New to range rover, please help!!

Firstly, hi everyone, im new to the forum, and new to range rovers.

Ive just bought my first rangie, Its a:

1996 2.5 dse AUTO 122,000, on coils (air suspension removed)

The engine is absolutely sound, but with its age and such a low purchase price it came with a few problems which I need help with.

1. the car struggles to start, doesnt seem to matter if its a hot or cold, if I allow for glow plugs to warm, turn the starter for about 6-10 seconds it starts, no more smoke than should be, doesnt splutter, runs as should, if i turn it off and re-start after a second or 2 it starts again after about 2 seconds on starter, but after a few minutes it has to be wound over on the starter for 8 seconds. It always starts, but its annoying having to wind it over for so long.

Ive been told it could be a small pump in the fuel tank that pushes fuel to the main pump?

2. SRS warning light always on, and air bag warning on display. Is this fixed by replacing the airbag ECU?

3. Select Neutral Warning light on dash display all the time.

4. Wont go into sport mode at all, click sport and the sport light on the shifter flashes once and goes off, sport appears on the dash display for a second then goes off. tried holding button down but makes no difference.

Is this fixed by replacing the gearbox ecu?

4. Wont go into low range, I knew it had this problem when I bought it hence the low price, was told by garage I bought it from they thought it could be the motor needing to be stripped or replaced, they removed it to take it out of low range manually and put it in high then put the motor back on apparently, but have yet to check.

Is this also linked to the sport mode fault, and can it be fixed by changing the gearbox ECU?

In high it goes through all the AUTO gears fine, no problems, just a bit slow really, takes a while to get to 70 I think.

I know its a lot to read and take in, but any help, opinions, fixes would be great.

Thanks for taking the time to read it all, look forward to hearing what everyone has to say.

(p.s, I love my rangie, and would love to get it back to its former glory)

:welcome2:

The first item on your list about extended cranking sounds like two main problems with the Diesel RR P38's.....Leak Off Pipes and the In Tank Pump...

The Leak Off Pipes are small fuel pipes that link each injector to eachother and then back to the tank (I think), and these get old abd brittle then eventually start leaking/letting air into the fuel system....the extended cranking times is a symptom of the fuel pump pushing all the air out of the fuel lines.

This can also be seen by looking at the clear pipe between the Fuel Filter and the Fuel Injection Pump (FIP) if there are air bubbles present in this clear tube.

The In Tank Pump (ITP). also known as a Lift Pump, is quite a large item that can only be accessed in one of two ways, drop the tank or cut a hole in the loadspace floor. Reletivey cheap at around the £50 mark.

The most classic symptomn of the ITP is if the tank is less than 1/3rd full it struggles to start hot or cold.

Poor hot starting is a very common on the diesel P38, and their are hot start ix kits out there but make sure you get one that is timed and NOT on continuously, these work by making the Glow Plugs come on regardless of if the engine is hot or cold.....

The Hot Start Fix masks a problem with the FIP being out of sync, as over 20,000 miles the FIP timing chain gets stretched and alters the fuel injection timing causing poor hot starts....a new FIP plus fitting is silly money (£800-£1200) but don't try and alter the timing yourself as it is very sensitive to getting it wrong.

The SRS - I have no knowledge on the SRS system, but do treat ir with respect - it is an explosive after all.

The Gearbox Transfer between High and Low is achieved using a small electric motor that selects the desired ratio....this is known to fail, but I am not sure where it is located , if it is easy to get to or how much it would be to change.

The Sport Mode doesn't change anything mechanical all it does it change the gear change profile, i.e. it holds a lower gear longer or changes down a gear more promptly on accelration. This lack of function could be symptom of the transfer change motor as mentioned above and also below.....

The gear box should change through all gears smoothly and also kick down with gusto too, it is not a quick car and it will take a while to get to 70, the torque and BHP curves on these beasts don't really start to get interesting until you get past 2200 rpm, so don't expect much before this figure., a good gearbox oil change and filter change wouldn't go amiss as they are quite sensitive to poor gearbox servicing and most mechnical gear change problems can miraculously be fizxed just by changing the oil and filter.

Select Neutral message usually means it is trying to change between High and Low ratio, this could be linked to the transfer change motor as mentioned above....

First off I would change the Transfer motor, give it an oil and filter change and see what happens, as it won't engage Sport/Manual mode whilst it thinks it still needs to change ratios (due to the motor problem) so replace the motor first and with luck the Select Neutral Message and the Sport/Manual problem will correct itself.

srs light could be the wheel behind the steering wheel name will come to be soon lol old age setting in, but befor you change anything look under the seats at the plugs yellow plug is srs plug name still not come to me but i am sure the next person to coment will tell you the name and its a easy jub replacing it as well lol.. good luck ans welcome to the site ..

Isn't that called the Rotary Couplier behind the steering wheel...

Also it is fitted with Seatbelt Pretensioners, that fire the Seatbelt clip downwards to pretension the seatbelts to stop the occupant from moving forward and 'Submarining' under the lap strap

Just read it is '96...no pretensioners on a '96...from '99 onwards only

Thanks for the advice guys, when i get chance i'll tackle the motor for the hi-lo first, and then as you say hopefully it will cure the other gearbox problems, then move on to the other bits from there. I will try the motor on the workbench and let everyone know how I get on.

Thanks Again

the transfer box issue is the Stepper motor.

mine was doing similar with the starting, and it was cutting out if not enough revs when turning steering wheel, putting heater on, pulling away etc.
we took the top of FIP off and then the middle bit, and changed the rubber seals, (i had help) it has improved things but i need to tweak it again as the revs arent quite right, as it was quite tricky to line it all up when we put it back together and we had to get a thingy (i'm a girl) lined up in a hole! but do get an expert to help with the FIP as its too important if you get it wrong. i couldnt justify buying a new or reconditioned one

Rangie.lad said:

Firstly, hi everyone, im new to the forum, and new to range rovers.

Ive just bought my first rangie

Click to expand...

You might find it worthwhile to put a location in your details. You might find someone local who can help you out.

:welcome2:

Regarding gear change motor: it could be one (or both, the second usually causes the first) of two things:
1. Fried transfer case ECU. It's a silver metal box under the passenger seat, with a Borg-Warner written on it. Smell it if it smells of bakelite, it's probably fried. Get used one from fleabay. Mine was around 35€.
2. Gear change motor stator magnet disintegrating. Sounds worse than it is. The motor is easily accessible from under the car, just dismount it and try if it turns with a 12v battery. Try reversing polarity to see if it moves in other direction. If it doesn't move, open the motor cover and look for bits and pieces of broken stator magnet. Smell the rotor, it shouldn't smell burnt. Clean all the parts of the stator (you can also give it a smack with a hammer, this will loosen any bits of the stator that are going to fall off anyway), reassemble, test.

Cheers for the advice everyone, right when Im looking for a new transmition ECU does it have to be specifically a 2.5 DSE ecu, or can it be any , say from a petrol 4.0?

So far ive worked out mine is a:
AMR 5258
GS2.26

Does this sound right?

Thanks

Be careful, there are two separate ECU-s, one for the auto transmission, the other one for transfer box/low gear.

Transfer box ECU has to be for diesel automatic. Don't know about transmission ECU, as i have a manual.

chort said:

Be careful, there are two separate ECU-s, one for the auto transmission, the other one for transfer box/low gear.

Transfer box ECU has to be for diesel automatic. Don't know about transmission ECU, as i have a manual.

Click to expand...

Thanks for your advice, could you have a look at this link, its identical to mine under the passenger seat, is this for my gearbox, or hi/lo? and which one do I need to cure the problem that you mentioned in your previous post.

Many thanks

You forgot to add the link

here is the microcat picture of both ECUs, left is the auto transmission ECU, right is the transfer box or hi/lo ECU. Looking under the passenger seat, the hi/lo ECU is mounted on top of the auto transmission ECU. Hi/lo is also smaller, and it's got a classic pull out connector, while the transmission box has a little fancier one.


If you search fleabay for "P38 borg warner ecu" you'll get the hi/lo ECU. This is the one mentioned in my previous post. You just have to be sure, that it is for a automatic. I think the part number was AMR6353, but there were several revisions during the production period and each had a different part number. Best if you can get yours out of the car, there is a sticker on it with the part number. I fitted a later one (meaning the part number was not the same), but it worked all the same.

Just be sure the motor on the transfer box is ok, because even the new ECU can be fried if the motor is stuck.

chort said:

If you search fleabay for "P38 borg warner ecu" you'll get the hi/lo ECU. This is the one mentioned in my previous post. You just have to be sure, that it is for a automatic. I think the part number was AMR6353, but there were several revisions during the production period and each had a different part number. Best if you can get yours out of the car, there is a sticker on it with the part number. I fitted a later one (meaning the part number was not the same), but it worked all the same.

Just be sure the motor on the transfer box is ok, because even the new ECU can be fried if the motor is stuck.

Click to expand...

Cheers for the advice Chort, I was lucky I asked you first as from the diagram it looks like I had the Gearbox ECU out of my car rather than my hi/lo ECU, thought it was a bit strange that it didnt have Borg-warner written on it. Would have been a right pain in the arse If i had bought another ECU when mine still works only to work out its the Hi/ lo i needed :doh:

Will let you know how I get on,
Cheers

dogsbody said:

You might find it worthwhile to put a location in your details. You might find someone local who can help you out.

:welcome2:

Click to expand...

dogsbody he's in york .says so on his location , a visit to specsavers is on the cards for you ,,ho ho nevermind you are a senior member ?????

Hi guys, just want to say a big thanks to everyone that has had some input.

Ive managed to sort the Hi-lo problem. Turned out the motor had gone caput, frying the ECU, so Ive changed both the motor and ECU and now works great and this has also cured the 'select neutral' problem, and the sport problem

Just got to move onto the next problem now

Glad we could help....

Right im back.

I decided to tackle the starting problem, cut a hole in the rear floor and fitted a new pump into the tank, new olives and nuts, fitted back together, and it seems to have made a very small improvement, you still have to crank it over for a while, just not a long as before, but its still a long time compared to how it should be.

(can other diesel owners confirm that if they allow for heater plugs and the pump the car starts almost instantly, rather than cranking for 5 seconds or having to crank over and stop twice, or am I hoping for too much from an old car? )

Could I still have a problem with the leak off pipes between the injectors?

Does anyone have a part number for these items, or a technical/proper name, ive searched ebay for bits but "range rover leak off pipes" and other variants receive no results.

Also are these pipes made of plastic of metal?


Bit more info: once started the car runs spot on, no flat spots, no loss in power, runs perfectly

Cheers