Matt Poiner

Matt Poiner

Member
As title suggests, I’m getting what I think to be air in the fuel system and it’s puzzling me.

It’ll drive for a good while, and then when I come to a stop / idle / engage the clutch, the revs drop below idle and it runs lumpy (like the previous issue I asked about but that was rectified with a new lift pump)

So far my fuel system changes have been:
- new filter
- new lift pump
- new feed and return to and from tank
- new fuel lines between the lift pump and filter, also filter to injection pump.
- new fuel start stop solenoid
- new fuel breather
- new fuel cap

This happens pretty much every drive, and I struggle to move at all when it starts acting up.
My current short term resolution is to release the bleed screw on the filter housing and pump some air out, gives a slight hissing noise.

I do not have a sedimenter fitted - any suggestions on model greatly appreciated.

I went to a Land Rover meet up and got some thoughts of some other owners, one noticed that my injection pump has a slight stain around where the throttle body is, which could have potentially been a leak or is leaking. And has suggested this following kit in the image below.

Any suggestions on what I may have missed? I’m tempted to replace every copper washer as a precaution anyway.

Also if someone knows of a thread/guide for doing the job with said kit as I haven’t done it before!

Many thanks!
 

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I think you might have answered your own problem. Fuel leaking out will most likely mean air getting in.
 
Anaconda said:
I think you might have answered your own problem. Fuel leaking out will most likely mean air getting in.
Click to expand...
Haven’t actually seen it leak out though, no visible patch on the floor, it just looks like it has been leaking at some point, could have even been a dried up patch from when I was fault finding before. Didn’t write that quite well in the post though so I’ll adjust that.

I haven’t found a UK based supplier for the kit so I was hoping for any other potential solutions while I wait for however long for the kit to arrive, as well as a write up or pointers on how to do it
 
It's possible that your pump needs a rebuild, your symptoms are pretty much the same as my son's 200tdi. We exhausted every other option in the vain hope it wasn't the most expensive part in the system.
 
Replace the black nylon pipe from fuel filter to inj pump with some clear pipe to see what is going on.

Are all the seals paint/wire/plastic present on the inj pump?
 
Anaconda said:
It's possible that your pump needs a rebuild, your symptoms are pretty much the same as my son's 200tdi. We exhausted every other option in the vain hope it wasn't the most expensive part in the system.
Click to expand...
yeah thats the point im getting to, im running out of ideas that isn't the injection pump. Funnily enough when i loosen that bleed screw ever so slightly to the point it dribbles out air/diesel. Runs sweet as it ever has. Not exactly environmentally or financially friendly... but its never driven so well!
 
lynall said:
Replace the black nylon pipe from fuel filter to inj pump with some clear pipe to see what is going on.

Are all the seals paint/wire/plastic present on the inj pump?
Click to expand...
Yeah that's what im going to do if i can find some clear pipe.

Not sure what you mean by the paint/wire/plastic present on inj pump?
 
Matt Poiner said:
Yeah that's what im going to do if i can find some clear pipe.

Not sure what you mean by the paint/wire/plastic present on inj pump?
Click to expand...
All the screws will have had some sort of anti tamper seal to see if they have been messed with, little blobs of paint on all the screws, sometimes thin twisted wire or even plastic caps, just trying to see if anyone has messed with the injection pump.
 
lynall said:
All the screws will have had some sort of anti tamper seal to see if they have been messed with, little blobs of paint on all the screws, sometimes thin twisted wire or even plastic caps, just trying to see if anyone has messed with the injection pump.
Click to expand...
previous owner of this engine has definitely messed with the pump, rolled coal like nothing I've ever see before when I put it in mine and got it running.

I read somewhere that the removal of the stop start solenoid and it having swarf on would be a sign that the pump has started to wear, but when i swapped it over this morning it was as clean as a whistle.

if push comes to shove I'll just get it reconditioned, not like it wouldn't benefit from it anyways.
 
Matt Poiner said:
previous owner of this engine has definitely messed with the pump, rolled coal like nothing I've ever see before when I put it in mine and got it running.

I read somewhere that the removal of the stop start solenoid and it having swarf on would be a sign that the pump has started to wear, but when i swapped it over this morning it was as clean as a whistle.

if push comes to shove I'll just get it reconditioned, not like it wouldn't benefit from it anyways.
Click to expand...
It is not to hard to put most of the settings back to standard ish.
Have a little search for bosch ve tuning to get an idea, but the screw called the max fuel srew if screwed out slightly to much can cause exactly your issue, 1/4 to 1/2 a turn inwards might calm it down (screw on the other side of the pump is the idle screw) people wind the screw out to get the smoke down for test and go to far.
I would bet someone has tweaked the pump on the tapered fuel pin, or worse fitted one of them daft power pins which dump in way to much fuel.

See this listing on ebay, if your pin look like the one on the right it is the power/smoke pin, see the pin on the left? this is the wear mark on the std pin and is how they all are, you want the widest wear mark to line up with the little pin in the bottom of the hole, literally 2 minutes work to check/adjust.

www.ebay.co.uk

Black Tuning Fuel Boost Pin Compatible For Land Rover Range Rover 200 300 Tdi UK | eBay UK

However, when the pressure rises to automatically give a higher dose of fuel. Eccentric pin which allows you to adjust engine settings. Tuning Fuel Boost Pin for Land Rover Defender Discovery Range Rover 200 300 Tdi.
www.ebay.co.uk
 
lynall said:
It is not to hard to put most of the settings back to standard ish.
Have a little search for bosch ve tuning to get an idea, but the screw called the max fuel srew if screwed out slightly to much can cause exactly your issue, 1/4 to 1/2 a turn inwards might calm it down (screw on the other side of the pump is the idle screw) people wind the screw out to get the smoke down for test and go to far.
I would bet someone has tweaked the pump on the tapered fuel pin, or worse fitted one of them daft power pins which dump in way to much fuel.

See this listing on ebay, if your pin look like the one on the right it is the power/smoke pin, see the pin on the left? this is the wear mark on the std pin and is how they all are, you want the widest wear mark to line up with the little pin in the bottom of the hole, literally 2 minutes work to check/adjust.

www.ebay.co.uk

Black Tuning Fuel Boost Pin Compatible For Land Rover Range Rover 200 300 Tdi UK | eBay UK

However, when the pressure rises to automatically give a higher dose of fuel. Eccentric pin which allows you to adjust engine settings. Tuning Fuel Boost Pin for Land Rover Defender Discovery Range Rover 200 300 Tdi.
www.ebay.co.uk
Click to expand...
ideal, will have a gander thankyou.

Could this cause this issue even though I've had this engine 5 years and it has only just started doing this?
 
Matt Poiner said:
ideal, will have a gander thankyou.

Could this cause this issue even though I've had this engine 5 years and it has only just started doing this?
Click to expand...
Yes and no!
You seem to have done everything else, so the issue could be inj pump related, certainly worth a twiddle and see if anything changes.
Also worth noting just because something is new does not eliminate if from testing/enquiries.
 
lynall said:
Yes and no!
You seem to have done everything else, so the issue could be inj pump related, certainly worth a twiddle and see if anything changes.
Also worth noting just because something is new does not eliminate if from testing/enquiries.
Click to expand...
Yeah I’m gonna have a tinker with it as it’s still smoking more than I’d like.
 
Did this start after you fitted the above list.
I remember fitting a new fuel filter and my engine would lose power, and ran pretty crap.
I then fitted a new (genuine) filter and normal service was returned.
 
Firebobby1 said:
Did this start after you fitted the above list.
I remember fitting a new fuel filter and my engine would lose power, and ran pretty crap.
I then fitted a new (genuine) filter and normal service was returned.
Click to expand...
Not immediately after, probably a month or two, but this month is the first time it’s actually been driven on the road, not sat on the drive without a mot.
 
Matt Poiner said:
previous owner of this engine has definitely messed with the pump, rolled coal like nothing I've ever see before when I put it in mine and got it running.

I read somewhere that the removal of the stop start solenoid and it having swarf on would be a sign that the pump has started to wear, but when i swapped it over this morning it was as clean as a whistle.

if push comes to shove I'll just get it reconditioned, not like it wouldn't benefit from it anyways.
Click to expand...
No swarf in ours at all, ran perfect with no smoke for 9 years until it didn't.
You can buy clear pipe in B&Q to use on a temp basis or clear fuel pipe on Ebay.
 
Anaconda said:
I think you might have answered your own problem. Fuel leaking out will most likely mean air getting in.
Click to expand...
I gave it a start today after some tweaks (no joy) and that area had a slight hiss like it wasn't sealed correctly.
that will be my next job, which I am absolutely not looking forward to
 
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