Calling all p38 m51 owners in fact anyone I need help

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Daryl 86

Member
Posts
18
Location
Preston
Hi I've got a bmw with the m51 engine same as p38 and this is the best place to get advice witch I need lol

Long story short my timing chain has jumped .I've got the timing cover of but there's no timing marks only on the crank pulley sprocket a small dot but nothing on the chain or pump sprocket just another dot but I can't find any information about a dot on the pump sprocket only number 4or6 and mines not got that just a part number. I think I might have one bright link on the chain but I'm not sure it's a 74 link chain my finger is pointing to the crank timing dot
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. I need some help please
 
@Daryl 86 if you post this in the range rover section you will get the help you need Wammers is your man on these engines what he doesn`t know about these engines isn't worth knowing.
 
The bottom sprocket is knackered BMW part number is 11 21 2 243 401. Change it. And the chains whilst you are in there, the chain looks knackered. Lower chain should have two bright links 12 links apart. With engine locked at TDC number one firing. One link is aligned with the pop on the crank sprocket and the other with the pop on the pump sprocket. Some pump sprockets have two pops one marked 4 the other marked 6. Use 6 for your engine. If you only have one pop mark use that. Read RAVE manual for how to determine TDC number one firing. You will need several special tools to do job properly. Turn the engine clockwise ONLY (NEVER turn the engine anticlockwise unless it is a small nudge to get the timing pin in) to get to TDC number one firing and LOCK before you remove anything else. It is a mile away from that in your photo.
 
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Thanks wammers the crank is locked in tdc via the flywheel already and I've ordered the cam locking tool on Friday. So should i use the dot on the pump sprocket then as I have no number 4 of 6 on the pump sprocket? It is 12 external links on the chain that should be bright ? All this from a crank auxiliary belt pulley failing and jamming the belt .The engine has only done 120k
 
Thanks wammers the crank is locked in tdc via the flywheel already and I've ordered the cam locking tool on Friday. So should i use the dot on the pump sprocket then as I have no number 4 of 6 on the pump sprocket? It is 12 external links on the chain that should be bright ? All this from a crank auxiliary belt pulley failing and jamming the belt .The engine has only done 120k

That is nothing like TDC number one firing. It is 180 degrees out. Take off the cam cover and turn engine until number one cam lobes are flat across top and pop on crank sprocket is where it is now. That is TDC number one firing. Just two bright links 12 links apart.
 
Looking at your photo the chain has slipped one link. The pop should be engaged on a raised link as is the one on the pump sprocket not on the link it is on. Also the timing is 180 degrees out not at TDC number one firing. The pop on the pump sprocket should be diametrically opposed to where it is, and be engaged on the twelfth raised link up to the right of where your finger is. Turn the engine clockwise one revolution and lock flywheel, that will be TDC number one firing. Obviously cam position will also be slightly out at this stage. But work from that position.
 
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Sorry wammers I forgot to say the crank is at tdc and locked at the flywheel I've got it all timed up apart from the cam now I think .got to wait for the cam tool to arrive now tho

Am I right now on the timing for crank and Pump?

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Where I have cam so far until the tool arrives
 
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No idea why the pics have gone on in that order .Has this bean moved to the R R section now

No it has not been moved. You will have to PM BB and ask him to move it. You should have hung fire i have the timing tools. Have you changed the chains and crank sprocket? Foolish not to.
 
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No I've not changed them yet just want to get here running again make sure no valves have bent and she runs like she did before. and then take it from there I've found febi chains on eBay for £30 odd each so might go down that route all going well . I order the locking tool before I posted on here but thanks a lot for the offer wammers much appreciated . Should hopefully have the tool today and try and get here going after work
 
No I've not changed them yet just want to get here running again make sure no valves have bent and she runs like she did before. and then take it from there I've found febi chains on eBay for £30 odd each so might go down that route all going well . I order the locking tool before I posted on here but thanks a lot for the offer wammers much appreciated . Should hopefully have the tool today and try and get here going after work

You need to put a 4.5 mm spacer under the manifold side of cam tool to lift it when setting cam if you don't fit new chains. Where abouts in the holy city are you?
 
I'm In Preston bamber bridge

Well good news got here running had to adjust pump timing and she runs just like before well not drivin it yet was to late and a long day lol. I used a small 10mm nut as a spacer was about 5mm in hight taped to the locking tool . Need a new crank aux pulley now tho witch was the cause of the problem. it even snapped the woodruff key on the crank that holds the pulley got a new one today for £1.20 from BMW. Also I managed to do it all without dropping the sump or removing the head witch was nice
 
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I'm In Preston bamber bridge

Well good news got here running had to adjust pump timing and she runs just like before well not drivin it yet was to late and a long day lol. I used a small 10mm nut as a spacer was about 5mm in hight taped to the locking tool . Need a new crank aux pulley now tho witch was the cause of the problem. it even snapped the woodruff key on the crank that holds the pulley got a new one today for £1.20 from BMW. Also I managed to do it all without dropping the sump or removing the head witch was nice

Hope you torqued and angle tightened the crank pulley up correctly. If you didn't you may lose the oil pump. Harmonic balance is bloody expensive new. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CRANKSHAF...372584?hash=item3f735c5ce8:g:OboAAOSwax5Yxm0b
 
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That's cheap that's exactly what I've bean looking for and complete with the pulley
I just done it verry tight with a 2ft broker bar. I'm not driving it yet until I get a complete pulley that you've kindly provided a link for and mine is completely goosed . Also is the a tightening sequence for the 6 smaller bolts on that pulley
 
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That's cheap that's exactly what I've bean looking for and complete with the pulley
I just done it verry tight with a 2ft broker bar. I'm not driving it yet until I get a complete pulley that you've kindly provided a link for and mine is completely goosed . Also is the a tightening sequence for the 6 smaller bolts on that pulley

It needs to be torqued and then angle tightened properly or you will lose the oil pump, as the drive for it is nipped between the crank pulley boss and the crankshaft. Torque damper diagonally to 17 lb ft. Crank pulley boss bolt 74 lb ft then 60 degrees then 60 degrees then 30 degrees. Each flat point to point is 60 degrees, so if you don't have an angle gauge mark the crank boss at a point after 74 lb ft and turn two and a half flats to that mark.
 
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Don't mean to sound like a complete idiot but I don't quite understand I no it's like a stretch bolt and no to over or under tighten it Also I haven't got a gauge for degrees I was just gona do it roughly to 60 degrees but you've got me thinking now tho .
I'll have my new pulley tomorrow morning got it for £83 from genral traffic
 
Don't mean to sound like a complete idiot but I don't quite understand I no it's like a stretch bolt and no to over or under tighten it Also I haven't got a gauge for degrees I was just gona do it roughly to 60 degrees but you've got me thinking now tho .
I'll have my new pulley tomorrow morning got it for £83 from genral traffic

Tighten it to 74 lb ft. Then put a mark in the crank boss at one of the points of the bolt hexagon. Then turn bolt until the next hexagon point meets the mark. That is 60 degrees. Then turn until next point meets the mark. That is 120 degrees. Then turn until the mark is half way along the next flat between the two hexagon points. That is 30 degrees. Total 150 degrees. Job done. You will need a tool to hold the crank pulley boss don't do it against the flywheel locking pin. I have the crank holding tool PM me you can come and pick it up to borrow.
 
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