Series 3 Headlamp bowls

About to refit the last few bits of bodywork, now, namely the wings. Just need to sort out the lights on them.

It looks like the old bowls are rather corroded, and while I've not yet drilled out the rusted screws to check whether they can be salvaged, I'm assuming they can't. So I've been looking for replacements.

Bearmach, at al, seem to supply single piece plastic bowls (Defender?) these days, rather than the inner/outer steel arrangement I seem to have at the moment (with a spring between them). A plastic bowl has got to be a lot more corrosion resistant.

https://bearmach.com/plastic-head-l...-suitable-for-defender-series-vehicles-ba-051

Is it a straight/easy swap? Where is the adjustment, as I assume that's why the old design had the two bowls (outer one fixed to be waterproof from under the wing, and the inner one movable within it)?

The adjustments are in the plastic ones too.
Don't worry.

Fitted the plastic to my series years ago with no problem.

OK, cheers. I'll order a pair of sets, then.

No only do some of the original parts seem to be made of unobtainium, but those that are available seem to be very pricy. Just the front bezel seems to be nearly as expensive as the whole plastic-type kit.

tottot said:

Fitted the plastic to my series years ago with no problem.

Click to expand...

I did the same thing. Would definitely recommend them. Easy to fit, easy to adjust, don’t worry about it being a slightly different setup to to the original.

Plastic

eyyew

I got proper mecul wons and smuthered em in cack. Cacks still good

Mine came with the plastic, I seem to recall there's no holes for the wires so you'll need some grommets (and a hole!)

Paddocks have Wipac ones, come with a hole + grommet.....

https://www.paddockspares.com/headlamp-mounting-kit.html

Thanks, although I've already ordered the Bearmach ones. Fortunately I have an almost endless supply of holes, and a big box of grommets. too.

I did look at the Wipac ones, although I'm still boycotting Paddock, so I'd have got them from somewhere else anyway.

The good news...bowls have arrived, complete with cable-relief grommet (although the loom actually already has one in place, anyway) and a free hole!

The bad news is that there's also a bad of seemingly random self tapping screws and metal clips for them. I've got no idea quite where they are supposed to go, as it looks like there are 5 of one type of clip, three of another, but it looks like I'm supposed to use 4 fixings from the holes in the bowls! And I don't have 5 of the same sized screws, either.

I found this thread:

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/headlight-bowls-fitting-help-please.107138/

...but the image in the last post isn't showing up for me...I guess it's too old.

Can anyone point me at a copy?

I have the part book, but these are obviously a very different design from the lucas originals. Do the adjusters at least fit in the same orientation, ie. bottom and right when looking at the headlights from the front?

It's been a while since I've been in there but yes adjusters in same place.
I remember it looks confusing but it isn't once you figure it out.
Can't help more than that sorry.

Thinking about this a bit more...
From memory(again) the chrome ring is help to the lamp by the small plates and some screws. There are lugs on the lamp which can only engage with the bowl one way, writing on the glass upright. The slots for the adjusters in the chrome ring need to be at the correct position before clamping it to the lamp. The adjusters screw into the bowl and the slots in the chrome ring engage in the plain part of the adjusters. The bowls them selves can (possibly?) Be fitted wrong so loosely assemble stuff on the bench so that you're sure the bowl/lamp/ ring are in the correct position. It WILL be obvious after you've done one.
The reason for doing it first on the bench is that while fiddling with the bits for the first time on the car you tend to drop stuff including the lamp.

Take time and check the screw sizes, once you have put the wrong lager one into a hole the correct smaller one won't fit. I know that's obvious, but what I'm saying is "if the screw is a bit tight, stop and check" I seem to recall that it was fiddley but straight forward with the adjusters in the same place. The loom was a bit short and it took a while to get that routed right.

I changed headlights in a Defender recently and the 'adjuster' screws were "top and left" looking at them from the front.
I have the plastic Wipac bowls for a Series 3 here on the table and as far as I can see the only way I could fit them is "top and left" as well.
There are 3 clips needed to hold the 'light' onto the chrome ring, the other 5 are 'nuts' for the self tappers.....

Edit-Just looked at the Series 3, 1979, and the adjusters are "top and left" looking from the front.....

Thanks for the comments, all. I think it's starting to make sense, now.
I checked the screws again this morning in better light, and I can now see that there are actually fewer different sizes than I thought. Not really sure why they looked so different last night (I didn't even have a beer, so can't blame that!)
I have:
5 large self-tappers, which I guess go into the 5 'nuts'. The old bowls were held in with only three nut/bolts, but I can make 2 more holes.
3 small screws must go with the the larger metal pieces that hold the lens to the chrome ring.
2 black screws for the adjuster. Pretty clear on this. There's already a screw holding the ring to the bowl, which will work with these additional two.
This just leaves the one countersunk screw. I really can't see where that's going to go. I guess I'll see what's still flopping about when it's all together. Actually, I've just noticed a hole on the bowl that's perpendicular to the others, either at the top or bottom (depending which way up it's supposed to fit) outer edge. The screw may well go in there, but I think I'll need to offer it up to the wing to see what it's supposed to locate in, if that's indeed where it belongs.

Regarding the orientation, it probably doesn't matter that much from the perspective of the bowl, but if the lens locates only one way in the ring, then that'll ensure I fit the bowl one way to suit.

Much happier about this now having read all your advice, than I was when I unpacked the bag of bits last night. I'll take a look at fitting them tomorrow. Cheers, all!

Oh, and I think @David Leech is right...the adjusters are indeed top/left, not bottom/right. I've got the wings off on the bench and they were upsidedown as I was dismantling them...doh!

I think you'll only need 4 of the large self tappers, 2 top and 2 bottom. There are already predrilled holes present in my wing. Like yours, my old bowls are held on with 3 nuts and bolts, the wiring is 'incorporated' by means of clips on these nuts.
That countersunk I don't think you will need at all. There's a square, wedge shape at the bottom of the plastic housing that has a screw hole. As far as I can gather, this was for holding a chrome 'outer ring' on some makes of car, this ring was held in place by that countersinker.....
Good luck on your mission!

Well, that turned out to be a *lot* more simple than I had feared! Certainly one on the jobs that was a lot easier to just get on and do, than to spend time working it out before hand.

As @Flossie said, the lens only aligned with the fixing screw holes in one orientation, and it was pretty obvious that that's what the three larger metal tabs were for. All 5 holes for the bowl fixings were drilled in my wing, so that was trivial, too, although I drilled a couple of new holes for the cable P-clips.

And yes, @David Leech , that makes sense about that other screw. Didn't use it, and no ill-effects that I can see.

Thanks again for the advice, everyone. It definitely helped having read your comments before I started work.