Kremers

New Member
Good morning,

First post for me and only had the pleasure of owning a Defender for the last 4 months!

I'm looking to install these: TF203 - Terrafirma All-Terrain Medium Load Plus 2" Suspension Lift Kit - For Defender 110.
I have questions on what else needs to be fitted along with them. I've read a fair few articles and watched a fair few videos, but I'm still not 100% certain .I understand that lifting the vehicle will impose additional stress on certain parts of the vehicle, such as prop shafts, radius arm bushes, etc.
A most common addition is extended brake lines but what about Caster-Corrected Front Radius Arms, Cranked Rear Trailing Arms, Shock Relocation Mounts, Steering Stabiliser, Wide-angle Propshafts, Extended Bump Stops - are they all recommended or essential with a 2" lift?

Not sure if this helps but essentially, in the grand scheme of things, the vehicle will probably be used more on the road than off road. I'll be looking to also install larger AT tyres too.

Apologies if this has been covered before!
Many thanks,
Eric
 
Hi and welcome.

First off, why do you want a lift? Defender's already ride quite high, higher than most other stock 4x4's. Its like Land Rover already fitted a lift kit for you at the factory.

What are you planning on doing with the vehicle that requires a lift kit?

I'm not against modding or even potentially lifting a vehicle. But the vast majority of lifted Land Rovers I've seen are terrible and end up riding worse on the road and off road and often end up with less suspension travel too.

What you are wanting to use the vehicle for and why will really dictate what mods will or won't work very well. No point just throwing a catalogues worth of crap at the vehicle without knowing what it does or why you are fitting it.
 
Hey!

Thank you and thanks for coming back to me so quickly.

Completely agree with your points and 100% valid. Most of the lift kit content online usually starts or ends about whether it is/was actually required and why you'd need it. Adding them leads to the wearing of other components, meaning spending more to resolve other issues you wouldn't have without them, etc. To be fair, my girlfriend already struggles to get in as it is!

I'll be moving back to Cyprus later this year and shipping the Defender with me. Being a volcanic island with lots of mountains, there are some incredible off-road trails. Although I spent the first 18 years of my life there, there is still a lot to explore and I want to ensure that I will be able to - plus share the experience with friends - it is a 7 seater. I'd like to get everything done before shipping in November, as it'll be tough/more expensive to source parts when there.

Of course with the lift, it would accommodate room for bigger tyres, thus increasing ground clearance as well. I would by lying if I didn't include aesthetics either, I guess that little higher stance does make it look the part. However, I know looks doesn't mean practical!

It wouldn't be my daily car and anyway Cyprus being a small island, you can get around pretty quick, so if I lost a bit of road performance I wouldn't mind as much. Hopefully, this all helps answering!
 
So a lift doesn't really give you more room for bigger tyres..... not unless you plan to never drive the vehicle or flex the suspension. Under suspension flex you'll need the same room for the tyre as you would with stock suspension.

You can limit up travel to stop the tyre moving up as far, which maybe would allow a bigger tyre. But unless you've done something to give more total travel, you'd be loosing off road ability with less suspension flex.

What size tyres are you planning on?

TBH the Terrafirma kit probably isn't what I'd go for.
 
Looking at 265/75R16 - would like to change my wheels as well, don't really like the ones that are on it. That's another conversation I need to start. Tyre offset I fully understand I just don't know what would work best with those tyres to not have to amend the wheel arches.

What kit would you go for?
 
Looking at 265/75R16 - would like to change my wheels as well, don't really like the ones that are on it. That's another conversation I need to start. Tyre offset I fully understand I just don't know what would work best with those tyres to not have to amend the wheel arches.

What kit would you go for?
265/75R16 is a standard size, so will work no problem with stock suspension. As a rule you can normally run 33" tall tyres no problem. Although it will depend on the exact rims, tread and vehicle.

Off road the 110 has a brilliant approach angle, although the departure isn't as good as a 90 due to a longer overhang. The breakover angle also isn't as good due to the longer wheelbase. But the longer wheelbase obviously gives more seats and room inside and can offer greater stability on some off road terrain.

A lift will improve all of the angles, especially the breakover angle. So I can see genuine reasons for lifting a vehicle. But it does depend on how serious you want to take it off road. A standard vehicle is highly capable.

When you lift a vehicle it will get taller to get in, sort of obvious, but sometimes forgotten. Bigger lifts and big tyres can make getting in and out quite a challenge compared to a stock vehicle. This might be an issue, but if you tend to carry other people it might be more of something to consider.

A higher vehicle may also roll more in the corners and handle slightly differently, although on modest lifts this isn't normally an issue or really all that noticeable from the drivers seat.

There are lots of ways to lift a vehicle. The cheapest and easiest are lift packers/spacers. These simply sit between the coil spring the lower spring seat. Normally as a 1" or 2" lift. They have the benefit of being very cheap and easy to fix. Plus they also retain your standard springs and shocks, so will give you very much the same ride and handling as a stock vehicle. As they are only changing the pre-load on the springs.

The downside with this is you don't gain any suspension travel. Technically you don't loose any either really, unless the coil spring can become fully bound (coils touching) before hitting the bump stops. In reality however you will find you get cross axled more easily and the vehicle is generally likely to perform slightly worse than stock, bar additional clearance and breakover angles.

The easiest way to understand this is to assume at stock ride height you have the shock half way extended. Imagine the shock can move up and down by 8 units (I say units, not inches, as it is just theory). At stock ride height it sits in the middle, giving you 4 units of compression and 4 units of suspension droop. If you lift it by 2 units you extend the shocks. So you would then have a theoretical 6 units of compression, but only 2 units of droop available. The result of this is, off road when your wheel drops into a rut or hole, it only has half the amount of downward travel as before, so much more likely to end up spinning int he air.

And while in theory you have 6 units of up travel, this does depend on if the spring will compress far enough or not. If it gets coil bound, you may need extended bump stops, which might mean in such a situation you go from having 8 units of total travel to maybe only 7 units of total travel.

Instead of the packers/spacers you could go for spring lift. This can be done by simply a stiffer spring and/or a longer spring. You can also tailor the spring to ride differently or perform better for certain tasks. e.g. a soft long spring will give a more supple ride and flex. But will sag if you load the vehicle up. A stiff "Heavy Duty" (HD) spring may rider very hard when unloaded and bounce along and not want to flex as well unless carrying lots of weight.

Springs normally cost more than packers/spacers, although require similar effort to fit. And there is vastly more choice, which is good if you know what you want and bad if you don't. But a spring lift will face the same issues with potentially becoming coil bound as well as reducing the available downward shock travel.

Therefore if you plan to off road, you will likely want to look at some different shocks. Longer shocks will allow more droop, so will restore or even offer more total travel than the standard setup. But if you go too long on a shock, it won't be able to close fully, meaning you'd have to limit the up travel. Or you'd have to start and look at different shock mounting options.

If you get more suspension travel then the springs can run the risk of falling out of the upper spring seat. You can retain them, go for a longer spring or opt for dislocating suspension. But it really depends how serious the off roading is.

Cranked rear arms most likely aren't needed. You can get pretty extreme flex with standard ones, but on big lifts you end up with a poor angle at the chassis end of the trailing arm and potential binding. Cranked arms help solve this, although there are many other options too.

Front castor corrected arms, again this depends. For 1-2" lift they are not normally needed, but as you lift the vehicle it will rotate the nose of the diff round and change the angle of the hubs, causing castor issues. Which can result in poor self centering of the steering. But like all things, there are other things to consider. Caster corrected arms also impact the diff angle and make it worse. There are also things like castor corrected swivels that might be a better bet.

Talking diffs, it is the props that can be an issue when lifted, as the UJs may bind causing vibration issues when driving and accelerated wear. A simple prop spacer may be enough, else a wide angle prop will be needed. At extreme suspension travel you'll also need wide angle props.


Thats probably enough for now, I'll post some suggestions up later when I have more time.
 
Recon the above will give @Kremers lots to think about.
I have no idea what sort of off roading there is in Cyprus. However a much simper way to improve the capability of a standard Land Rover would be to fit locking diffs or perhaps better in your case @Kremers torque bias diffs as they need no driver input to improve traction and the rest of the vehicle stays standard. See Ashcroft Transmissions site.
 
What age is your defender? Replacing your suspension with new standard springs and shocks will be an improvement if the current ones are original. Consider upgrading with the likes of old man emu.
 

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