wrong, it's ####ing brilliant, complete transformation and now waterproof too!
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
Not that I'm biased, but this is why I put up with the V8 downfalls:
Making it look easy at parkwood 4x4 in the V8 discovery - YouTube
That was pre-Megasquirt, post-Megasquirt you can wind up the timing top end and it really sings!
Making it look easy at parkwood 4x4 in the V8 discovery - YouTube
That was pre-Megasquirt, post-Megasquirt you can wind up the timing top end and it really sings!
discool
Well-Known Member
I would Land Rover ever sell a vehicle that only did 12mpg ??.
My light weight TVR only did 16mpg the same as my RRc.
As for Jaguar engines doing 25 to 38, my brothers 6 months old XF gets 22mpg only sometimes according the the dash display and a work colleagues 7 year old XK8 has the same mpg as my 15 year old disco 20mpg on a non stop run, so no different from the day it left the showroom.
And as for Td5 engines..... production didn't last long 5 years or so I wonder why. I'm now glad I didn't follow my temptations to go and buy one.
My light weight TVR only did 16mpg the same as my RRc.
As for Jaguar engines doing 25 to 38, my brothers 6 months old XF gets 22mpg only sometimes according the the dash display and a work colleagues 7 year old XK8 has the same mpg as my 15 year old disco 20mpg on a non stop run, so no different from the day it left the showroom.
And as for Td5 engines..... production didn't last long 5 years or so I wonder why. I'm now glad I didn't follow my temptations to go and buy one.
twinkal
New Member
I love the sound of the V8's. Just spoke to a good mate of mine who has a really nice defender and he said get a 300tdi! Makes me want a V8 more when someone says "don't get one"
thebiglad
Well-Known Member
1. I said 25-33mpg.
2. That's because that's what my S-type V8 4.2 auto gives me. Actually my run down from middle England to my home in France averaged 34.5mpg averaging 130-150kph - so about 80mph.
3. TD5 engines were produced from 1998 to 2004 so that's a 6 yr run. Then they moved onto the V6 diesel from the Ford/PSA partnership.
If you are going to have a pop, at least get the quoting right or you'll make yourself look a little silly.
We both know that you will never agree with anything I say no matter how truthful, but you are making a tit out of yourself mate.
Dave
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
I'd say 98/99 to 06/07 for the TD5 engine, it was about for ages in the defender!
Only emissions regulation forces the change.
Plus, look at the challenge guys, they use v8 (rover but more common now Chevy LS3) or they use tuned TD5.
The v8 debate can be answers easily:
Do you want one?
If not get a diesel.
If you do, can you have one?
If not get a diesel.
If you can, enjoy the mpg!
Simples
Only emissions regulation forces the change.
Plus, look at the challenge guys, they use v8 (rover but more common now Chevy LS3) or they use tuned TD5.
The v8 debate can be answers easily:
Do you want one?
If not get a diesel.
If you do, can you have one?
If not get a diesel.
If you can, enjoy the mpg!
Simples
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
Oh and for the record, was recently driving 92 Griffith 400, 40 quid lasted a good few days, but you don't need to accelerate hard to get moving, whereas in the land rover it's foot down all the time just to get anywhere.
Purely power to weight.
I reckon I'd be on similar economy if I had a 4.6 in mine simply because of the extra torques requiring less throttle!
Purely power to weight.
I reckon I'd be on similar economy if I had a 4.6 in mine simply because of the extra torques requiring less throttle!
thebiglad
Well-Known Member
I'd say 98/99 to 06/07 for the TD5 engine, it was about for ages in the defender!
Only emissions regulation forces the change.
Plus, look at the challenge guys, they use v8 (rover but more common now Chevy LS3) or they use tuned TD5.
The v8 debate can be answers easily:
Do you want one?
If not get a diesel.
If you do, can you have one?
If not get a diesel.
If you can, enjoy the mpg!
Simples
Yet again Mr Noisy, boiled down to common sense and simple language.
:clap2::clap2::clap2::clap2::clap2:
raise:
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
twinkal
New Member
Well, ya know
Also stumbled up on your YouTube channel and commented on a vid. That's a monster you've got there mate! Something I aspire towards myself in the future.
Mr Noisy
Coming in your ears.
stutab
Well-Known Member
You got a link for that?
twinkal
New Member
I've tried to link the channel bit unsure how, sorry. But here's a link to a video, then you should be able to see other vids too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4mCW73g41c
