Oil overfill and blue smoke at statup

When my TD4 went in for it's service and MOT in May, I noticed (about a month later) that they had overfilled the oil - about 1/4" above max. Having seen other comments' here saying that it 'shouldn't' do any harm I sort of ignored it, but now I'm wondering if it might be a cause for another problem.

Soon after the service I noticed that on a cold star-tup, there was a puff of blue smoke out the back. More recently, the 'puff' has turned into a 'plume' As soon as the engine has cleared it's throat, all fine, no other smoke and it runs smooth. Warm start-ups and when the engine's been left for a few hours, things are OK. Engine has only done 65000 miles.

Something to go back to the garage about, or are valve guide seals a common issue?

In my opinion they did not overfill, they just followed what LR put in the book namely to put 6.5 l of oil after an oilchange. I noticed that 5.5 liter is just the corrrect amount to have the level on the dipstick at the maximum. As blue smoke points towards burning oil .........??? And as far as I can remember all the comments on such mentioning of an overfill were always to drain the extra oil out of the engine to avoid problems ????

OK, so I should forget about the connection between an overfill and start-up smoke.

I am assuming that the "blue" smoke is burnt engine oil rather than once of the cylinders filling up with Diesel while it's standing?

bighammer said:

OK, so I should forget about the connection between an overfill and start-up smoke.

I am assuming that the "blue" smoke is burnt engine oil rather than once of the cylinders filling up with Diesel while it's standing?

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yeah definately drain it out until the level is right, hte dipstick is the final word and not the manual

you can get 6.5 litres in them if you drain the oil properly

blue smoke is burning oil

UPDATE1 - just contacted the garage. This is their diagnosis..
The oil is not overfilled, but is beginning to fill with diesel. It sounds like an injector seal leak which is dripping into a cylinder and then into the sump.

I've found similar posts here for TD5 issues, but not a lot on the TD4. If not cured it can lead to turbo failure, blown seals and other nasties.

It goes into the garage on the 19th - I'll let you all know if that cures it.

Drain out the excess regardless of what the garage says & also get your crankcase breather filter/valve changed asap if it hasn't been done recently. As Willo says, sometimes 1 litre of old oil hangs around the oil cooler network & some people like myself haven't managed to drain it fully while others have. Probably due to technique etc. Surprised your garage could give the injector diagnosis without testing the injectors & had they tested them then they would have told you exactly which one was at fault. Also your level would be rising every time you checked your dipstick if this were the case, though a blocked breather also gives the same symptoms as the oil is pressurised & forced out up the dipstick & by the turbo seals.

ps I hope it's going in to a different garage.

chromiumuk said:

Surprised your garage could give the injector diagnosis without testing the injectors & had they tested them then they would have told you exactly which one was at fault.

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maximum profit for minimum work

gegs88 said:

maximum profit for minimum work

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As regards the injectors then zero f****** work by the sounds of it.

Use another better garage.

chromiumuk said:

As regards the injectors then zero f****** work by the sounds of it.

Use another better garage.

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lol

no truer words said

Haven't had the full diagnosis yet - the injector leak assumption was done over the phone based on my rather dodgy description. It might go in on the 19th and they find something completely different!

I'm not convinced either at the moment, but then I'm a born sceptic.

**** UPDATE ****
So it went in for a check on the 19th August. The work was to replace an 'O' ring on the injectors and replace the oil. Other options were available but we started with the cheapest.

After a nice long run and about a week - things were no better. If anything the cloud of blue smoke was worse. After a week the oil level had crept up above the max mark again.

They had tried the cheaper alternative - now things could get expensive!

Booked in again early September and this time, instead of 'trying' to fix the injectors, they were sent away for proper testing. Symptoms were definitely a dripping/leaking injector.

1 injector found to be losing pressure, the other 3 OK. Fault identified and the injector was replaced (£136 for a new one + testing + labour). After running for a week - the amount of blue smoke is significantly reduced. After reading through the EGR mod sticky (and seeing some of the pictures) I thought that things might improve if the EGR and inlet manifold were cleaned out. There was a lot of black sticky goo in there.

I did that over this weekend and (fingers crossed) the smoke was nearly zero this morning.

So.... here's the symptoms and the cure - it may help others.

firstly - watch the oil level. If it's going up, then it's not oil pixies keeping you topped up, it's something getting in there. The diesel will drip from the leaking injector into the piston chamber and run through past the piston rings to the sump.
secondly - watch the smoke at start up. As the oil thins it seems to get into places it shouldn't (especially after a month or two of driving) and the extra diesel won't help either. If it gets really bad, I have heard tell that starting becomes difficult.
Thirdly - if the smoke then clears and it runs fine, then it is probably not valve guides and you have narrowed down your culprit.

Lastly - all that extra (thin) oil will get into the inlet manifold and the EGR valve. It's a mess. If you are impatient, take the bits off and clean them out otherwise, a few good runs will help.

a warning though.... if you decide to clean out the EGR and inlet manifold, cover everything within a 10 foot radius with newspaper, don't wear your best clothes, allow 3 hours and a couple of tins of Gunk, Mr Muscle etc and don't use the wife's toothbrush to get into the deeper recesses of the EGR. They don't mention that in the sticky! :doh:

how do you tell if the diesle is getting into the oil, my engine has been overheating woundered if this was part of the problem as well

The oil level increases, there's no 'mayonnaise ' in the oil filler cap (a symptom of water in the oil, overheating) and there is a diesel smell to the oil.

Hello
being reading all of these advices and My one is
-smoking blue at start, after few yards no smoke
-I think is oil level raising
so them fuel injectors or one of them is faulty.
oh crap