Winter Tires for 16x8 inch wheels

I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG All
Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires got
to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have to
take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?

Somehow,on Tue, 30 Sep 2003 10:46:34 -0230, "Brad P"
<[email protected]> managed to spout out:

>I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG All
>Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires got
>to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
>the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have to
>take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?
>
if you like the look, leave them on.
I've run the same tire and never had a problem in the northeast
Wisconsin snow, with no weight in the bed and pulling snowmobile/atv
trailers.
2000 Silverado 2500 had 245s
`02 Silverado 2500 came with 245s but I've switched to 285s.

Mike
`02 Silverado 2500HD

> if you like the look, leave them on.
> I've run the same tire and never had a problem in the northeast
> Wisconsin snow, with no weight in the bed and pulling snowmobile/atv
> trailers.
> 2000 Silverado 2500 had 245s
> `02 Silverado 2500 came with 245s but I've switched to 285s.

Your truck is abit heavier than mine though. I'm in Newfoundland Canada by
the way.

Thanks for the post

"Brad P" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> > if you like the look, leave them on.
> > I've run the same tire and never had a problem in the northeast
> > Wisconsin snow, with no weight in the bed and pulling snowmobile/atv
> > trailers.
> > 2000 Silverado 2500 had 245s
> > `02 Silverado 2500 came with 245s but I've switched to 285s.
>
> Your truck is abit heavier than mine though. I'm in Newfoundland Canada by
> the way.
>
> Thanks for the post

I've taken my truck with stock 235-16's through snow the trucks behind me
with the wide tires couldn't begin to go through. Shoot, there was one hill
I came to where a Ford F250 was trying, and failing to climb. I plowed a
path up the hill, turned around, and the Ford STILL couldn't make it up. I
had to plow a better path before he finally made it, and he was in 4 wheel
drive.
Wider is NOT better in snow.

>
>

In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] says...
> I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG All
> Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires got
> to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
> the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have to
> take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?
>
>
>

You might want to tiptoe around with ATs, I ran my 32 x 11.5"
Bridgestone Dueler M/Ts all last winter in Cape Breton and I went out in
every snowfall before the plows did and they were great but I had ATs
31" before that and they were pretty bad in snow, packed up leaving the
driveway and stayed that way until spring. That said you could drive
around on all season tires as long as you keep it in 4wd and brake
REALLY early all the time.
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> > Thanks for the post
>
> I've taken my truck with stock 235-16's through snow the trucks behind me
> with the wide tires couldn't begin to go through. Shoot, there was one hill
> I came to where a Ford F250 was trying, and failing to climb. I plowed a
> path up the hill, turned around, and the Ford STILL couldn't make it up. I
> had to plow a better path before he finally made it, and he was in 4 wheel
> drive.
> Wider is NOT better in snow.
>

But it is better OVER snow

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"Brad P" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG
> All Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those
> tires got to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels
> that came with the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I
> don't want to have to take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any
> suggestions?
>
>

Here some interesting stuff I posted recently on some Cruiser
mailinglists....the wide vs narrow argument seems only relevant to
aquaplaning nowadays....still enough reason to go with narrow
IMNSHO....since slush is the same as water, even worse in floatation
(more resistance).

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: [FJ55] German winter-tire overview 2003 (was: [80] Winter tire
Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 03:28:11 +0200

Here 7 pages scanned from the German OffRoad mag 2003 #10, overview
of winter tires, with actual circumference in millimeters (devide by
3.14 for total heigth in centimeters....)
(I hope the long URL's don't get mangled, otherwise copy&paste back
onto a
single line into your browser)

<http://www.a1.nl/phomepag/markerink/OffRoad_2003-#10_Winter-Tires_1_05p-gr.jpg>

<http://www.a1.nl/phomepag/markerink/OffRoad_2003-#10_Winter-Tires_2_05p-gr.jpg>

<http://www.a1.nl/phomepag/markerink/OffRoad_2003-#10_Winter-Tires_3_05p-gr.jpg>

(strong JPEG compression, better scans available by email)

Interesting: the Nokia Hakkapelitta LT in both 235/85x16 and
265/75x16 is equal in circumference as the Bridgestone DM-Z3 285/75x16,
GT Radial 265/70x16, and Nokian Hakkapellita WR-SUV 265/70x17, all
around 2530mm, which is quite a bit taller than what I thought was
the largest, my Cooper Weathermaster 265/75x16 (2415mm IIRC, no longer
listed, superceeded by the 'Cooper Discoverer M+S BSS'
(aka 'Snow Groove'), at least in these sizes.

(in this German list, the Weathermaster is still available for some
smaller sizes)
http://www.extrem-motorsport.de/reifen/cooper.html

Also, a Swiss report on the Bridgestone DM-Z2 or Z3 claims that the
grip-technology of today creates a better grip with wider tires,
unlike the old 'as narrow as possible' rule.
However, the Bridgestone doesn't have an open thread as nice as the
Cooper Weathermaster (and the M+S/Snow-Groove even less!), and that's
what counts with aquaplaning....or slush planing....and that gets
only worse with such wide tires....

At least I now have something lovely tall *and* narrow for my (PS-
less) pig....)

--
Bye,

Willem-Jan Markerink

The desire to understand
is sometimes far less intelligent than
the inability to understand

<[email protected]>
[note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!]





From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: [FJ55] Re: German winter-tire overview 2003
(was: [80] Winter tire recommendations - USA
Reply-To: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 27 Sep 2003 04:34:54 +0200

Shoot, all scanning in vain, the same listings are already
online....bastards....)
(but not the pix)

http://www.off-road.de/reifen/home.html
(select pull-down menu on the right)

Or the tallest/16" winter tires in specific directly:

http://www.off-road.de/reifen/wi16met.html


(note that the regular/non-winter sections are by far not complete in
the exotic 7.50/8.25/9.00/11.00x16 & 255/100x16 sizes, but the winter
section is pretty extensive)



--
Bye,

Willem-Jan Markerink

The desire to understand
is sometimes far less intelligent than
the inability to understand

<[email protected]>
[note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!]

`
"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> > > Thanks for the post
> >
> > I've taken my truck with stock 235-16's through snow the trucks behind
me
> > with the wide tires couldn't begin to go through. Shoot, there was one
hill
> > I came to where a Ford F250 was trying, and failing to climb. I plowed a
> > path up the hill, turned around, and the Ford STILL couldn't make it up.
I
> > had to plow a better path before he finally made it, and he was in 4
wheel
> > drive.
> > Wider is NOT better in snow.
> >
>
> But it is better OVER snow
>

You would never be able to follow me with wide tires, I'd have to stop and
pull you through. ;-)

>I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG All
>Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires got
>to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
>the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have to
>take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?

leave em on, i dont know why this myth keeps coming up over and over, but i ve
run big tires on many of trucks for many a years and they perform way more
betterer than crappy stock street tires in bad weather, i prefer the biggest
nastyest tires i can use all year round here in new england, and yes i did this
on a toyota p/u as well as my current 6700lb v-10 ram



79 T/A WS6 455 ,Hurst 4 spd, Blk w/ t-tops, Heavily Fortified, 4mpg

00 Ram 2500HD QC V-10 4x4,Blk,5 spd,4:10 LSD, 10mpg

98 Intruder 1400, Blk, 5 spd, 25mpg

"TOXICTAVRN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG
All
> >Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires
got
> >to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
> >the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have
to
> >take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?
>
> leave em on, i dont know why this myth keeps coming up over and over, but
i ve
> run big tires on many of trucks for many a years and they perform way more
> betterer than crappy stock street tires in bad weather, i prefer the
biggest
> nastyest tires i can use all year round here in new england, and yes i did
this
> on a toyota p/u as well as my current 6700lb v-10 ram

The myth is on your end. I had a friend who thought like you. I drove his
truck one day when it was snowing like mad, damn thing was outright
dangerous. I told him how hard it was ti keep it on the road, or even move
with his bis assed tires, like you he claimed he never had a problem, it got
around great. I told him to go drive my truck, with the stock, narrow tires.
He came he said "man, you were right, I don't think I could make your truck
slip if I tried, I never realized how bad my truck handled in snow until I
drove yours."
Wide tires are **** in snow, anyone who thinks different simply has no idea
what they are saying, real world use proves them wrong everytime.

>
>
>
> 79 T/A WS6 455 ,Hurst 4 spd, Blk w/ t-tops, Heavily Fortified, 4mpg
>
> 00 Ram 2500HD QC V-10 4x4,Blk,5 spd,4:10 LSD, 10mpg
>
> 98 Intruder 1400, Blk, 5 spd, 25mpg
>
>
>

On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:49:28 -0500, "Douglas A. Shrader"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Wide tires are **** in snow, anyone who thinks different simply has no idea
>what they are saying, real world use proves them wrong everytime.

True most of the time. The only exception is when the snow is so deep
you are trying to get and stay on top of it. This would never be the
case on the road.

Matt
99 V-10 Super Duty, Super Cab 4x4

Approximately 10/2/03 12:35, Matt Mead uttered for posterity:
> On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:49:28 -0500, "Douglas A. Shrader"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Wide tires are **** in snow, anyone who thinks different simply has no idea
>>what they are saying, real world use proves them wrong everytime.
>
> True most of the time. The only exception is when the snow is so deep
> you are trying to get and stay on top of it. This would never be the
> case on the road.

Even in places like Montana, Wyoming, etc. snow depth so bad
simple width makes a difference is pretty rare. In packable
snow a nice wide tire with a good tread that can use the snow
itself as traction material works pretty good...giving low
but useable traction. Which is pretty much the same as what
Matt said.

For near freezing temps on ice, sipes have more effect than
the tread pattern as long as the sipes can grab the surface.
Again the traction is low but useable.

For Montana grade snow at 20 below, width doesn't make one whole
heck of a lot of difference. Studs and/or chains are about
the only real effective traction, particularly if some
doofus has polished the snow/ice by spinning tires.

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
says...
> `
> "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > > > Thanks for the post
> > >
> > > I've taken my truck with stock 235-16's through snow the trucks behind
> me
> > > with the wide tires couldn't begin to go through. Shoot, there was one
> hill
> > > I came to where a Ford F250 was trying, and failing to climb. I plowed a
> > > path up the hill, turned around, and the Ford STILL couldn't make it up.
> I
> > > had to plow a better path before he finally made it, and he was in 4
> wheel
> > > drive.
> > > Wider is NOT better in snow.
> > >
> >
> > But it is better OVER snow
> >
>
> You would never be able to follow me with wide tires, I'd have to stop and
> pull you through. ;-)
>
>
>
>

When the snow is 5 feet deep, you'd need 10 foot diameter tires
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In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
says...
>
> "TOXICTAVRN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > >I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of BFG
> All
> > >Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those tires
> got
> > >to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came with
> > >the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to have
> to
> > >take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?
> >
> > leave em on, i dont know why this myth keeps coming up over and over, but
> i ve
> > run big tires on many of trucks for many a years and they perform way more
> > betterer than crappy stock street tires in bad weather, i prefer the
> biggest
> > nastyest tires i can use all year round here in new england, and yes i did
> this
> > on a toyota p/u as well as my current 6700lb v-10 ram
>
> The myth is on your end. I had a friend who thought like you. I drove his
> truck one day when it was snowing like mad, damn thing was outright
> dangerous. I told him how hard it was ti keep it on the road, or even move
> with his bis assed tires, like you he claimed he never had a problem, it got
> around great. I told him to go drive my truck, with the stock, narrow tires.
> He came he said "man, you were right, I don't think I could make your truck
> slip if I tried, I never realized how bad my truck handled in snow until I
> drove yours."

Your friend either can't drive a 4x4 or doesn't know about this little
secret called appropriate tire pressure.
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In article <PW1fb.670668$uu5.108161@sccrnsc04>,
[email protected] says...
> Approximately 10/2/03 12:35, Matt Mead uttered for posterity:
> > On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:49:28 -0500, "Douglas A. Shrader"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>Wide tires are **** in snow, anyone who thinks different simply has no idea
> >>what they are saying, real world use proves them wrong everytime.
> >
> > True most of the time. The only exception is when the snow is so deep
> > you are trying to get and stay on top of it. This would never be the
> > case on the road.
>
> Even in places like Montana, Wyoming, etc. snow depth so bad
> simple width makes a difference is pretty rare. In packable
> snow a nice wide tire with a good tread that can use the snow
> itself as traction material works pretty good...giving low
> but useable traction. Which is pretty much the same as what
> Matt said.
>

Montana, Wyoming, what's that somewhere around Florida?


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"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
> says...
> >
> > "TOXICTAVRN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > > >I have a 2003 Tacoma 4x4 with the TRD alloy wheels. I have a set of
BFG
> > All
> > > >Terrains on them, 31 inchers. Its a wide tire. Everyone says those
tires
> > got
> > > >to go for the winter. I have the original tires and wheels that came
with
> > > >the truck, 15 inch steels and narrower Dunlop tires. I don't want to
have
> > to
> > > >take off the TRD wheels, they look so good. Any suggestions?
> > >
> > > leave em on, i dont know why this myth keeps coming up over and over,
but
> > i ve
> > > run big tires on many of trucks for many a years and they perform way
more
> > > betterer than crappy stock street tires in bad weather, i prefer the
> > biggest
> > > nastyest tires i can use all year round here in new england, and yes i
did
> > this
> > > on a toyota p/u as well as my current 6700lb v-10 ram
> >
> > The myth is on your end. I had a friend who thought like you. I drove
his
> > truck one day when it was snowing like mad, damn thing was outright
> > dangerous. I told him how hard it was ti keep it on the road, or even
move
> > with his bis assed tires, like you he claimed he never had a problem, it
got
> > around great. I told him to go drive my truck, with the stock, narrow
tires.
> > He came he said "man, you were right, I don't think I could make your
truck
> > slip if I tried, I never realized how bad my truck handled in snow until
I
> > drove yours."
>
> Your friend either can't drive a 4x4 or doesn't know about this little
> secret called appropriate tire pressure.

With narrow tires there is no need to air down.

> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.

"Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
> says...
> > `
> > "Chris Phillipo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > >
> > > > > Thanks for the post
> > > >
> > > > I've taken my truck with stock 235-16's through snow the trucks
behind
> > me
> > > > with the wide tires couldn't begin to go through. Shoot, there was
one
> > hill
> > > > I came to where a Ford F250 was trying, and failing to climb. I
plowed a
> > > > path up the hill, turned around, and the Ford STILL couldn't make it
up.
> > I
> > > > had to plow a better path before he finally made it, and he was in 4
> > wheel
> > > > drive.
> > > > Wider is NOT better in snow.
> > > >
> > >
> > > But it is better OVER snow
> > >
> >
> > You would never be able to follow me with wide tires, I'd have to stop
and
> > pull you through. ;-)
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> When the snow is 5 feet deep, you'd need 10 foot diameter tires

He, I have never seen a drift a wide tired truck could make it through that
I couldn't with narrow tires.
I have seen plenty of drifts the wide tires failed to cross that I was able
to cross. Add my blade to the front and I haven't been stopped yet, even
when my side mirrors were slicing through the snow, and I could hear the
sheet metal on my doors caving in from the snow sliding back down against
the truck to fill the void the plow was making.

> --
> ____________________
> Remove "X" from email address to reply.

"Matt Mead" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 13:49:28 -0500, "Douglas A. Shrader"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >Wide tires are **** in snow, anyone who thinks different simply has no
idea
> >what they are saying, real world use proves them wrong everytime.
>
> True most of the time. The only exception is when the snow is so deep
> you are trying to get and stay on top of it. This would never be the
> case on the road.
>
> Matt
> 99 V-10 Super Duty, Super Cab 4x4

Off road is always different of course, from onroad.
The cases I've seen, wide tires get you into the drift, then sink anyway,
leaving them high centered. with my narrow tires I either make it through,
or I get stopped early enough to back out before I high center. Couple of
years ago I drove through a drift 100 yards long and three feet deep, and
just crawled along the whole way.
The lifted one ton GMC with the super swampers behind me made it about fifty
feet. I could list cases for a week similar to these, but I'm off on
vacation in the morning, so this discussion will have to continue without
me.

On Thu, 2 Oct 2003 19:48:21 -0500, "Douglas A. Shrader"
<[email protected]> wrote:


>Off road is always different of course, from onroad.
>The cases I've seen, wide tires get you into the drift, then sink anyway,
>leaving them high centered. with my narrow tires I either make it through,
>or I get stopped early enough to back out before I high center. Couple of
>years ago I drove through a drift 100 yards long and three feet deep, and
>just crawled along the whole way.
>The lifted one ton GMC with the super swampers behind me made it about fifty
>feet. I could list cases for a week similar to these, but I'm off on
>vacation in the morning, so this discussion will have to continue without
>me.
>


I was snowmobiling several years ago in early December and came across
a group of 4x4s out in the snow. It was amazing the places they were
going and the bigger the tire, the better. I think the biggest tire
out there were a couple of trucks running 40s, aired way down. They
were having to break trail and occassionally yank the guys running
"small" 36s. On this day, the snow was about 36" deep and wet enough
to pack some. I'm afraid anything narrow wouldn't have been able to
play that day.

I'm also sure you have seen the rigs from Iceland that go out on the
glaciers. Notice they aren't running small tires.

Matt
99 V-10 Super Duty, Super Cab 4x4

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
says...
> > Your friend either can't drive a 4x4 or doesn't know about this little
> > secret called appropriate tire pressure.
>
> With narrow tires there is no need to air down.
>

I agree, you are already screwed, no need to decrease ride height and
get more screwed.
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